View Full Version : Checking what VT sugar makers are doing
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ryebrye
04-12-2016, 10:13 PM
Here in Hinesburg it didn't freeze sunday night and so today it was very slow - trickled in. Around 1/2 gallon per tap for 24 hours.
Still clear and still tastes good. I walked the lines today and checked again and no signs of buds. (I have only hard maples)
It's probably going to freeze lightly for a few hours tonight here - might be enough to get some more sap tomorrow
Most people around me have shut down.
I made about 30 gallons that was color of dark robust but flavor of very dark.
rhwells2003
04-13-2016, 07:17 AM
From Monday night to last night I got just a tad under 2gal/tap. Sap was pretty clear, smelled and tasted fine. Didn't taste overly sweet but also didn't taste sour :) 26 degrees at the house this morning so hoping for another good day! I have a feeling with today and the next couple days being sunny things are going to turn bad fast
DrTimPerkins
04-13-2016, 11:12 AM
We dumped some sap, then boiled yesterday and will be soon again today. Sugar content has stabilized at 1.5 Brix in one bush, and 1.7 Brix in the other, and the clarity is pretty good. Making VD/S color with a DR flavor. Had to sweeten the pans again earlier this week, but we made about 120 gal over the past couple of days. Probably another 60+ today when we finish off. That'll put us about 2,460 gal, or 0.57 gal/tap so far. Getting low on barrels! Froze up last night and only thawing slowly now -- but the sun should kick that into high gear soon. Will likely freeze again tonite. I expect we'll be done by Friday or Saturday.
MJPJ Sugars
04-13-2016, 05:19 PM
Wow... wasn't expecting this color on the last boil of the year! A bit more "tangy" than the early season stuff of the same color. A real bummer pulling the taps today -- I wasn't ready -- but like someone said earlier: dry wood and spousal support was running low... (I could've found more wood!!).
Looking forward to a couple up-grades and getting just a little more next year :)
14219
Sap ran well today. Ran into some releaser issues early in the day but got things working. Got about 5500 gallons today so far. Still running 375 GPH but should freeze up by 9:00. My lower woods outran my upper wood for the last few days. Hoping for the breeze to go away tomorrow do the upper woods will run better. Vacuum 27.5 in the whole woods. Never had to reseat a spout this year. Should be a record season for me if we go till weekend.
Spud
DrTimPerkins
04-13-2016, 06:06 PM
Wow... wasn't expecting this color on the last boil of the year! A bit more "tangy" than the early season stuff of the same color.
This phenomenon is not uncommon. It is a great lesson in sap/syrup chemistry for those chemistry nerds out there (you know who you are).
Typically sap color is largely determined by invert sugar level caused by microbial activity. The warmer it is, the more sucrose is converted to invert sugar, resulting in more color and flavor development through Maillard and caramelization processes. Much of the color and flavor development happens during the "alkaline degradation" phase, when boiling sap (which typically is neutral to slightly acidic) rises above pH 7. One characteristic of this phase, besides strong color and flavor development, is niter formation, which eventually pushes the pH back below 7.
So sometimes at the end of the season, there is so much microbial activity that the sap gets very acidic, which is known as "sour sap." When boiled, the pH goes up as normal, but doesn't make it above pH 7, or the time above pH 7 is very short. Because of this, there is little or no alkaline degradation, and very low color and flavor development. You end up with a very light-colored syrup, but it tastes "tangy" due to the low pH (not real good).
Did not run great here today. But I made another 25 gallons. That puts me at 750 so just over .4 gallons / tap. No off flavors yet.
to100
04-13-2016, 10:15 PM
I have 2 gravity lines with 10 tapes each to a 35 gal tank or into 2 5gal buckets with 2 hotel pans arch.
My last boil was March 31th, next day both buckets where almost full in morning but so cloudy I could not see bottom.
I dumped these and got a few gal of clear. Since then not much, yesterday evening 2 full buckets with light cloudiness then 3 gal by dark. My buds are still hard. I was getting niter and sugar sand on bottom of my 4 gal stainless bucket with 2 gal of syrup. My hydrometer said it was syrup, I triple filtered and but into half gal jugs.i weighed these and net weight was 5# and 4 oz I know they should be 5#8oz. My hydrometer was new near the end of last year. My elevation is 1500' and water boils on my Taylor 12" thermometer at 205 so 212 or 100c should be syrup and hydrometer confirms it.
I but syrup in glass also, and never seen mold. Sometimes sugar crystals.
I has tired and would is about out.
Christmas Day I tapped 10 trees into 2gal buckets that I started with 5 years ago. I should have tapped a couple of days earlier but my back was bad. I got over 5 gal before it slowed down. I pulled taps before New Years.
These 10 where still dripping April 1. Today mists where moist with 2 wet down a foot or so.
I could see dripping from my office window about 12 times before I ran my tubing. This was just an experiment not knowing what to expect. I was amazed how long they dripped for.
I had 8 gal syrup more Golden than medium Amber.
rhwells2003
04-14-2016, 06:55 AM
Looked to run good again yesterday for me. Little cloudy but not bad. Probably about 1.2gal/tap yesterday. This has been a great season for me. I sell my sap to a neighbor, so I don't do the boiling part but sap wise I've been happy. This is my first year with high vac. Last year I put 350 taps on a shurflow, and I also had 10 buckets around the house. The buckets produced the same per tap as my tubing on the shurflow. So I was basically gravity last year. This year I purchased a gast 1550, releaser, 600 gallon tank, and built a sap shed, and I couldn't be happier with the results. Last year I ended up with around 2000 gallons. The first weekend of this year I was 3000 haha. I haven't talked to my neighbor to see what I'm up to but I'm thinking I'm up 8000-10000. I told my 7yo daughter if she wanted to keep track of some buckets around the house I'd pay her for the sap, so we put 8 out, and we gather every other day. Her first gather was march 8th, and 7 of those 8 buckets are still producing good sap. Last I checked she was over 100gal on 8 buckets!
I know everything will be done in the next day or two, but its going to be hard for me to see it go. My 9mo pregnant wife might not say the same but that's understandable haha.
DoubleBrookMaple
04-14-2016, 08:07 AM
Sap ran very well here yesterday, and probably will today with the low nighttime temps.
Last night I did my last boil, despite my having pulled some of my taps the other day. I could not stop! watching that sap flowing was to much for me I know Maple Trader thinks I am only an enthusiast, but I am addicted. I enjoy this way to much, and I did enjoy my last day with 10 more gallons of VD, and it was my first ever VD in my fourth year. Boiled and filtered very well. Just a little off flavor, but I have more in 5 gallons cans than I need for personal consumption anyway. I pushed my sweet through the pan with permeate, and soaked overnight for cleaning. Lots more to do, then lots of leisure weekends tending my roadside stand. I need it after 2 1/2 months of sugaring.
Went well over the 150 gallon mark. Not bad for a backyard sugarmaker!
DoubleBrookMaple
04-14-2016, 08:32 AM
Unless the forecast is seriously wrong (if they are predicting temperatures far lower than we actually get), I can pretty well assure you that the trees (maples at least) will NOT break bud next week. Although the forecast is for air temps in the 50s (at least here in North-central VT), it is supposed to be cloudy and rain...which will help to keep things cooler. Maple trees will resist the urge to bud next week because they've been around a good long time and are far better adapted to the climate than we give them credit for.
I am gladly eating my words from early March when it looked like such a warm trend would cut things short this year. Sure am glad I don't bet!
Things rounded out well with cooler than seasonal temps in April, and my average temp here was 5 degrees cooler than last year.
What a great year....
Sap is running 700 GPH here at the border town. Hoping for a great day. Might be able to go till Saturday or Sunday but I think that will be it.
Spud
smokeyamber
04-14-2016, 10:31 AM
Did a test boil last night on the 40 gallons of sap i pulled on Sunday, it has a milky taste,with a bite, definitely headed buddy. I was going to dump it, but we got the idea to go ahead and process it anyway and use it for balsamic,vinegar and maple dressing... vinegar should cover the taste and the strong maple taste is nice in a dressing....
I will pull taps this weekend, reluctantly as my normal stopping point ( NO WOOD ), has not been met :lol:
DrTimPerkins
04-14-2016, 03:35 PM
Sap ran pretty well overnight. Made 75 gal of very nice tasting DR syrup with a distinct caramel taste. We're at 2,515 gal (0.585 gal/tap). We're done tomorrow regardless. We'll boil what comes in overnight and boil out the pans tomorrow. We are all just plumb worn out and nearly out of barrels, so it's a good time to end. Been a good year production-wise and research-wise.
ryebrye
04-14-2016, 03:55 PM
It froze for a few hours last night at my place, but that wasn't enough to get the trees to run very well. I've got vacation plans so I was going to be done tomorrow anyway. Ground might have been too dry, tapholes might be drying up (even CV2's can't run forever). The trees still haven't budded and the sap still doesn't taste sour - but the end is here.
This season was very good for me. My 107 taps yielded 3590 gallons of sap (maybe I should try to squeeze another 10 gallons out to get to an even 3600 ;)) - that's 33.5 gallons of sap per tap on my hybrid 3/16 + vacuum system.
I haul almost all of the sap so I can only estimate a syrup / tap number. I do track sugar content and volume throughout the season in spreadsheet, and if you use the PMRC-recommended formula to calculate the amount of syrup from sap at a given sugar content (the 88.2 / sugar content - 0.32 formula) - the sap I collected could have made up to 87.5 gallons of syrup or up to (up to 0.819 gal / tap) - if I were to process this all myself obviously processing overhead would make the yield lower than that.
Ryebrye that is outstanding production. I hope you have a great vacation and a great summer. I am hoping to go a little longer up here at the border.
Dr. Tim. It looks like you will hit your .6 for the season. I wish I could hit those numbers but my sugar content is to low for a season average. How many GPT of sap did you get?
Spud
Still pretty clear sap here. Not running very hard though. Sugar has dropped to 1.2. Made another 25 today. Dark Robust. Ok flavor.
WestfordSugarworks
04-15-2016, 12:23 AM
Flavor has been good still in all our syrup. Hoping to hit 40 barrels. Super easy boil tonight. lt's like its too easy, besides changing the filter press every 45 minutes. I know that the sap from our big bush had turned a few days ago but i'm not sure if it came back. Our guy is still picking it up though! I think they have taken about 300,000 gallons of sap from that bush, but the sugar content has been so low that I don't think we will do much better than 0.45 gpt. We will see. It's been a huge year it seems, i've heard of a few people doing better than 0.7 gpt. I think we have hit 0.5 gpt at our smaller bush but since we buy some sap i can't be sure without doing some math. That's with brand new tight tubing but a pump that only pulls 23.5 inches. And the mainline has bad slope in some places, even though its brand new :mad:
Sugarmaker's dad
04-15-2016, 09:06 AM
This does seem like the season without an end. Had 11,000 gallons of sap the last couple of days with the vacuum pump turned OFF!!. There must be a very large leak as vacuum dropped to 8, so made the decision to run out the season without vacuum. As of last night we have filed 76 barrels (3.040 gallons). That's a 30% increase over the last two years and close to the production in 2013. It has been a great season, but the end is near!
DrTimPerkins
04-15-2016, 09:28 AM
Dr. Tim. It looks like you will hit your .6 for the season. I wish I could hit those numbers but my sugar content is to low for a season average. How many GPT of sap did you get?
Yes, we'll definitely hit 0.6 gal/tap sometime today before we put the season to bed. Sap ran pretty well overnight (until about 2am), and is starting to run again today (we had a good freeze overnight). Syrup we made yesterday was quite nice....with a strong caramel flavor. I haven't crunched all the numbers yet, but it looks like we're right around 29-30+ gal sap per/tap for most of our woods overall. Our sugar content hasn't been real bad. We dropped down to 1.5 Brix at one point, but that's about the lowest. Most of the time it's been right around 1.8-2.0 Brix (a little lower than normal, but not a lot).
I am going to pull the plug today. It was a very good season for me. I came up short on hitting my .5GPT once again this season. My sugar average for the season was 1.6%. Kids are on vacation this coming week so it's a great time to pull spouts and clean up. My apple trees come next friday and my bees shortly after that. Good luck to all those still running.
Spud
Scribner's Mountain Maple
04-16-2016, 08:01 AM
Sap ran good yesterday once the sun cam out. Collected almost a gpt. I plan to boil today and clean out the evaporator tomorrow. Hoping for another 100 gal of syrup. The syrup has no off flavor that I can detect. This has been a great season for the high hill producers. Certainly my best ever as I may double the production from my previous "best" year. Some of the increase is due to increased efficiency. But most of it I attribute to the weather. It was really perfect up in the hills. Never too hot, and a lot of frozen nights.
Best of luck to anyone still producing.
