Checking what VT sugar makers are doing

[DrTimPerkins]

Definitely was a good year for the lower elevations. We finished out with 3090 gallons, .57 or 6.3 lbs per tap.

Seems like you folks mid-south VT were in the "sweet" spot this year -- as long as you caught those early flows. Congrats.

Remains to be seen how the rest of the state, especially Chittenden/Franklin/Lamoille and the NEK will do. Still a decent amount of snow in the woods in some places. Much depends on how hot it gets and for how long it stays hot next week. For most folks it's looking like a decent crop, perhaps a bit low in the colder spots. Most likely not a real banner year (like last yr) for most though.

We have one research area where the snow just pulled back from the trees within the past few days.

[Andy VT]

Predictions about maple production out beyond about a week are not worth much.
That's quite a bit better than the stock market!

[Sugar Bear]

This isn't an abnormal thing in biology. If excess energy is made (or consumed), then a portion of the excess can get stored for later use. In people that's as fat -- in plants it is a starch. It may be converted later and get used, or may just hang around for a long time. The difference is that in trees the starches tend to be laid down within the rays of annual rings, but more can be added and some can be remobilized down the road as needed. Rays are the tissues that 1. are living and 2. cut across annual rings, so the mobility of the sugar is higher than many other compounds in the wood.

The sugar we collect by tapping comes from many annual rings of rays in the wood. In fact, the average age of the sugar molecules in maple syrup tends to be around 3 yrs, but ranges from less than 1 to 20-25 yrs. The hydraulic conductivity (the ability/rate/amount of sap to move through the stem) and carbohydrate levels tend to be highest in the outermost rings, then drop off as we get deeper. That's why drilling a taphole beyond a certain depth doesn't get us a lot more syrup yield. These reasons (higher sugar in the newest rings and higher hydraulic conductivity in newer rings) are why we've designed the barb spout https://mapleresearch.org/pub/innovations-in-maple-sap-collection-systems-spouts/ currently being tested in several places in the U.S. and Canada. The new spout design allows better collection from shallower parts of the taphole and allows better collection during the frequent short thaw periods (when only the outermost portion of the wood thaws out) in which normal spouts do not run or run much.

At a certain point (decades), some amount of carbs are lost due to continued tree growth when the sapwood deep in the tree eventually converts to heartwood and is thus lost to the tree (and to sugarmakers).

Before the season starts, from the fall through the winter, the sap in xylem tends to be quite low in sugar (it's all being converted to starch and stored for future use). That's why when people try fall and early-winter tapping the sap tends to have very low sugar so syrup yields tend to be lower.

As a woodworker I have noticed that the rays ( I call it "Ray Flecking ) within the rings (visible best on a quartersawn aspect of lumber) vary with intensity across the surface of a quartersawn board. At least so in a visible sense to the human eye.

Does this mean that a spout that is tapped into a area of stem with higher ray count in it will produce sap with higher sugar content then one that is tapped into an area with low ray count?

Is the carb converted to sugar at the location of storage in the ray and then passed into the sap or is it passed into the sap and converted somewhere else. thereby making all sap within the tree the same sugar content at a given moment in time of sap flow within the tree?

[blissville maples]

Congrats on the good season in tropical southern Vermont. I have a friend in the Poultney area and every time I get snow I text him. He usually replies with something about planting banana trees next year :lol: I'm still checking for leaks with snow shoes on. Not looking good.


No tropical weather this spring thank God, I was waiting for it. Greenes or mahar? Lots of producers big and small in the area. Although you used to see a lot more sap tanks in the back of trucks five six years ago.

[blissville maples]

Seems like you folks mid-south VT were in the "sweet" spot this year -- as long as you caught those early flows. Congrats.

Remains to be seen how the rest of the state, especially Chittenden/Franklin/Lamoille and the NEK will do. Still a decent amount of snow in the woods in some places. Much depends on how hot it gets and for how long it stays hot next week. For most folks it's looking like a decent crop, perhaps a bit low in the colder spots. Most likely not a real banner year (like last yr) for most though.

We have one research area where the snow just pulled back from the trees within the past few days.

Yes we had pretty much perfect weather for 5 weeks. Tapped in by Feb 10th and boiled the 12th. We usually start off slow but this year it was full bore right off the bat. I think anything over 1200-1500 ft that's where things got locked up. We had many days that it ran well and it was 34 to 38° which never gets above freezing in the mountains.

[DrTimPerkins]

Does this mean that a spout that is tapped into a area of stem with higher ray count in it will produce sap with higher sugar content then one that is tapped into an area with low ray count?