Ben
DrTimPerkins
04-16-2016, 12:49 PM
We finished boiling incoming sap and then boiling out the pans around 8pm last night. Total of 2,612 gal, 6.75 lbs/tap, or 0.61 gal/tap, which for us is just a little above average. Sap was decent quality right to the end, about 1.6 Brix.
rhwells2003
04-18-2016, 06:47 AM
I pulled the plug Saturday too. Started pulling taps Saturday afternoon. Finished up sunday, and got the tank all cleaned up. Been a good season. I got a little over 20gal/tap this year.
We stopped Saturday also. Emptied back pan into front pan yesterday and ended with 838 gallons for the season.
levasse12
04-18-2016, 08:50 AM
Dr Perkins, when are we going to release the result of this year test? Tapping below the lateral or hybrid vacuum system(3/16 vs 5/16) etc...
DrTimPerkins
04-18-2016, 10:12 AM
Dr Perkins, when are we going to release the result of this year test? Tapping below the lateral or hybrid vacuum system(3/16 vs 5/16) etc...
I'll be speaking at the Leader Evaporator Co. Open House this Friday and Saturday about our two years of "Tapping Below the Lateral" research and about our work with Cornell (Steve Childs) on "Tubing/Spout Cleaning or Replacement?" I'll also be presenting those two talks at Bascom the following weekend. The tapping below the lateral will be presented at the NAMSC meeting in Burlington in October, at LEME in November, and at the VT January Conferences in Jan 2017....and in other places where I'm invited and am able to attend over the summer and fall. It'll likely be published in the "Maple Digest" within about a year.
The 3/16" vs 5/16" on high vacuum will come out a bit later probably. Still have to pull spouts and inspect out in that section of the woods before we can finalize the story on that one.
levasse12
04-18-2016, 01:43 PM
Maybe you could tell us if its similar to last years result or not.(for those who could not come to any open house)
DrTimPerkins
04-18-2016, 06:25 PM
Maybe you could tell us if its similar to last years result or not.(for those who could not come to any open house)
That would just spoil the fun wouldn't it? Seriously though, while we do present it at meetings, if it is a NAMSC sponsored study, we will publish it (put it down in writing) in the Maple Digest first.....not online.
I look forward to reading the results on tapping below the lateral lines. I had asked Dr. Tim about this a few years back and he said they were doing a study on it. This season I tapped over 1000 trees below the lateral lines. Some were 12-16 inches below. I had a record season for GPT this year. My overall production was .4+ for the season but that is great for me and my smaller trees. My sugar average for the season was just 1.5%. Had it been 2% like some sugar makers I would have had a .54 GPT season. I feel I'm doing as well as I can with the trees I have to work with. All 1000+ trees I tapped below the lateral line was with CV2 spouts.
Spud
mainebackswoodssyrup
04-21-2016, 07:26 AM
Good information spud, thanks for sharing. We didn't tap any below this year but I am tempted to try it. We don't use the CV2's, just CDL smartspouts. Hoping I can make it down to Bascom's open house next weekend and get to Dr. Tim's presentations.
maplecherry
04-21-2016, 06:22 PM
2000 taps on laterals set up for tapping with 3' of snow in mind. No snow this year = 75% ? tapped below the lateral. (often the length of the drop). 26 GPT on sap this year and stopped a few days early to go to work. Higher than avg year for sugar content ended up @ .61 GPT on syrup. I am mainly a sap seller and produce just a little syrup. 3rd year on the tubing and battled a leak at the pump house that caused a lot of ice issues this year.
sjdoyon
04-27-2016, 03:07 PM
Received a few private messages on how we did. Well, as of yesterday, still boiling. I had to take an assignment to Miami, FL so the family is handling the operation. NEK received several inches of snow yesterday so sap will prob flow into the weekend. Total numbers will be high but not in Dr. Perkin's territory.
WestfordSugarworks
04-28-2016, 11:25 AM
Good luck, sjdoyon. Let us know when you wrap up.
WestfordSugarworks
04-29-2016, 07:51 AM
Got numbers from the guy who buys our sap from our big sugarbush. Off of 9900 taps he picked up 341,000 gallons of sap which came to be 5791.1 gallons of syrup. 0.585 gal syrup per tap. I'm hoping that bush can do better in a higher sugar content year. I don't have any totals for our Westford bush where we have 2500 taps and buy some sap and boil it ourselves.
rhwells2003
05-09-2016, 06:50 AM
I was paid for this years sap this weekend, and like my season, there were up and downs. Last year I was all gravity, and off of 350 taps I produced 2000 gal, and all season long I was between 2-3%. This year I made the jump to vac, and produced more then 4 times the sap. I ended the year with 8,850 gallons, but my sugar content averaged 1.2%, with the last 3-4 pick-ups at the end of the season only being 0.6%! Needless to say I quadrupled my sap production but only doubled my money. Ouch
That us a ton of sap for 9900 taps. What was you average suge for the season?
Spud
Research has been done showing that sugar content will not drop under very high vacuum. I am convinced that sugar will drop under high vacuum. There are too many sugar makers proving this is the case. My neighbor set up a small woods this season and ran an old dairy pump at just 17 inches. His trees are just feet from mine and of the same size. His sugar average for the season was 2.1% and mine was 1.5% on 27+ inches of vacuum. Are set ups are the same with three taps per lateral line. High vacuum does help to increase production but if you can double or triple your gallons of sap don't expect to do the same with syrup.
Spud
DrTimPerkins
05-10-2016, 07:10 AM
Research has been done showing that sugar content will not drop under very high vacuum. I am convinced that sugar will drop under high vacuum.
Your characterization of the research is not quite correct. The devil is always in the details.
When the sap is running from both trees on vacuum and trees on gravity, sugar content will be roughly the same. After a few days though, the trees on gravity will stop running (= zero sugar), while the trees on vacuum will keep running, and eventually you will reach a time when the bulk flow sap movement is upward (from the soil, through the roots, up the stem and out the taphole). Without a freeze to stimulate the conversion of stored starch to sugar, the sugar in the roots and stem will slowly be diluted and sugar content will drop off. However again....the trees on gravity are producing NO sugar during this phase. Thus the sugar content is going to vary during the season according to the flow regime.
Altogether I guess I'm saying the research isn't wrong, but neither are you. :)
WestfordSugarworks
05-13-2016, 03:26 PM
I think it was 1.5%.
WestfordSugarworks
12-20-2016, 07:46 PM
Figured I would post on here as I'm getting pretty excited for the season. When are you all planning to tap? Maybe i'm the only one excited and nobody is really browsing the Trader yet. We have only a day or two of woods work left before being ready to tap. I'm ready to tap now as long as the weather would remain cold through the first of January, but my dad is not so sure. We have 13K to do this year and I like the idea of tapping with minimal snow, having more time to tap so we don't have to rush or hire a lot of outside help, and being ready for an early or mid January run. I really think it's in our (and maybe most sugarmakers) economic interest to be all tapped in by mid January. Sure it's a headache to deal with all the cold and draining the evaporator for a cold spell, etc, but financially I think it i makes sense. What do you all think? Anyway, we definitely will begin by January 1 or earlier and I'm excited for what the season has in store. Here is a 2008 publication by Tim Wilmot regarind the timing of tapping. http://www.uvm.edu/~pmrc/tapping.pdf I found it very interesting and it certainly challenges the conventional timing of tapping.
I plan to pick up my CV2 spouts next week. My buddy from Alaska will be arriving on the 22nd of January and we will start tapping soon after. He plans to stay until we are all done. Im looking forward to a very productive season with no break downs. Haha. Good luck everyone.
Spud
WestfordSugarworks
01-06-2017, 09:56 PM
Started tapping on the 3rd. Should be done the woods around our house by Sunday and then onto the big bush in Jericho. Looks like I'll be walking lines on Wednesday!
Walling's Maple Syrup
01-07-2017, 06:20 AM
Started tapping on the 3rd. Should be done the woods around our house by Sunday and then onto the big bush in Jericho. Looks like I'll be walking lines on Wednesday! Great! I hope you guys have a great year!
Neil
DrTimPerkins
01-07-2017, 01:10 PM
I plan to pick up my CV2 spouts next week. My buddy from Alaska will be arriving on the 22nd of January and we will start tapping soon after. He plans to stay until we are all done. Im looking forward to a very productive season with no break downs. Haha. Good luck everyone.
Send him over to our place when you're done and he can help our tapping crew. :)
Best of luck to everyone with the 2017 season. See you on the other side.
PARKER MAPLE
01-10-2017, 07:11 PM
Hello fellow Vt maple masters. We have been making a lot of changes around here. Three of us have got together to combine our forces on one focus this year. We have the sugarhouse now just about in order, new to us 3.5 x10' D&G rig, new to us lapierre RO things are going to be fun. Focusing now on the woods work. Starting this weekend in the 1200 tap bush,making repairs and tightening things up. then moving on to the others. We still need to service vac pump and clean releaser. The other bush I will be fixing all damaged lateral runs with 3/16, as there's the perfect slope for this type setup.We will be watching the weather closer towards the end of this month. Not getting to antsy yet, haven't even seen the drill, let alone found the batteries.
Hope you all have a great season.
JBM maple
Parker Maple
It looks like a bunch of rain and warmer weather in the next ten days for my area. I don't think I'm missing out on and sap yet. There is some bare ground spots in the woods and it will not hurt my feelings to have no snow on the ground while tapping. The ground is saturated with water this year. Waiting for my 4-wheeler to get out of the shop and then I will start cutting limbs on lines and tightening up laterals. I have a really good feeling about this season and I hope for big numbers. I just had a series of Steroid injections in my low back so I'm hoping this will allow me to get the job done.
Spud
tcross
01-12-2017, 10:24 AM
I just started putting my sugarhouse back together. used it as a lumber mill/storage as I was building my addition/house this summer. got in the woods yesterday afternoon for a few hours... lots of limbs down. I have a few more hours of work there.
Spud, if your steroid injections worked as well as mine did you'll be back to normal soon. I had to do two sessions because I had 2 discs that were totally herniated. it worked well the first time but was still struggling. a week after the second one, I was back to 100%. good luck with it! one hard thing I learned from it was to not keep on doing things with the same muscles every time... like swing the axe with the left hand dominate, then the next with the right! having a bad back is not fun at all!
WestfordSugarworks
01-12-2017, 04:49 PM
We got tapped in at our home bush (3k taps) in time for the run that started yesterday morning. So far have pulled about 5000 gallons of sap that averages 1.2 brix. Don't have the RO ready to go to concentrate and running out of storage so we had to call someone to come buy a truckload of sap. We still will be sitting on full tanks until early next week when we'll get the RO going and concentrate, collect more and boil. Pretty excited to be tapped and pulling high vac.
I just started putting my sugarhouse back together. used it as a lumber mill/storage as I was building my addition/house this summer. got in the woods yesterday afternoon for a few hours... lots of limbs down. I have a few more hours of work there.
Spud, if your steroid injections worked as well as mine did you'll be back to normal soon. I had to do two sessions because I had 2 discs that were totally herniated. it worked well the first time but was still struggling. a week after the second one, I was back to 100%. good luck with it! one hard thing I learned from it was to not keep on doing things with the same muscles every time... like swing the axe with the left hand dominate, then the next with the right! having a bad back is not fun at all!
tcross thanks for the info. I will be going back for round two in 4 weeks. I hope my injections help as much as yours did. I have already had two disks taking out and had a double fusion surgery. The disk above the fusion is almost gone now. If I was a horse they would have shot me by now. Best of luck in the 2017 season.
We have a few people in town making syrup now. One neighbor made 8 barrels yesterday. It looks like those who are tapped in will be getting lots of sap by the end of next week. Unfortunately I will miss out on this warm spell but hope to be up and running by the end of the month when everything goes back into deep freeze.:lol: Westfordsugarworks I think your in for a ton of sap in the next ten day. Your numbers last year were very impressive and I look forward to seeing how you do this year. Best of luck to you and all Traders this season.
Spud
WestfordSugarworks
01-13-2017, 07:59 PM
Spud, good luck with your back. It must be really hard having all the sugarwoods to manage but having constant pain when trying to get things done. Yeah, looks like we will have a lot of sap. We weren't anticipating so much these last couple days so we didn't get the RO out of it's winter storage, but we should have. I'm really optimistic that our Westford bush will have high numbers and we should do ok in Jericho too, especially if we can get a bunch of trees drilled before Tuesday. Good luck to all!
smokeyamber
01-16-2017, 08:48 AM
So from the forecast this week is looking awfully sugaring season here in Central VT, anyone tapping in this early on buckets ? I am debating it, but not sure if the taps I do now will last the entire season into April... Thoughts ? Thinking of tapping some reds as I think they will run sooner ?
So not ready on the arch/shack... but I never am :o
GeneralStark
01-17-2017, 07:16 AM
This year I'm joining the ranks of the early tappers. Started yesterday after spending a bunch of time this fall improving some areas where I had more taps/lateral than is ideal, and after changing out many drops. I had quite a bit of blowdown this year and some other major repairs to do as well. I'm hoping to take advantage of the lack of snow and warm days over the next week to get a bunch tapped. Still have a bunch of drops to replace but I think I can meet my goal of being 100% tapped and ready in the woods by the time we start getting consistent sap.
Not much to do in the sugarhouse to get ready except for a minor ceramic blanket repair in the arch, and rinse the ro. Hoping for no major equipment issues.....
General I think you are making a wise choice. I think your going to be making syrup by the end of the week. The 10 forecast in my area has dropped a bit and there may not be a bunch of syrup made in the next 2 weeks but in your area i think it's going to be good. Please keep us posted as to how many gallons you make.
Spud
GeneralStark
01-20-2017, 07:11 AM
Sap has been running a little bit on gravity....just rinsing lines at this point. Hoping to hit 400 taps in today and then turning on the vac. pump. Forecast for next week is trending colder so not sure how much syrup will be made but I'll take it.
GeneralStark
01-22-2017, 08:38 PM
I went to turn on the vac. pump on Friday evening after getting over 400 taps in last week and the pump was siezed. It has stuck in the past due to mineral scale build up (liquid ring pump with water for cooling), but never this bad. Spoke to a CDL tech and today had a chance to take it apart and get the impeller moving. No big deal and now it is pulling 27" after fixing a few leaks. Sap is running a bit....but nothing too impressive. Not sure what this week will bring but I'll leave the pump on until it freezes up again.
wsugar
01-23-2017, 05:42 AM
I went to turn on the vac. pump on Friday evening after getting over 400 taps in last week and the pump was siezed. It has stuck in the past due to mineral scale build up (liquid ring pump with water for cooling), but never this bad. Spoke to a CDL tech and today had a chance to take it apart and get the impeller moving. No big deal and now it is pulling 27" after fixing a few leaks. Sap is running a bit....but nothing too impressive. Not sure what this week will bring but I'll leave the pump on until it freezes up again.
I put glycol in my water cooled pump to store it. That was what Cdl told me to do. Haven't had a problem with it seized up. Maybe this will help
PARKER MAPLE
01-23-2017, 06:17 PM
I got a feeling cold weather is coming again, long range looked cold for a few weeks. Hope there wrong like it usually is.
WestfordSugarworks
01-24-2017, 05:37 PM
about 1000 taps away from being all done tapping. Will be happy to have a few weeks of cold to fix the long list of things that we've noticed while tapping and just relax for a few days. We've been pretty much flat out. So grateful for people that come to help us. Made 60 gallons on Sunday and the guy we sell our sap to hauled away about 17,000 gals of sap from our big bush. Good luck to all.
DrTimPerkins
01-25-2017, 07:40 AM
Starting tapping now at the UVM Proctor Maple Research Center in Underhill Ctr., Vermont. A crew of 2 tappers, sometimes with a support person walking ahead clearing lines. Good going....not much snow on the ground. Hopefully we can have it done before we get much snow. Should have it done with a few weeks.
Line and chainsaw work for about a month before this.
Should have about 5,000 taps this year.
Lots of work left to do to get the sugarhouse put together....more to update on that later.
Running chainsaw in the woods now trying to clean things up. I have about 1100 tapped so far. Hoping to be done mid to end of next week. Looks like a cold front is coming our way. Good luck everyone.
Spud
sapmaple
01-26-2017, 07:37 AM
I've been replacing a section of woods that had the oldest tubing and re designing the layout hope to be done soon and start tapping the first weekend in Feb.
though it sure seemed I should be tapping in Jan. but I think it will be relatively cold the next few weeks so should be OK.
I've been fighting a stomach bug and nasty cold all the same time sure hope to be back to par soon Looking forward to the season as we all are!
GeneralStark
01-26-2017, 06:02 PM
I put glycol in my water cooled pump to store it. That was what Cdl told me to do. Haven't had a problem with it seized up. Maybe this will help
Funny, to me they suggested adding oil for the summer or running it periodically which I have been doing. Glycol would be easy though. Thanks for the tip!
GeneralStark
01-26-2017, 06:05 PM
Washing and rinsing ro now to be ready to boil tomorrow. Since Sunday afternoon when I closed the valve on the bulk tank I have pulled in about 800 gallons from 400 taps, 3/4 of that since some time overnight. Temp. went over 40 today and it is still running pretty well. Sugar at about 1.8 so not bad for January
wsugar
01-27-2017, 02:04 PM
We've made 170 gal so far. First year ever I have tapped in January. Sap is running today plan on boiling tomorrow. Looks like I have a little time to do some tuning in the woods. The new evaporator is working great.
GeneralStark
01-28-2017, 07:28 AM
This is my first time tapping in January but I'm thinking it won't be the last. Kind of like a dress rehearsal for the real thing...
We did not have a solid freeze here thursday night so I awoke to 1000 gal. of sap. I have 1100 of bulk storage capacity so I fired up the ro and squeezed that and what came in yesterday until about 2pm down to about 200 gal. The sugar content over the last week ranged from a low of 1.6 to a high of 1.8. Filled the evap. and boiled for about 2 hours and sweetened pans and made over 10 gallons. I haven't filtered or graded yet but looks GD to AR range with decent flavor. A little bit of a "tang" which I suspect is from the tubing...
Things froze up last night and it looks like winter is back for a bit. Going to finish up changing drops and tapping to be ready for the next warm-up.
On a related note, I found a couple smart spouts that were defective and leaking. I didn't notice it while tapping but then they were manufactured, the mold did not completely fill so it left a void in the drop connector. In both spouts I found leaking around at the drop, the leak was due to an inadequate seal. If you are using CDL smart spouts, something to keep an eye out for.
sugartree310
01-28-2017, 09:11 PM
We finished tapping yesterday , Started two weeks ago and have collected a bunch of sap as we tapped , Ran the RO a couple times also , Sap ran good that last couple of days here and also got a little bonus run this afternoon . we will boil tomorrow first time in January for us .
GeneralStark
01-30-2017, 10:46 AM
Surprise runs this weekend and pulled in over 1 gpt sat. and sun. It's amazing what vac. tubing can do at 33F. Not enough to fire up so will let it freeze in the tanks until the next warm-up.
WestfordSugarworks
01-30-2017, 05:27 PM
Finished tapping Friday and working on the list of odds and ends that need to be fixed this week. Thankful for the cold spell cause i'm going to Florida with my girlfriend from Thursday until the following Tuesday. The weather has worked out near perfect for us so far this year. Good luck to everyone. General Stark, hopefully that smart spout problem is not widespread or else there will be a lot of sugarmakers upset this year.
MJPJ Sugars
01-31-2017, 10:12 AM
Got numbers from the guy who buys our sap from our big sugarbush. Off of 9900 taps he picked up 341,000 gallons of sap which came to be 5791.1 gallons of syrup. 0.585 gal syrup per tap. I'm hoping that bush can do better in a higher sugar content year. I don't have any totals for our Westford bush where we have 2500 taps and buy some sap and boil it ourselves.
Hi!
Is there a general/average/ballpark price anyone can share for selling sap?
Thanks!!
JQ
Hi!
Is there a general/average/ballpark price anyone can share for selling sap?
Thanks!!
JQ
Really too many variables to answer that. Location, volume, who is trucking.
billyinvt
01-31-2017, 12:39 PM
Gotta say I've never been so happy to see 0 degrees as I was this morning. Long term forecast shows cold for the next couple weeks at least.
I am almost done tapping. Looks like nothing but cold weather for a while. I would be just fine with my season starting mid March.
Spud
DrTimPerkins
01-31-2017, 03:42 PM
I am almost done tapping. Looks like nothing but cold weather for a while. I would be just fine with my season starting mid March.
We're still tapping on the hill here. I'd be good with your timeline though.....lots to do in the sugarhouse to be ready for the season.
WestfordSugarworks
01-31-2017, 03:53 PM
Hi!
Is there a general/average/ballpark price anyone can share for selling sap?
Thanks!!
JQ
The most common system in our area is payment based on a determined percentage of the bulk value of the syrup produced from that sap. Sap sellers are usually paid somewhere between 60-65% of the bulk value of the syrup that the buyer boils down from their sap. That is how everyone I know does business around here but i'm sure there are different ways people go about it. Every time our buyer picks up he records the sugar content and volume of sap and then we get a check at the end of the year based on how much syrup our sap was turned into.
MJPJ Sugars
02-01-2017, 06:34 AM
The most common system in our area is payment based on a determined percentage of the bulk value of the syrup produced from that sap. Sap sellers are usually paid somewhere between 60-65% of the bulk value of the syrup that the buyer boils down from their sap. That is how everyone I know does business around here but i'm sure there are different ways people go about it. Every time our buyer picks up he records the sugar content and volume of sap and then we get a check at the end of the year based on how much syrup our sap was turned into.
Thanks!! Found a (relatively) simple explanation of the formula -- makes sense. Thanks! -- JQ
https://www.uvm.edu/~pmrc/wilmot_pricing.pdf
WestfordSugarworks
02-05-2017, 06:51 PM
Thanks!! Found a (relatively) simple explanation of the formula -- makes sense. Thanks! -- JQ
https://www.uvm.edu/~pmrc/wilmot_pricing.pdf
No problem. My advice is don't let anyone pay you less than what you can get for your sap. You should be able to clear 62% of bulk in your area and don't let anyone try to convince you to accept less. You can probably get 65% including their trucking if you ask around. Maybe not though, with the bulk price expected to be lower this year from what I hear. Who knows. Margins might be getting thin for some people.
Russ008
02-07-2017, 04:57 AM
Terrible accident in Vermont, Interstate 91 north at exit 27 in @NewportVT (https://twitter.com/NewportVT) has been closed due to a #Maplesyrup (https://twitter.com/hashtag/Maplesyrup?src=hash) spill. Fire dept is on-scene working on clean up.https://twitter.com/VTStatePolice/status/828715858499424256
DrTimPerkins
02-07-2017, 07:20 AM
Some of the comments after the announcement were pretty good.
tcross
02-07-2017, 07:28 AM
1 barrel spilled. some of the comments are funny... many cliché!
rfogg
02-14-2017, 08:04 AM
Looking for advice. This is my second year, last year I had put out 10 taps originally in Feb on buckets and by mid march they dried up and I had to tap 5 more. This year I am looking to do about 60 taps on 3/16 gravity vacuum. I really want to tap because with the weather coming next week I should get some sap but I don't want to tap to early and have my taps dry up. I was wondering what people with experience think.
smokeyamber
02-14-2017, 08:31 AM
On tapping early on buckets... I have tapped as early as January and had the trees run well into April, but they definitely do slow down with time and some will stop running before the season is over. If you have only a few trees I would wait until it starts running and then tap in. I do this now myself. I have a couple of trees that run early and I tap them when it looks like it will run that week, when they start I tap in the rest of the trees. Can make for a frantic day with my 70 taps, but it maximizes output. I will already have storage setup and my dump stations are cleaned and ready before the first tap. I also have some "extra" trees that I can move taps to as trees stop running. You can also tap a second time on one tree if they are large enough to do so... do one early and one later in the season.
I will likely tap in the test trees next week, though I think the trees will take a bit more time to startup now that we have snow I am always fully tapped in by Town meeting day regardless of weather since that gives two months max of sap. If it's running in May I am likely already out of wood :o.
Have fun cause its almost time :lol:
rfogg
02-15-2017, 02:02 PM
Thanks for the info smokey. Maybe I will just tap the trees Saturday and see when it starts to run. Then I can do the rest like you said. Thanks again.
Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk
rfogg
02-15-2017, 02:03 PM
Thanks for the info smokey. Maybe I will just tap two trees Saturday and see when it starts to run. Then I can do the rest like you said. Thanks again.
Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk
Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk
PARKER MAPLE
02-15-2017, 06:34 PM
Battery's on charge and drills are ready for Saturday
Here we go!!
Saturday is going to be 42 and sun. Might see a little sap. I'm buried under two feet of snow so I sure hope there is no lines to be fixed. We may even get some sap on Sunday. Lets hope a bunch of this snow melts fast.
Spud
pen61guin
02-18-2017, 10:56 AM
Hello all - I hung 5 buckets this morning here in Peru VT. Just a very slow drip in a couple of them. The forecast calls for several more days in the 40s this week. Shouldn't we expect a run? Maybe we haven't had enough nights below zero (I read somewhere that the sap doesn't flow unless and until there have been 100 nights below zero....)
I will put up the rest of my buckets (45) tomorrow and Monday, I think.
DrTimPerkins
02-18-2017, 11:48 AM
Maybe we haven't had enough nights below zero (I read somewhere that the sap doesn't flow unless and until there have been 100 nights below zero....)
I think it must have meant below freezing. Being below zero (0 deg F) isn't important.
More likely the slow start of sap is because tree stem temperature lags quite a bit behind air temperature. While the branches might thaw out some, if the trunk isn't thawed out, the sap won't run. We've had some really cold nights....takes a bit of time to thaw out those big stems once they are solidly frozen. In addition, the deep snow keeps the temperature down around the base of the tree. Give it some time....when it finally thaws, there will be a gusher.
sugaringcrazy
02-18-2017, 12:51 PM
Dr. Tim and everybody else for that matter, do you think it will let loose next week? I'm currently out of town until late next week (but in theory could come back sooner), but luckily ready to go, but wasnt planning on being tapped out until march 1. Do you think I will miss a ton? I'm in Central VT, and the snow is deep there, but it looks to get pretty warm next week:/
DrTimPerkins
02-18-2017, 12:57 PM
...do you think it will let loose next week?
Based on the forecast it would appear that much of Vermont could get a good sap run next week, but you never know for sure.
As for how much you might lose....if you provide me with a detailed forecast for the next month (which nobody really can....despite what Accuweather seems to think) then perhaps I'd be able to tell you. Could be a little, could be a lot.
pen61guin
02-18-2017, 02:17 PM
Thank you Dr. Tim! (Are you like the Dr. Phil for maple addicts? :D )
Yes, you're quite right - it's 100 nights below freezing, not 100 nights below zero. I could pretend that I meant zero Celsius, but that would be an alternative fact
Looking forward to a run this week - as you say, the big stems take a while to thaw out, so maybe we'll get something going by Tuesday or Wednesday
DrTimPerkins
02-19-2017, 09:20 AM
Thank you Dr. Tim! (Are you like the Dr. Phil for maple addicts? :D )
Wow....I hope not. Not a real fan of Dr. Phil.
Yes, you're quite right - it's 100 nights below freezing, not 100 nights below zero. I could pretend that I meant zero Celsius, but that would be an alternative fact.
I think what you are referring to is the chilling requirement to break bud dormancy. Different northern tree species have different cold temperature requirements necessary to break down growth inhibition compounds to allow the buds to become active. Sap flow in maple is a very different biophysical process. It will happen any time the leaves are off and the temperatures go from below to above freezing.
Sunday Rock Maple
02-19-2017, 11:07 PM
Wow....I hope not. Not a real fan of Dr Phil.
Closer to Gandalf I'd say........
tcross
02-20-2017, 06:03 AM
had a fairly decent run this weekend considering there is 3-4 feet of snow around the trees! we tapped Saturday a.m and by the time we were done the trees were dripping. between Saturday and yesterday we were able to flush the lines and clean the tanks. I shut the valve on the tanks yesterday at 10 a.m and we were able to gather 125 gallons from my 200 taps between then 7:30 last night. sugar is low... 1.6. if the forecast comes true this week, we'll be making syrup by the end of the week!
Sugaring has started for me. I got 1.5 GPT in the last day and a half. I am running terrible vacuum right now at just 20 inches. It appears me and my friend missed several drops during tapping. Going to head up in the woods and try to get them today and tomorrow. Snow is still very deep making it hard for me to get around. Should see big sap this week. Sugar levels seem to be a bit higher this year for me. I have a funny feeling sugaring will be over by the end of March in my area. Time will tell. Good luck everyone.
Spud
DrTimPerkins
02-20-2017, 07:22 AM
Closer to Gandalf I'd say........
I'll take that :cool:. You should have seen me during my recovery. Didn't shave or cut my hair for a couple of months (I did shower though :D). My nieces and nephews started calling me Santa. Finally trimmed the beard and got my hair cut a week or so ago.
smokeyamber
02-20-2017, 09:51 AM
Tapped in on Sat and every tree was running ! Collected last night and got around 30 gallons on 60 taps. Looking like this will be THE week for me ! Time to get the evap setup ... yikes :o
billyinvt
02-20-2017, 12:52 PM
I decided the weather was too much for me to wait it out so I tapped one big set of trees that is about half red maples. I kept another set of trees untapped as a sort if insurance plan just in case winter sets back in for a few weeks. Looks like we'll be boiling by mid-week for sure.
steve J
02-20-2017, 01:39 PM
I am going to tap Wed. afternoon and Thursday. I was worried I might not be able to because of my knees and the deep snow. But we lost so much snow I can probably tap without snow shoes and my knees should be able to handle that.
I was able to get 1500 gallons of sap today from my S/E facing trees. I was not expecting anything today. I think I have my vacuum issues fixed. Once the lines all thaw out I will know for sure.
Spud
rhwells2003
02-21-2017, 06:57 AM
Tapped my trees Saturday morning (450 taps or so this year). Sap started coming in around 10am. Turned the vac on and dumped sap till 5pm. Things looked good and clean so I started collecting. From Saturday 5pm to sunday around midnight we got 700 gallons. 1.5gal/tap for the first run, I'm happy with that. I'll be running home at lunch today and turning the vac on. By the looks of the upcoming weather it wont be shutting off for a week or so. I need to get out the in the woods, think I have a few leaks. I'm a couple inches down on vac then what I ran last year. Should've done that yesterday with the day off and the kids in school. But the wife said "No kids, we should go ice fishing" How do you say no to that! haha
billyinvt
02-21-2017, 08:04 AM
Not sure what sources you guys use for weather, but I like Roger Hill on WDEV because he mentions sap in his forecasts, and he has a web page too.
https://weatheringheights1.wordpress.com/
smokeyamber
02-21-2017, 10:17 AM
Roger Hill is the guy.. he called it !
GeneralStark
02-21-2017, 06:40 PM
All tapped and sap has been running well today. Also ran well yesterday for several hours in the afternoon despite 33 degrees....all about the sun. Have lost track of how much sap I have collected since saturday as I ran the RO twice since then. Also have so much ice in tanks from Jan. and Feb. sap....hoping that will all thaw this week. Will likely boil tomorrow as I have little tank space left and I have a couple days off.
I was able to get a half gallon of sap per tap in the last 24 hours. Should pick up today but there is no freezing nights for three days. Every time I check the weather they change it. I still cannot get in the woods with my 4-wheeler due to tons of snow. Hoping a bunch melts by weekend so I can fix some leaks. I find it interesting that my sugar content is now 2.4% now that my vacuum is only running 22 inches. All other years my vacuum would be 27 inches but my sugar would only be 1.5-1.8. Am I better off keeping lower vacuum. I know Dr. Tim has said higher vacuum will not bring the sugar down. My neighbor that borders my woods runs a dairy pump at just 18 inches and he gets 2.5+ most all season. My woods butts up to his with the same size trees all facing the S/E and his sugar was always much higher than mine until this year. The only thing I can think of is now that my vacuum is down to about the same as the neighbors it caused my sugar to go up. Is super high vacuum really the way to go? Scratching my head.
Spud
Spud, it may be more that sugar content seems to be higher this year in general. I know mine is higher and have heard from others that they are seeing the same thing. I suspect that if you can get the vacuum up higher you will see more overall total amount sugar harvested for the season.
WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER
02-22-2017, 06:38 AM
Spud,
I have a customer that is 72 and has been making syrup for many years and he says when he cranks vacuum up way above 22 his sugar plummets and has every time he has tried it. Says he gets a lot higher sugar at 22 and the increase in sap above 22 doesn't pay off in the loss of sugar. He's a very intelligent guy and I'll going to not give my opinion on this.
I was able to get a half gallon of sap per tap in the last 24 hours. Should pick up today but there is no freezing nights for three days. Every time I check the weather they change it. I still cannot get in the woods with my 4-wheeler due to tons of snow. Hoping a bunch melts by weekend so I can fix some leaks. I find it interesting that my sugar content is now 2.4% now that my vacuum is only running 22 inches. All other years my vacuum would be 27 inches but my sugar would only be 1.5-1.8. Am I better off keeping lower vacuum. I know Dr. Tim has said higher vacuum will not bring the sugar down. My neighbor that borders my woods runs a dairy pump at just 18 inches and he gets 2.5+ most all season. My woods butts up to his with the same size trees all facing the S/E and his sugar was always much higher than mine until this year. The only thing I can think of is now that my vacuum is down to about the same as the neighbors it caused my sugar to go up. Is super high vacuum really the way to go? Scratching my head.
Spud
GeneralStark
02-22-2017, 08:05 AM
I'm interested to hear Dr. Tim's thoughts but my understanding is that it is pretty well established that vacuum does result in lower sugar content sap. I assume Spud, that you are thinking what you are seeing may impact your sugar yields overall? In which case, my understanding is that the higher the vac., the higher the yields of overall sugar. As harvesters of sugar, the more sugar the better, right?
It is also my understanding that high sugar early season sap sugar content can be anomalous as sap is not conducting throughout the tree's stem and root system, unless it has completely thawed or there was never frost on the ground (likely the case for southern producers.).
Spud - Has your neighbor thinned his woods?
I'm interested to hear Dr. Tim's thoughts but my understanding is that it is pretty well established that vacuum does result in lower sugar content sap. I assume Spud, that you are thinking what you are seeing may impact your sugar yields overall? In which case, my understanding is that the higher the vac., the higher the yields of overall sugar. As harvesters of sugar, the more sugar the better, right?
It is also my understanding that high sugar early season sap sugar content can be anomalous as sap is not conducting throughout the tree's stem and root system, unless it has completely thawed or there was never frost on the ground (likely the case for southern producers.).
Spud - Has your neighbor thinned his woods?
My neighbors woods is has not been thinned in many years. His trees and crowns are the same as mine. Dr.Tim has said in the past that higher vacuum will give you more sugar overall at the end of the season. Although last year I got 25 GPT with a 1.7% average and my neighbor got 25 GPT with a 2.3% average. My vacuum was running almost 10 inches higher then his all last season. I'm in no position to be questioning Dr. Tim and his research but something seems odd here. All my lines are thawed right now and just 20 minutes ago I was getting 2.4% out of the releaser. West Verginas friend is not the only person saying this. Thanks everyone for replying.
Spud
DrTimPerkins
02-22-2017, 10:36 AM
The only research available (http://www.uvm.edu/~pmrc/vacsap.pdf) has shown that there is no trend of decreasing sugar content with increasing vacuum level....at least up to 25" Hg. There really isn't a whole lot of possible physiological reason for there to be a difference. I could see this being a possibility during a long extended thaw, but for any single, relatively normal sap run, there shouldn't be any significant difference.
15609
DrTimPerkins
02-22-2017, 10:47 AM
Although last year I got 25 GPT with a 1.7% average and my neighbor got 25 GPT with a 2.3% average.
If he got the same yield as you did with 10" Hg vacuum less, then there is some other difference accounting for the yield and sugar content you are observing. Very small differences in tree size (mostly volume) can result in fairly strong differences in sap or syrup yield. For every 1" in stem diameter increase, trees will produce roughly 0.5 lbs syrup more (on high vacuum with good sanitation). That is why we randomize our treatments and use replication in doing our experiments. It is also why I don't pay a lot of attention to producers saying they compared two spouts in two different sections of their woods and got different results. It would be very surprising if they didn't see different results....the statistical degree of freedom in that comparison is 1 (the lowest you can have).
WestfordSugarworks
02-22-2017, 11:08 AM
Every scientific publication or presentation that i've heard from scientists or producers says that higher vacuum is better for total yield. I think a lot of the 'well I got this yield with this setup this year' type of stories are only so helpful, just like Dr. Tim is saying. Small variations between producers makes using other people's experiences as the basis for your decisions not the best idea sometimes. We try to use scientifically researched methods when tapping, installing tubing, storing sap, boiling etc. as most producers do and I think this is a good route to take, although sometimes science turns out to be wrong about something. I don't personally know anything more about vac. level vs. yield than what is available in local seminars and on websites like PMRC's website. But until we understand otherwise we'll try to have vacuum at 28.4" which is what we sat at for most of last year.
Buffalo Creek Sugar Camp
02-23-2017, 05:45 AM
If he got the same yield as you did with 10" Hg vacuum less, then there is some other difference accounting for the yield and sugar content you are observing. Very small differences in tree size (mostly volume) can result in fairly strong differences in sap or syrup yield. For every 1" in stem diameter increase, trees will produce roughly 0.5 lbs syrup more (on high vacuum with good sanitation). That is why we randomize our treatments and use replication in doing our experiments. It is also why I don't pay a lot of attention to producers saying they compared two spouts in two different sections of their woods and got different results. It would be very surprising if they didn't see different results....the statistical degree of freedom in that comparison is 1 (the lowest you can have).
Dr. Perkins- Have you completed studies that show the increase in syrup yield in relation to tree diameter? Surely there has to be a small range that this holds true. Would this mean that an 18" tree would yield 5 lbs more syrup then an 8" tree with high vacuum and good sanitation?
Vtmbz
02-23-2017, 07:06 AM
Lowell Vt.: Tapped yday and have sap to boil. Leaving aside the spring of 2012, this is about a week earlier than my average early sap run. we usually expect to be boiling on Easter here, but I wonder if that holds true this year.
DrTimPerkins
02-23-2017, 07:25 AM
Small variations between producers makes using other people's experiences as the basis for your decisions not the best idea sometimes.
Yes, that is exactly what I was trying to say. Producers can definitely do their own comparisons, but when 1" vacuum difference in two different sections makes a 5-75 difference in yield, or 1" dbh difference in trees makes a 0.5 lb difference in syrup produced, it still takes controlled studies with replication over a few years to tease out the real differences.
Don't misunderstand....scientists certainly can and do go down the wrong path sometime, but more than often it is because of something that is very unusual or unknown. Even more commonly, people (including scientists) try to take the results of one study and apply it to everything.
DrTimPerkins
02-23-2017, 07:40 AM
Dr. Perkins- Have you completed studies that show the increase in syrup yield in relation to tree diameter? Surely there has to be a small range that this holds true. Would this mean that an 18" tree would yield 5 lbs more syrup then an 8" tree with high vacuum and good sanitation?
What is somebody from PA doing on the Vermont thread? :D
Yes, we do have data and we are investigating this relationship further. Keep in mind that that what I said was a rough approximation. I'm not going to go into a lot of detail here because it is a study that is ongoing, but you would be surprised how little sap a tree 8" in diameter produces in relation to a tree that is 18" in diameter. The strength of the relationship between diameter and yield is VERY high (correlation of better than 70%).
Going back to the simplified "pipe" model of a tree.....the amount of liquid in a pipe doesn't double as the diameter of the pipe double....it goes up MUCH faster than that. This is why thinning trees to encourage strong growth of the remaining crop trees is so important in producing good yields. Bigger trees produce more sap (and are able to compensate for wounding better).
We will talk about this subject more later on....perhaps as early as the end of this current season, but the study is largely to look at the economy of tapping different sized trees and where the line should be drawn (tapping guidelines) in relation to tree size, wounding, yield, and economics of production.
GeneralStark
02-23-2017, 08:26 AM
Good stuff Dr. Tim. Sounds like a very interesting study. Good forest management certainly is the key to higher yields and I'm sure the high yields that PMRC achieves and that we all strive for are related to good forest management. Just hooking a maple tree up to a vacuum tubing system doesn't mean it will produce well.
Made over 30 gallons of syrup yesterday from sap collected over the weekend, and from the ice that is slowly thawing from Jan. and early Feb. The first 10 gallons or so were dark and strong flavor, likely due to the sap sitting in the pans since last boil in late Jan. But it quickly lightened up and we got almost to GD for the last 10 or so. Going to clean the front pans today and get ready to boil again tomorrow. Sap has been running ok and sugar is now up to 2%.
Beyondsuspension
02-23-2017, 10:42 AM
Started tapping Saturday after seeing the forecast for this week. I finished all my pipeline yesterday with the help of my Wife and my Brother. (600ish) Turned on the vacuum pump around 3:00pm yesterday, collected about a 100 gallons in two hours to clean the lines and tanks. Dumped that and left the pump running all night, I had 130 gallons this morning when I headed to work. I checked the vacuum and it was way down 12.5" I usually can pull 16" or 17" I must have a lot of leaks. Needless to say I have some work to do and I still have about 50 buckets to hang this weekend. The full time job is getting in the way of the full time hobby. :cool:
billyinvt
02-23-2017, 11:24 AM
Unexpectedly got down to 28 last night and stayed there for a good ten hours. I suspect it's running nicely today.
Thank you Dr. Tim for a bunch of helpful information. Clearly there must be differences in my woods and my neighbors woods. Although the trees all look to be about the same size it sounds like even a slight difference can result in higher sap/sugar yield. After fighting with back issues for several days I was able to go check my lines today to see why my vacuum was so low. Way in the back corner (where the snow is the deepest) I/we missed about 50 spouts on a short mainline. I cannot believe I'm the first to make this mistake (haha). I'm running 26 inches now so there still is some smaller micro leaks somewhere but I'm not going to worry about it now. My sap is still testing 2.3% today so I am very happy with that. I ordered my CV2 spouts months before the season started and they came in the day after I finished tapping. We did not want to wait any longer. I'm using clear smart spouts this year in my woods. 5000 of the trees have 6 year old drops so I know i'm going to pay the price for this. My free help flew in from Alaska so we had to tap when we did.
Spud
Buffalo Creek Sugar Camp
02-24-2017, 07:18 AM
What is somebody from PA doing on the Vermont thread? :D
Dr. Tim- since you wouldn't let me stop in last April during my trip to Vermont, I have to "creep" on this Vermont thread to learn what I can. LOL. I enjoy reading this thread, it is very informative. Its also interesting to see the differences between sugaring in VT versus sugaring in PA. I hear a lot about 2% plus sap, and we have been stuck at .7%-1.5% all season.
rhwells2003
02-24-2017, 07:53 AM
Woke up this morning and the thermometer said 34. Gassed the pump up for the day and went and checked the releaser and to my surprise nothing was running and the releaser was froze up! Must have dipped below freezing at some point. Hopefully recharge the trees a little for the next couple days.
DrTimPerkins
02-24-2017, 07:58 AM
I ordered my CV2 spouts months before the season started and they came in the day after I finished tapping.
We were likewise too far along with tapping to switch horses (to the CV3, clear CV adapter) mid-stream. We do have at least one smaller section with them this year though....just not as many out there in our woods as I would have liked.
tcross
02-24-2017, 08:27 AM
had a late night boil last night. got in around 2 a.m this morning and it was 38 degrees out. woke up at 5 to go to work and to my surprise it was 30 out... quick temp drop! it was still only 32 at 8:15 so hopefully that'll recharge the trees some! the sap is coming in pretty decently at the moment (36 degrees)... hopefully it'll keep on going through tomorrow!
GeneralStark
02-24-2017, 08:39 PM
Made another 25 gal. of AR tonight. All systems go here. Still have some ice in the tanks which should be helpful tomorrow if it does indeed hit the 60s. The trees are still not running very well unless the sun comes out. Started to run well this morning and then it clouded over and it slowed way down. Lots of frost in the ground still but we lost all our snow yesterday.
VTfarmboy
02-25-2017, 11:31 AM
reminding me of 2013, snow almost gone, hardly any frost, 71 on my thermometer. We are an early bush, south facing in sandy soil in castleton. Only at 1/4 crop hope the weather holds out! Yikes!
VTfarmboy
02-25-2017, 02:00 PM
just looked at records and it was 2012 that ended early
Sap is running good today. Going to freeze tonight and all tomorrow. Should have four good sap days next week. The fun has just begun. I still think the season will end in March. Time will tell.
Spud
WestfordSugarworks
02-25-2017, 10:46 PM
Finally things are starting to smooth out in the sugarhouse. I think tonight was our 6th boil and we're getting the most out of the new filter press now so that's nice. Our autodraw temp. probe isn't reading correctly but we've been able to reign in control of our density. Only bad thing is one of our membranes stopped working yesterday evening at some point. My dad and I don't know much about ROs so we haven't tried to fix it, hopefully we can get some help Monday. A guy who sells sap to us started delivering today and brought a 525 gal load on his tractor. I think we've made about 370 gallons from 2900 taps from sap here at our home bush so we're at what i would consider 1/4 crop if we expected .5 gals per tap. We got some wind today and both our bushes dropped 1/2 inch of vacuum. Anyone experience that? Not sure if it was the wind dropping branches on lines and pulling out a spout, or just maybe some tap holes finally ceasing to flow sap after so many days, and that creating extra air flow from that hole. What do you think? Good luck to all.
DrTimPerkins
02-26-2017, 10:24 AM
We got some wind today and both our bushes dropped 1/2 inch of vacuum. Anyone experience that? Not sure if it was the wind dropping branches on lines and pulling out a spout, or just maybe some tap holes finally ceasing to flow sap after so many days, and that creating extra air flow from that hole. What do you think?
As the temperature increases, the amount of gases the trees produce via respiration (trees "breathe" too) increases, which makes your vacuum level drop off a little.
WestfordSugarworks
02-26-2017, 05:54 PM
Thank you, Dr. Tim. I knew that trees respired more as the temps increased but never connected that to the level of tree gas increasing. Makes sense to me. Now that makes me optimistic that we will be pulling 28.4 tomorrow! I checked every line for leaks last Thursday and fixed everything, but we only were pulling 27.9, although last year we were able to attain 28.4. I went through and tightened every saddle this summer because so many of them were leaking, and I expected we could pull a little bit higher or at least the same this year. guess we'll see.
GeneralStark
02-27-2017, 06:11 AM
I processed all the sap that came in from Friday night through yesterday at about 5 when it froze back up after a good run yesterday. Made another 20 gal. of AR. Up to about 80 for season so far. The grade didn't drop since last boil despite the temp. getting to 70 here Sat. afternoon. The sugar content did drop off to about 1.6 after being at 2 last week. A solid freeze last night will hopefully bring it back up. Got the RO and tanks all cleaned, now that the ice melted, and going to soak the syrup pans over night to be ready for what will hopefully be a productive several days. Looks like we may get a break for a couple days next weekend, or maybe not...It has definitely been an interesting season so far.....
woodfordmark
02-27-2017, 08:03 PM
Missed last week here in Bennington and spent Sunday afternoon tapping in the cold. Never seen a sap run like I did today and its still going strong. Tested 2.3%
Tucker08
02-27-2017, 09:39 PM
Having a good season so far. Loving the new rig. It is all I hoped it would be. One small issue with a syrup pan float, but I will figure that out soon. Saving so much time and wood. We have boiled 4 times and have 30% our LY crop in already. It is a whole new world. AOF arch is amazing. It is still nice light syrup. Really distinct vanilla flavor.
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GeneralStark
02-28-2017, 11:20 AM
Had a great sap run yesterday into today. About 2gpt in 24 hours at 2.1%. Only a marginal freeze last night so sap flow has moderated but still flowing well. Had to run the RO last night make room in the tanks. Going to boil later today and see what this sap makes...
Flat Lander Sugaring
02-28-2017, 09:00 PM
boiled 3 times made about 24 gal, all high vac tapping out gravity this weekend. 2.4 to 8 one pass in home made ro.
GeneralStark
02-28-2017, 09:11 PM
boiled 3 times made about 24 gal, all high vac tapping out gravity this weekend. 2.4 to 8 one pass in home made ro.
Was starting to worry seeing as you haven't posted yet for the 2017 season....
GeneralStark
02-28-2017, 09:14 PM
Made a little over 30 gal. this evening. Half AR and other half GD. Too bad I spilled a bucket on the floor or I would have had a few gallons more.... Awesome flavor. Sap still running ok...Thinking I will hold sap til Thursday and then boil and push everything through with water so as to clean the flue pan before sugaring season version 2 starts next week.
Had an interesting time setting the auto draw tonight as it was at first 3 degrees higher than last boil, but then dropped back to 1 degree above last boil. Wind really picked up too so there's something going on with the weather...
We made about 60 gallons tonight and 50 on Sunday. Tanks are not empty but the RO needed clean so we will start again in the AM. Looks like it will run all night here. Already warming up.
Ran great all yesterday and all last night. Got 2.2 GPT at 2.1% in the last 24 hours. Slowing down now but should run all today and into tomorrow morning. I feel I'm at 1/3 season right now.
Spud
tcross
03-01-2017, 06:02 AM
I got a little over 2 gpt yesterday and last night. looking like it'll run all day today and a good freeze for 5 days or so, which I'm fine with... it'll help me catch up on bottling and cleaning up! the syrup is tasting very buttery so far this year for one reason or another?
Beyondsuspension
03-01-2017, 07:17 AM
I let the pump run all night and brought in another 140 gallons of sap, not bad for me. Yesterday's sugar content hit 2.4% best yet this season.
rhwells2003
03-02-2017, 09:00 AM
What a good couple days. in the last 48 hours I figured we picked up 3.5gal/tap. We figure we're right around 1/2 a normal crop, and just breaking into march!
GeneralStark
03-03-2017, 07:14 AM
Yesterday afternoon I boiled everything that came in since the last boil on Tuesday, about 1300 gal. or so. Also boiled out the flue pan so I can clean it today. Made about 25 gal. AR. Great tasting syrup. Grade dropped with the warmer weather on Wednesday but not by too much. Up to about 135 gal. for the season so far. Looks like next week should be pretty good...
DrTimPerkins
03-03-2017, 07:28 AM
Busy week. Made about 200 gal on Wed and another 200 on Thurs before things really shut down with the cold. That puts us at 923 gal so far on 4,900 taps, or 0.19 gal/tap so far, which is about 37.6% of the way to our minimum 0.5 gal/tap goal. Still have some vacuum issues to deal with, but have been too busy setting up and learning the new RO and evaporator to spend much time in the woods. Sugar content has been OK so far, running 2.1-2.4 Brix. Don't much care for the really cold weather, but is sure is nice to actually have a weekend off.
MJPJ Sugars
03-04-2017, 05:15 AM
Last year during the crazy run at the end of March, we ended-up with about 150 gallons of sap from our 25 buckets, and set-out to boil it all on our 80's half-pint (2x4). The wife and my 10-year old took the graveyard shift that night, and wore it like a badge of honor! After about 37 hours straight we had our couple gallons of syrup. Welp, the dynamic duo decided they wanted to pull another all-nighter, so yesterday we fired-up Old Smokey at about 3:00PM and started our 80 gallons we had collected this week. At 4:00AM I was awakened by a panicked spouse; she burnt the sap -- toasted the pan. As a complete novice, I'm guessing, trying to piece together what happened so we don't repeat the same, but I can imagine a combination of too much heat with not enough sap in the pan caused the "sludge?" I didn't think we could get too much heat in this old barrel arch (no blower -- most of the heat goes up the chimney on this old rig), but I appear to be mistaken. Pan has some nice scorches! Must be a 16th-inch thick in spots... my elbows are sore just thinking about the needed grease. Appreciate any tips! Thanks!!!
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madmapler
03-04-2017, 06:48 AM
the syrup is tasting very buttery so far this year for one reason or another? I have noticed a butterscotch like flavor this year as well. Definitely different.
to100
03-04-2017, 04:10 PM
I did same on my first run, I scrubbed with 'bar keepers friend' and got the easy scourch off . I then I added more sap and boiled and most came off in flakes and filtered out. End up between Fancy and Amber taste good.
woodfordmark
03-04-2017, 06:31 PM
"bar keepers friend"?...explain
Flat Lander Sugaring
03-05-2017, 06:12 AM
Bad Taps? I am hearing rumors and things about bad taps and a producer having to dump all his syrup. Have I missed an article hear on it or is it being kept hush hush?
SandMan
03-05-2017, 06:13 AM
https://www.barkeepersfriend.com/cleaning-products/cleanser-polish/
Today was planned for syrup pan cleaning. I saw the reference to Bar Keepers Friend that was SUPPOSED to clean the niter and scorch spot.So I went to Lowes and bought 2 cans and tried it. NOT, didn't touch it. Tried it twice and even on a slight coating of niter on the bottom, did not even make a slight difference. I don't know if I have some super niter or something, but it was back to the reliable acid cleaning.
GeneralStark
03-05-2017, 01:11 PM
This season I have been using vinegar to clean my syrup pans. I rinse the pans out, fill to about 3/4-1" depth, which is about 1.5 gal/pan and then let soak for 24 hours. After this the niter comes off very easily. It seems like soaking is the key with niter with whatever acid/cleaner you are using....
My long term plan is to have permeate gravity flow through the syrup pans and down the floor drain over night. I have heard that circulating the permeate through the pan cleans it up with little effort.
VTnewguy
03-05-2017, 05:10 PM
Dumped all the ice sap/ rainwater from the buckets that froze up. Looks like it's going to be busy week. Can't wait, hopefully we can keep up.
steam maker
03-05-2017, 05:32 PM
We drain the pan out, rinse in place quick,put 5 or6 inches of permeate in it , then put sump pump on one side with a hose going to other side. Run it all nite come back to clean front pan. Course it is massachusetts niter so probly not as strong👍🏻😂
woodfordmark
03-05-2017, 06:20 PM
after using the vinegar, how much do you have to rinse it?...any aftertaste or smell afterwards?
any info is appreciated
PerryFamily
03-05-2017, 07:47 PM
This season I have been using vinegar to clean my syrup pans. I rinse the pans out, fill to about 3/4-1" depth, which is about 1.5 gal/pan and then let soak for 24 hours. After this the niter comes off very easily. It seems like soaking is the key with niter with whatever acid/cleaner you are using....
My long term plan is to have permeate gravity flow through the syrup pans and down the floor drain over night. I have heard that circulating the permeate through the pan cleans it up with little effort.
General, there's a producer near me that cleans his pans with spring water, gravity fed off the hill behind his sugar house. He lets the water run through his syrup pan and out the other side. He says if really bad he'll use permeate and a pump and just circulate it all night. I was there one morning and his syrup pan looked absolutely brand new!
VT_K9
03-05-2017, 08:06 PM
after using the vinegar, how much do you have to rinse it?...any aftertaste or smell afterwards?
any info is appreciated
During the season between boiling or runs we clean with about 2 gallons of vinegar in the front pan wit permeate to cover the junk on the sides. We use permeate only in the rear pan. We boild for 5-10 minutes and scrub. Sometimes we will let it sit overnight. Other times, if it cleans up quick, we will dump the vinegar. Then we fill the pans with permeate (water if you don't have it) and then bring to a boil. We drain and refill with sap.
We have used straight permeate to flush the pans before filling with vinegar/permeate to clean. The permeate alone does work great, but vinegar speeds up the process.
Mike
sapman
03-06-2017, 08:14 AM
I've also had good luck recirculating permeate, or condensate (which seems to work a little better), with a pump. Only thing is it still doesn't get staining off in my pan, though it feels clean. I'm now having to do the syrup pan after every boil seems like.
WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER
03-06-2017, 12:22 PM
I swap the front or rear syrup pan every day with a clean pan. The pan I pull off I add a couple gallon of vinegar and about 6 to 7 gallon of water to it and soak it overnight. Like a new pan the next day and I keep reusing the vinegar and water mixture all season. Cross flow pans sure make life a lot easier keeping the pans clean.
The pan that had the vinegar in it I rinse out real good for about 30 seconds with a water hose.
MJPJ Sugars
03-06-2017, 03:19 PM
Vinegar & Water, Baking Soda, and a little bit of elbow grease with a copper scrubber -- shocked at how well it worked!
Brought one part vinegar & and one part water to a boil for 10-15 minutes, removed the heat, and dumped-in some baking soda over the bad scorch, and let it fizz for 10 minutes or so. The small stains came-off with zero effort, and other than the main scorch, the pan never looked cleaner.
We scrubbed the scorch with the copper scrubs (tried the Scotch Bright pads, too -- copper worked better) and removed 90%, then re-did the process above -- the remaining black lifted right off.
to100
03-07-2017, 11:00 AM
Sorry that it did not work for you, I use stainless steel scrubby and rinse with baking soda. I have to use house water and I am using my second container of BKH for stainless that was recommended by a kitchen store.
I also will try vinager tomorrow.
I was told to use raisens and sap to soak pan at end of season for a week or so, it helped.
GeneralStark
03-07-2017, 01:06 PM
Looks like we may be back to cleaning those pans soon....I let the first of the new sap run onto the ground this morning as it did not look or smell pretty....the ice is scrubbing out the slime that grew in the lines last week when it was pushing 70 degrees. Still a little cloudy but no big deal.
I'm going to get around the woods for a good leak check in hopes for some serious sap the next few days...
madmapler
03-07-2017, 04:43 PM
I'm going to get around the woods for a good leak check in hopes for some serious sap the next few days...
I hope that's the case. I've been sitting around the last few days waiting for things to start happening. I tried to do some leak checking yesterday but there wasn't enough sap in the lines to be able to pin point. Wasn't much better today.
tcross
03-08-2017, 06:26 AM
sap ran half way decent last night. I'm a bit concerned by the amount of swelling I'm seeing in my red maples, which is about half my crop. I'm tempted to go around and unplug them over the weekend and hope I don't' have a bunch of buddy sap in my tank tonight when I get home! normally I end just a week or less before most people around me on all sugar maples, but that may not be the case this year!
Sap started running a bit last night. I woke to about 3000 gallons in the tank. Sugar is 2% this morning. Should pick up at about 11:00 when the sun and temp goes up. The 10 day forecast is saying no sugaring in my area. I will shut the pump off tomorrow morning. I hope the last two weeks of March and the first 20 days of April will give us a ton more sap. I feel I'm at 45% of what I hope for this season. I noticed some swelling in the buds of my Zestar apple trees. These are a very early apple.
Spud
madmapler
03-08-2017, 08:08 AM
Guy I know stopped by just as I was getting up this morning and told me I had sap running on the ground. That's one of the few things that could keep me from my morning coffee. On went the boots and cap and down the road I went, still wearing my sweatpants (basically pajamas). Looks like we're back in business. Sugar is 1.8-9 up from 1.3.
to100
03-08-2017, 07:32 PM
I forgot to mention that I moisten pan, turn over to drain. Then I shake some on and wait 15 seconds or more while it activates. Then elbow grease.
MJPJ Sugars
03-08-2017, 09:23 PM
Wow... looks like a week off after tonight? Getting cold again.
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John Lazelle
03-09-2017, 05:08 AM
We gathered 145 gallons from our 145 taps last night in Wilmington, Vt. 😄
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I got 1 GPT yesterday. Kinda of a disappointment for the last three days. I'm about 50% right now. Still a lot of time left. I normally go till April 20th. I sure hope this is one of those years.
Spud
sweetvt
03-09-2017, 08:20 AM
Well Natures RO was helping me out last night, collected some super high octane 3.7 % sap and lit a fire to it and was drawing nice syrup in no time.. Will finish up after work today and drain things again to get ready for the deep freeze part 2. Looks like it may be too cold until the end of next week. I remember my grandfather and the old timers saying that the best sap runs in March won't happen until after the full moon has come and gone. Think this year it is on March 12 so will shall see.
Drain the pans, wash them up again, and cross your fingers folks, the best is yet to come.
DrTimPerkins
03-09-2017, 08:28 AM
We finished off another 165 gal of AR last night. Got another 3,000 gal of sap overnight before it finally froze up. Altogether not a bad run, but certainly not as good as some have been. We're at about 45% of a minimum 0.5 gal/tap crop...which is great for the time of year. Not sure whether we'll concentrate and boil today or let it freeze and wait for the next run....new membranes being installed later this morning, so that crunches us a bit for time.
GeneralStark
03-10-2017, 01:13 PM
Had a good run from Tuesday afternoon until Thursday afternoon. Over 2gpt in that period with most coming in Tuesday night and Wednesday afternoon. Sugar at 1.9%. Boiled it all last night and made another 25 of AR after sweetening the flue pan again since I boiled and washed it out last week before the big freeze. The first 10 gal. were right in on the edge of DR and the last 15 right on the edge of GD. Great flavor.
Spending the afternoon cleaning up and getting ready for the next big freeze. Starting to look like we will have some real winter before spring really kicks in gear.
MJPJ Sugars
03-11-2017, 04:52 AM
A wee bit nippy this morning... backyard weather station reading -3 with a -17 windchill (Georgia, VT). Nice day to be nestled up close to the arch :).
Please be careful if you're in the woods today!!
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drewlamb
03-11-2017, 06:01 AM
7 below this morning here in Calais. Also just checked the model runs - looks to be a doozy Tues-Wed. Maybe enough (20"?) to have to clear the haul roads again for gathering.
If I may, I'd like to get back to the discussion from early March on pan cleaning. I too use vinegar on the syrup pans with great success. Doesn't do as well with the nitre on the sides which for some reason (??) is much more difficult to remove, even with acid pan cleaner at the end of the season.
My question is for folks with reverse flow capability... How often do you clean during the season? My old 3x8 had two syrup pans and I had an extra that I would switch in before each boil. Lots of plugging, pan draining and so on. My 4x10, new last season, is also cross flow but has reverse flow capability. I run about 600-700 gallons of non-concentrate sap through, depending on the sand situation, then reverse the flow. The sand lifts off the final compartments of the pan beautifully and leaves the whole system pretty clean. I'm just not feeling the need to clean my pan(s), and am wondering how others with reverse cross flow or parallel flow with either side draw-off do or don't do the cleaning.
Thanks for the input!
woodfordmark
03-18-2017, 07:33 PM
It warmed just enough today here in Bennington to get things going again. 8pm, 34 degree's and still running strong. Tested 2.1
markcasper
03-19-2017, 02:20 AM
7 below this morning here in Calais. Also just checked the model runs - looks to be a doozy Tues-Wed. Maybe enough (20"?) to have to clear the haul roads again for gathering.
If I may, I'd like to get back to the discussion from early March on pan cleaning. I too use vinegar on the syrup pans with great success. Doesn't do as well with the nitre on the sides which for some reason (??) is much more difficult to remove, even with acid pan cleaner at the end of the season.
My question is for folks with reverse flow capability... How often do you clean during the season? My old 3x8 had two syrup pans and I had an extra that I would switch in before each boil. Lots of plugging, pan draining and so on. My 4x10, new last season, is also cross flow but has reverse flow capability. I run about 600-700 gallons of non-concentrate sap through, depending on the sand situation, then reverse the flow. The sand lifts off the final compartments of the pan beautifully and leaves the whole system pretty clean. I'm just not feeling the need to clean my pan(s), and am wondering how others with reverse cross flow or parallel flow with either side draw-off do or don't do the cleaning.
Thanks for the input!
I have a 4x12 with a 4 foot syrup pan and I switch sides at about 50-60 gallons of syrup. More than that and I will have problems. I have a 2nd pan that I switched out last year after 400 gallons of syrup made, but there was so much in the flue pan that it just came in and coated the front pan after one boil. Before last year, I never cleaned the pan the whole season. By the end though it was getting pretty bad.
madmapler
03-19-2017, 06:35 AM
7 below this morning here in Calais. Also just checked the model runs - looks to be a doozy Tues-Wed. Maybe enough (20"?) to have to clear the haul roads again for gathering.
If I may, I'd like to get back to the discussion from early March on pan cleaning. I too use vinegar on the syrup pans with great success. Doesn't do as well with the nitre on the sides which for some reason (??) is much more difficult to remove, even with acid pan cleaner at the end of the season.
My question is for folks with reverse flow capability... How often do you clean during the season? My old 3x8 had two syrup pans and I had an extra that I would switch in before each boil. Lots of plugging, pan draining and so on. My 4x10, new last season, is also cross flow but has reverse flow capability. I run about 600-700 gallons of non-concentrate sap through, depending on the sand situation, then reverse the flow. The sand lifts off the final compartments of the pan beautifully and leaves the whole system pretty clean. I'm just not feeling the need to clean my pan(s), and am wondering how others with reverse cross flow or parallel flow with either side draw-off do or don't do the cleaning.
Thanks for the input! I have a reversable 4'x4' pan and it could use a cleaning at about 400 gallons or so as well but I concentrate to about 20%. My brother in law doesn't ro and he simply reverses flow all season. Basically the same setup.
Marc Duclos
03-19-2017, 08:26 AM
Hi Spud, Marc from Deerfield NH. When I started to convince my self to tap the trees hear I had to learn the cost to do so. Seven years ago I was just a resident care taker of the 22 acres. So I made the expense to get in the sap. I have learned from you and others this about using vacuum. Yup I can get sap when it is running. I now have the deed to the acreage. Now evaporator this year. I have done some boiling but its nuts. I have been trading sap for syrup from the producer down the rd ho have been sugaring for 44 years. Seven more years of bricklaying. I will re do the slapped up shack to a real one.
Hi Spud, Marc from Deerfield NH. When I started to convince my self to tap the trees hear I had to learn the cost to do so. Seven years ago I was just a resident care taker of the 22 acres. So I made the expense to get in the sap. I have learned from you and others this about using vacuum. Yup I can get sap when it is running. I now have the deed to the acreage. Now evaporator this year. I have done some boiling but its nuts. I have been trading sap for syrup from the producer down the rd ho have been sugaring for 44 years. Seven more years of bricklaying. I will re do the slapped up shack to a real one.
Hi Marc it's nice to hear from you. Thats great you have gotten the deed to the land. Go easy on the brick laying so you do not wreck your back. I doing good up here and have some land deals in the making. Good luck this season.
Spud
I was able to get .62 GPT yesterday on this run. It looks like we may get 3-4 more runs in the next 10 days here in the North. I'm hoping to hit 3/4 season by April 1st. Sugar is holding at 1.8% right now. I sure hope we can run till the 20th of April. I will be planting 100 more apple trees in just 4 weeks.
Spud
MJPJ Sugars
03-21-2017, 06:59 AM
I was surprised to see the sap ran all night here (Georgia - Franklin County). Back-yard weather gauge registered a low of 32 -- never got below. Still running steady. Nice surprise :)
DrTimPerkins
03-21-2017, 07:40 AM
I was able to get .62 GPT yesterday on this run.
About the same here...add that to about 2,000 gal we had from before the last freeze and it's looking to be a busy day. Starting the RO shortly and should be boiling around lunch.
WestfordSugarworks
03-21-2017, 08:44 AM
Amazing how much the sun made a difference for these runs we had on Saturday, Sunday, and yesterday. Didn't think much would happen with all the cold and then the snow insulating the frozen ground. Our big bush was testing 2.1 yesterday which is well above the 1.4-1.6 it has been testing all season. Vac is pretty tight in both woods and everything is running smooth, though I never am quite happy enough with our vacuum levels.
Sunday Rock Maple
03-21-2017, 03:04 PM
Starting the RO shortly and should be boiling around lunch.
Please forgive the New Yorker on the Vermont thread, but I had to ask what percent concentrate you are feeding that new evaporator (the one that was so hard to see with all the smiling folks in front of it a few days ago) with?
woodfordmark
03-21-2017, 09:00 PM
ran all night here in bennington as well MJPJ....sugar was 2.5% this morning and 2.2% tonight
DrTimPerkins
03-21-2017, 09:05 PM
...but I had to ask what percent concentrate you are feeding that new evaporator (the one that was so hard to see with all the smiling folks in front of it a few days ago) with?
Typically around 32-35 Brix concentrate.
Sunday Rock Maple
03-21-2017, 11:54 PM
Typically around 32-35 Brix concentrate.
......on earth as it is in heaven...........
I have a friend that runs 38 concentrate. They boil on a flat pan and they can store their concentrate for two weeks in a bulk tank at 38 degrees. It has no ill effect on grade or flavor. This might be the norm in the years to come.
Spud
DrTimPerkins
03-22-2017, 09:52 AM
I have a friend that runs 38 concentrate. They boil on a flat pan and they can store their concentrate for two weeks in a bulk tank at 38 degrees. It has no ill effect on grade or flavor.
Dr. Abby did a study last year looking at high brix syrup flavor. Syrups made in that fashion had good flavor. We'll obviously be doing more research along those lines with the new system, but I can tell you having spent about 30 hrs boiling so far, the syrup we are making tastes great.
We don't have a refrigerated bulk tank, but I can see one in our future. You definitely do not want to sit on concentrate at that level for long. Anyone have suggestions on where to look for new or used bulk tanks?
We made over 200 gal yesterday, which puts us at 1,290+ gals for the season. That's 0.26 gal syrup/tap, or 53% of the way to a minimum crop (0.5 gal/tap), and about 45% of the way to our long-term average production of 0.59 gal/tap.
markcasper
03-22-2017, 10:23 AM
I have a friend that runs 38 concentrate. They boil on a flat pan and they can store their concentrate for two weeks in a bulk tank at 38 degrees. It has no ill effect on grade or flavor. This might be the norm in the years to come.
Spud
I would think you'd want it down to 32-33, colder the better. I sat on some for 7 days this year at 18% and 34-36 degrees, (some sap was already a week old before concentrating) and it definately was not light amber. I don't know if it made medium even. I have access to a working bulk tank and will be playing around with this.
GeneralStark
03-22-2017, 11:26 AM
Sap ran pretty well here Sunday thru yesterday afternoon, with a freeze each night, though Monday was the best with the intense March sun. I boiled yesterday evening and made another 25 gal. of AR. Started at the line with DR and ended at the line with GD. Great flavor. Back into the deep freeze and not sure it's going to warm up enough on Friday to get much sap for open house weekend. Hopefully we can at least boil Sunday.
madmapler
03-22-2017, 04:34 PM
. I boiled yesterday evening and made another 25 gal. of AR. Started at the line with DR and ended at the line with GD. Great flavor. . That's pretty much how it's been with us this season. We have yet to make a gallon of light or a gallon of dark but have come close to both. All 23 drums have been AR. Weird.
Tucker08
03-22-2017, 06:51 PM
Just crossed the 70 gallon line last night. We made 93 last year. The new rig is working great. A much nicer experience to my old 2x6. We are in a nice rhythm with drawing off. That was harder on the old rig. The heat of the aof is crazy. Don't have the big drops in temp after a fire. It comes jack very quickly when you close the doors and start the fan. Far exceeds my expectations. We are averaging 90 to 100 gph, which is not pushing it as hard as possible, and our nights are a lot shorter, which makes mamma happy. A win, win.
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drewlamb
03-23-2017, 06:14 AM
Dr Tim, you said you had 2000 gallons from before the last freeze. How did you keep it from freezing solid? With a tear in my eye I dumped about 300 gallons yesterday that I felt was too little to deal with but didn't want turning into a block of ice in my tank. I left smaller amounts of sap in a couple tanks but was more worried about a big chunk that would take up a quarter of my tank.
DrTimPerkins
03-23-2017, 07:31 AM
Dr Tim, you said you had 2000 gallons from before the last freeze. How did you keep it from freezing solid?
We didn't....it froze solid. The previous time we boiled was pretty late in the day, but it kept running for several hours after we finished. Then the temperatures dropped like a stone. We could have fought to boil it all out the next day in 15 deg F weather, but said "screw it" and gambled that we would get a slow start to the next run and that it would melt the frozen sap. About 2,000 gal is the minimum we need to fire up the RO to get enough permeate to do a wash/rinse. As it turned out, all our primary tanks filled up from this last run overnight (then ran slow all day), and were just starting to spill over into our backup tanks, so a perfect scenario (except for a leaky valve on one tank and a flat tire on our sap trailer). The new HYPERBRIX membranes Lapierre swapped out in our RO for us to test are much faster, so all is good.
drewlamb
03-23-2017, 07:43 AM
Gotcha. But just to be clear, since I'm looking for some advice... If I have, for example, a tank that is half or less full, and I know it may freeze solid, would you recommend leaving it for the next run? Was that your situation? Just trying to picture how that 2000 gallons is distributed. All in one tank? And what's the total capacity of the tank?
Thanks!
WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER
03-23-2017, 07:50 AM
Dr Tim,
What is the new beast at Proctor that is eating the 32% to 35%??
mainebackswoodssyrup
03-23-2017, 08:45 AM
Dr Tim,
What is the new beast at Proctor that is eating the 32% to 35%??
From the UVM thread:
http://mapletrader.com/community/showthread.php?30406-Lapierre-UVM-PMRC-Research-Collaboration
GeneralStark
03-23-2017, 11:30 AM
Gotcha. But just to be clear, since I'm looking for some advice... If I have, for example, a tank that is half or less full, and I know it may freeze solid, would you recommend leaving it for the next run? Was that your situation? Just trying to picture how that 2000 gallons is distributed. All in one tank? And what's the total capacity of the tank?
Thanks!
It kind of depends on your tank situation and how it is all plumbed but my general rule is I am ok with about 1/3 - 1/2 of the tank capacity being taken up by ice going into a run. I have one bulk tank (out of 3) that I will not let freeze however because the valve is easily damaged but my 2-400 gal tanks have gate valves which handle freezing well. So I'm ok with about 400 gal of ice between two tanks as that still leaves me with 700 gal. of capacity which is the least I need to fire up the ro. Fresh sap coming in, and recirculating from the ro generally thaws the ice pretty well, or at least enough to quickly make more capacity.
drewlamb
03-23-2017, 01:13 PM
Thanks General. That's very helpful. Now I feel like an idiot for dumping the 300 gallons I did yesterday. It was split between two 520 gallon tanks in the woods and each was only 1/4 full. Of course I thought twice before doing it and guess I decided wrong. Anyhow, thanks for the input.
GeneralStark
03-23-2017, 01:34 PM
You're welcome. I fee like an idiot quite often during sugaring season, like this past weekend when I thought one of the valves on my tank was closed but in reality it was jammed with ice and was still partially open. The ice thawed overnight and in the morning the sap in the tank was gone. Was only about 100 gal. but still...
WestfordSugarworks
03-23-2017, 06:35 PM
You're welcome. I fee like an idiot quite often during sugaring season, like this past weekend when I thought one of the valves on my tank was closed but in reality it was jammed with ice and was still partially open. The ice thawed overnight and in the morning the sap in the tank was gone. Was only about 100 gal. but still...
or when you are trying to rinse the RO and are 'rinsing' with raw sap from your bulk tank instead of permeate.. we all make dumb mistakes but beating ourselves up over them lead to further mistakes down the line and we have to stay clear headed to operate as best as possible regardless of the idiots we sometimes are.
Well I was hoping for a good run today but it never happened. In all I got .25GPT today. The ten day forecast is now showing the days will be a bit cooler then originally forecasted. It is freezing rain outside now and the sap stopped running. I'm still hoping for a good week.
Spud
PARKER MAPLE
03-27-2017, 03:43 AM
We also had a very poor run through the weekend. Temps only came above freezing for a few hours. Just long enough to let the sap start coming in good then freeze back up again. Very quite around the sugarhouse for the open house weekend. I think someone stopped yesterday from Tennessee but that was it. We need to warm up a bit this week slowly. As I'm getting nervous every day it continues like this. April is knocking on our doors as we speak.
Best of luck
Jbm
rhwells2003
03-27-2017, 06:58 AM
yesterday was odd for us. Sap started to trickle in around 11am so I turned the vac on. The first hour it came in pretty good but I think that was just the lines thawing out. After that it just trickled in throughout the day and thru last night. At one point yesterday it was mid 40's and sunny, I would have thought it would have been pounding yesterday but I guess not. We got about as much as Spud was saying maybe 0.25gal/tap maybe
billyinvt
03-27-2017, 08:36 AM
Sounds like a similar story statewide. 7 degrees when I got up Sunday morning so I imagine it took a bit to thaw out the branches. Just when it felt warmer and sunny for a couple hours the south wind picked up and clouds rolled in. On the plus side, I was able to float the block of frozen sap in my tank with the little that we did collect yesterday afternoon.
drewlamb
03-27-2017, 09:19 AM
Yup, same here over the weekend - just a trickle. As my friend and fellow sugarmaker Craig Line said, plenty of "hurry up and wait" this month. Tomorrow looks to be a different story with mild temps overnight and high 40s tomorrow. Good luck to all.
Tucker08
03-27-2017, 01:08 PM
Was the same for us, even down in the southern part of the state. Had about 300 gallons to boil for maple weekend. Did 150 each day. Did not RO it at all. Man, boiling straight sap sucks. Did have a good crowd for the weekend. Sap finally started to run last night. Hope it continues for the day. Hope tomorrow is good too. New cv spouts helping this year.
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MJPJ Sugars
03-27-2017, 07:00 PM
Trees never quite woke-up here in Georgia (Franklin County) today. From yesterday through tonight, only .7 gpt. With no freeze (or sun) forecast up here until Wednesday night/Thursday, wondering if this week will continue to be a "drip." (pun intended :cool: )
Sugarmaker's dad
03-27-2017, 07:15 PM
Very frustrating that the sap has only been trickling in, but just started the RO to clear the tank and amazingly the sap tested 4%!!! Verified with both a refractometer and hydrometer. Is this possible?
woodfordmark
03-27-2017, 07:39 PM
I won't complain about the "drip run weekend" because the "sugar GOD" was with us...tested 2.6%!
GeneralStark
03-27-2017, 09:16 PM
The sap was just a trickle all weekend, as were the visitors. No boiling and mild hypothermia were the price to pay for record sales.
GeneralStark
03-27-2017, 09:19 PM
Very frustrating that the sap has only been trickling in, but just started the RO to clear the tank and amazingly the sap tested 4%!!! Verified with both a refractometer and hydrometer. Is this possible?
Sure. But is it the trees?
Flat Lander Sugaring
03-28-2017, 03:50 AM
Same here, couple hundred all weekend. Lots of family and friends came by Sunday. We tapped 300 Saturday on gravity and we cleaned up Sunday afternoon. Picked up almost 300 from those taps yesterday afternoon and 220 from high vac. Boiling tonight.
DrTimPerkins
03-28-2017, 08:14 AM
Only half tanks over the weekend, but half tanks are better than nothing. Got another half tank run again overnight. Sap sugar coming up....about 2.5+ yesterday. Short boil yesterday afternoon/evening. Made 55 gal of AR with very mild flavor. Very little niter. Looks like it'll be a decent week.
tcross
03-28-2017, 08:31 AM
didn't get much of a run over the weekend or yesterday up here. conditions seemed to be good... guess mother nature wasn't ready. my sugar content did go up to a hair above 2.75, so that's nice. our last draw last night was Fancy... first time we've ever made fancy from our woods... little to no niter as well!
WestfordSugarworks
03-28-2017, 11:27 AM
Very frustrating that the sap has only been trickling in, but just started the RO to clear the tank and amazingly the sap tested 4%!!! Verified with both a refractometer and hydrometer. Is this possible? What's your average sugar content? We definitely came up in sugar content from 1.7 before the big snow and freeze to 2.1 as a high afterwards. We are dropping a little now to 2.0, 2.1. But if its possible that your 8,000 taps can produce 4% lets talk about how much I can lease your woods for :lol:
My sap started running a little in the early morning hours. It is still running some but the trees just don't want to run yet. I'm wondering if all the snow on the ground is just preventing the roots to thaw. My vacuum is at 24 inches and I know parts of the woods is froze up. By the time all this snow melts we may not have many freezing nights to give us some big runs. I was hoping this week was going to be great for sugaring but it's been real bad so far. Lets hope April will be a good month.
Spud
MJPJ Sugars
03-28-2017, 05:31 PM
Pretty-much stopped up here in the NW corner -- more fog than sap in the buckets tonight. Very interesting to hear that the syrup is getting lighter -- my last boil (over the weekend) ended-up a shade lighter than the one preceding.
WestfordSugarworks
03-28-2017, 09:47 PM
We never ran that great either since this run began. It was up to 50 today but it never opened up. We've made all DR and AR this season, the first season in our 3 years that we haven't made fancy by this time. Kind of guessing it won't happen this season at all if it didn't happen today. I think we are 2/3 of the way to 0.5 gal per tap but that might be a high estimate. Ready for winter to be over but haven't had a really big sap run day yet and I want one! We had this one huge run last year and nothing to compare it with this season. We've been collecting sap since January 7th and boiling since January 22nd, all tapped in since January 27th. Next week will be 3 months since we've began and I'll be ready for a break when it ends.
GeneralStark
03-29-2017, 09:52 PM
Another 30 gal. AR this evening from about 1200 gal. that came in since Saturday. Steady and slow and I'll take it. That brings me over 200 for the season. Sugar still at 2% which is pretty good for my woods in late March.
tcross
03-30-2017, 03:18 PM
Sap is coming in very, very well today! should be a great couple of days here with a similar forecast for tonight/tomorrow!
MJPJ Sugars
03-30-2017, 08:36 PM
Another pseudo-disappointing sap day, made moreso by high expectations after the trees woke-up fairly early, and the sun warmed throughout the day -- the mosquitos certainly noticed the warm weather! But the trees never kicked into high gear.
I'm wondering if we're now seeing the affects of last year's drought? Perhaps the trees simply don't have the water stored-up like a non-drought year?
DrTimPerkins
03-31-2017, 07:44 AM
Sap ran pretty well overnight. About 5,000 gal since about 5pm yesterday. New high-brix membranes just installed today (3rd set) for testing. Hopefully they'll run as well as the last bunch. Should be boiling sometime after lunch.
Sap ran great yesterday and we had a little freeze last night. Sap has been running only 400GPH today but it may run through the night. I was able to find and fix some deer chews on some lateral lines today. My vacuum is back up to 27 today. My sugar is staying at 2.1% so I'm very happy about that. I am at 62.5% of hitting my .5GPT goal for the season. Im at a .31 for the season. Should be a good week to come for sap. We still have a ton of snow in the woods and my 4-wheeler with chains is having a hard time getting around. Good luck Traders.
Spud
WestfordSugarworks
04-01-2017, 12:23 PM
It's a gusher so far today
Im running good today. I should get one GPT at least. May run till midnight or so before it freezes. Should get a bunch of sap in the next 10 days. Looking to be a very good season.
Spud
GeneralStark
04-01-2017, 05:19 PM
Running well here too. Better than Thursday in fact which is surprising given the lack of sun and cold temps. I fired up the ro yesterday to make space and am doing the same again now. Going to boil tomorrow and suspect by then will be processing close to 2000gal. Hoping to make over 40 gal. Sugar at about 1.9%.
Tucker08
04-01-2017, 07:59 PM
Nearing the end in far Southern VT. My sap run today was poor. Hope these next two nights with a freeze make things happen. After that, it looks like a poor forecast. Am just about at last year's total how. Added 100 taps though.
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Flat Lander Sugaring
04-02-2017, 07:18 AM
Headed over to N.Y. yesterday to help out boiling. Lakeview has a awesome set up for being small.
Think I was there 4 hour's stoking his 3x10.
16310
Flat Lander Sugaring
04-02-2017, 07:36 AM
1631216311
Headed over to N.Y. yesterday to help out boiling. Lakeview has a awesome set up for being small.
Think I was there 4 hour's stoking his 3x10.
16310
Another picture
Nearing the end in far Southern VT. My sap run today was poor. Hope these next two nights with a freeze make things happen. After that, it looks like a poor forecast. Am just about at last year's total how. Added 100 taps though.
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Are you seeing buds on the sugar maples? I am hoping we will go to the 20th up here at the border. Sap should run well today and I am still at 2%.
Spud
Flat Lander Sugaring
04-02-2017, 09:11 AM
Had a good night last night made another 12/15 gallons, sap ran all night ok. Going to start boiling around 1 today. Making a oil reclaimer for vac pump and washing Ro.
Had huge group in sugar house last night 11 adults 5 kids. A lot of dead boiling sodas all over in sugar house and driveway. One seasoned boiling soda drinker lost his balance for some unknown reason good thing I put the bench up otherwise he would have landed on kegs of syrup, no blood no foul he had help getting back up onto his sea legs.
DrTimPerkins
04-02-2017, 09:23 AM
Yes, there are plenty of buds on sugar maples all the time unless the trees are dead. :) I assume you mean are people seeing swelling buds. Nothing here up on the hill...buds are still very tight. We've still got time. Southern VT had a lot warmer weather in February/March than we did in the north.
Very good run yesterday. We will be boiling today starting at around noon. Sap just started coming in this morning about 8:30am....should be a couple of very nice days until about mid-week based on the forecast. After that no freezes for a while, but we still have plenty of snow on the ground and no really hot weather in the forecast, so things should hold in there for a while yet. Tapholes still seem quite productive.
We are right at about 0.34 gal/tap or ~3.8 lbs per tap right now, not counting what we have from yesterday or today. I expect it'll be a 200 gal syrup production day once we get rolling. That'll put us well up over 4 lbs per tap by the end of the day, with a couple of good days coming. It's going to be a busy couple of weeks coming up.
madmapler
04-02-2017, 10:33 AM
Are you seeing buds on the sugar maples? I am hoping we will go to the 20th up here at the border. Sap should run well today and I am still at 2%.
Spud
I'm just north of the border and the buds are looking pretty tight still. No more freezes in the forecast after tonight so the end may be getting near. Aside from that, the sap is running very strong and clear and I'm still making AR as of last night but it's getting darker. I was in St. Albans a few days ago and we have more snow than they do up there.
Sap was running until 11:00 last night. Woke up at 5:00 and the temp is 25 degrees. Full sun today and sap should run great all day and all tonight. I am at .36GPT right now. As of last night I am still testing at 2%. The 10 day forecast is showing a lot of nighttime temps at 33-34. I hope they are off a few degrees and we get freezing temps instead. Today I plan to prune the rest of my apple trees. Good luck everyone it should be a great week.
Spud
GeneralStark
04-03-2017, 06:20 AM
Solid freeze here overnight as well. Sap ran well yesterday afternoon while the sun was out and pulled in almost 400 gal. between 2 pm and when it froze last night. Had the longest boil of the season at 4 hours yesterday and made over 40 gal. AR from the sap that came in Thursday thru 2 pm yesterday. Once again, grade went from dark side of AR to right on the line with GD. Still not seeing much niter...
Trees tapped in January are still producing well. Going to be an interesting week or two. Still have some snow in the woods and frost in the ground....
tcross
04-03-2017, 06:30 AM
Ran great here yesterday! almost at a 2 gpt rate! I think I learned a good lesson this year. always have your pump on when it is snowing and above freezing. Saturday it started running like mad at 33 degrees and it was also snowing like crazy... guess that's why they call it sugar snow?! we had our first long boil of the year Saturday... 13 hours in the sugarhouse will tire you out! made a lot of syrup though!
billyinvt
04-03-2017, 09:01 AM
The "sugar snow" phenomenon was definitely in full effect on Saturday!
DrTimPerkins
04-03-2017, 09:55 AM
175 gal of AR yesterday. Sugar content still good (2.3-2.4 Brix). Very little niter. Looking for another good run today.
MJPJ Sugars
04-03-2017, 02:49 PM
Gusher today... finally :cool:
Thought my taps had dried-out, but we're 1+ gpt already today. Might be going-out with a (nice) bang!
I'm at about 3 quarts per tap so far today. Sap is running good and still testing 2%. It should run all night and I hope to get 1.5 GPT by morning. We have a ton of snow in the woods still. I hope I can go till the 20th.
Spud
Sap ran all night but not great. It is now testing at 1.8%. Over the last 24 hours I got 1GPT. I did not get the big Gusher run that others did but thats ok. If it keeps running steady all week I will be fine. I am at .37GPT for the season. Dr. Tim your 2.3% sap is great and that is whats getting you a .5+ every year. Could I trade trees with you? Thank you for posting your numbers.
Spud
tcross
04-04-2017, 06:11 AM
had a great run yesterday... slowed way down over night. full tanks in the sugarhouse... throw some ice buckets in the tanks at lunch today and boil all day tomorrow. I didn't test the sugar content, but a taste test tells me it's still around 2.25-2.5.
Geroldn
04-04-2017, 06:20 AM
I don't know how much sap I got, but at 2:00 with 150g in the tank my 213 taps were producing 35gph. After boiling and RO to keep up, at 10:00 my tank was almost empty and the lines were still running (slower). The syrup lightened up noticeably, but didn't quite cross from dark back to amber. Very tasty flavor. This week's weather doesn't look great for major sap runs, but I'm sure I'll get a bit more today as yesterday's run tapers off. I have just enough wood to finish today. I won't be making any very dark.
rhwells2003
04-04-2017, 07:44 AM
got about 1.5gal/tap in the last 24 hours. Puts me right around my yearly goal of 20gal/tap. Everything from here on out is just gravy in my book
DrTimPerkins
04-04-2017, 09:20 AM
175 gal of AR yesterday. That puts us at a bit over 2,000 gal total or about 81% of our minimum 0.5 gal/tap crop. Should break that mark by Fri or Sat. No freezes in the forecast, but vacuum is still good (despite the high winds we're getting right now) and no real high temperatures forecast, so should be OK for a while yet. Syrup lightened up some and flavor got less intense. Sap sugar content still good at 2.2-2.3 Brix. A little more foaming. Very little niter.
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