Trees with more and larger rays tend to produce more sap with higher sugar content. https://mapleresearch.org/pub/vascularrays/


Is the carb converted to sugar at the location of storage in the ray and then passed into the sap or is it passed into the sap and converted somewhere else. thereby making all sap within the tree the same sugar content at a given moment in time of sap flow within the tree?

Stored carbs are in the form of starch grains. These are insoluble, so enzymes must convert some of the starch into sugar (mostly sucrose), which is soluble, in order to mobilize it. There is a profile of sap sugar concentration within the stem, with a general trend from highest in the outermost rings and dropping as you go deeper into the tree. This trend is the same for hydraulic conductivity (sap flow rate) within rings...highest in the outermost rings and dropping as you go deeper. That is the basis for why we've designed the barb-spout. It blocks off less of the outermost rings of wood and allows higher flow rates of slightly sweeter sap.

[DaveB]

Things slowed down a bit, but sap still coming in. SSC dropping slowly. Rain helped some. At about 0.48 gpt syrup now...mostly light syrup with good flavor. Hoping the good freeze on Sat will spur a nice run on Sunday-Wednesday. That'd push us into about the 0.55 gpt range. Won't last too much beyond that based upon the forecast. Overall looking like it will be a fairly average season here production wise, but played out a bit oddly.

I've been monitoring your average 15-day temperature because I wanted to see how it lined up with my observation in SNE with my sap production and how sap production dropped when the average 15-day temperature went above freezing. It sure is remarkable how well it lines up with a slowing of sap production. The average 15-day temperature at Proctor through 4/4 was below 32 and you reported great sap flows. It is now above freezing and you're reporting things slowing down, right on schedule with the 15-day average temperature. I only have my data and anecdotal data to support this but sap may flow when you have freeze/thaw cycles but it seems like it flows best when the 15-day average temperature is below freezing.

[OrangeAgain]

I've been monitoring your average 15-day temperature...

Where do you monitor average temps?

[DaveB]

It's kind of a manual process to get the 15-day average but I've been keeping a daily weather record (high, low, rain/snow) since 1985. It's in Excel now and I calculate each days average temp and average the last 15 days. If You don't have a weather station, you can pull the data from a nearby weather station on weather underground like this one in Albany, VT:

https://www.wunderground.com/dashboard/pws/KVTALBAN4/table/2023-04-7/2023-04-7/monthly

You can copy and paste the table at the bottom and average it from there. Change the month as needed.

Complicated I know but doable.

[TapTapTap]

I have a personal weather station consisting of an Ambient WS2000 that is hooked up to weather underground.

https://www.wunderground.com/dashboard/pws/KVTWILLI29

It's easy to set up and there's no charge for the website.

Ken

[DrTimPerkins]

...sap may flow when you have freeze/thaw cycles but it seems like it flows best when the 15-day average temperature is below freezing.

The sap sure didn't flow very well in January when the 15-day average temperature was below freezing.

If you want to understand the factors involved more deeply, and the types of things we measure to understand sap flow better, I'd suggest https://mapleresearch.org/pub/sapmath/ and https://www.researchgate.net/publication/352209293_Experimental_and_computational_compariso n_of_freeze-thaw_induced_pressure_generation_in_red_and_sugar_ maple

[Sugar Bear]

Trees with more and larger rays tend to produce more sap with higher sugar content. https://mapleresearch.org/pub/vascularrays/



So I infer that this means the bigger older trees tend to flow more and sweeter sap because of more intense ray development. Would that be the primary reason?

But, what I am really asking here is, does a "individual" tree maximize its ray growth at a perimeter/location/side of the stem where sap flows best?

Could or would that possibly be the south side of the stem?

Again, it appears "to me" that ray growth within hardwoods is nowhere near contiguous. But perhaps it averages out evenly around the stem over the length of the stem. And perhaps makes no difference to the tree with regards to the height of the stem the rays propagate themselves. The rays dumping sugar into the sap at 30 feet are just as good as the ones dumping sugar into the sap at 4 feet, I would guess.

[DaveB]

The sap sure didn't flow very well in January when the 15-day average temperature was below freezing.

Not what I meant. I never said that sap flows best when things are frozen. In fact, I acknowledged that sap flows best when you have freeze/thaw cycle. I'm just speculating based on real-world data, including your own, that it flows best in a freeze/thaw cycle while that 15-day average is below freezing. Once once the 15-day average goes above freezing, you and others they report that the sap wasn't flowing as well even in freeze/thaw cycle. Just an observation based on my nearly 40 years of weather observation and sugaring records. It's not something I noted till this year but I've only had three mild years like this so it was hard for the correlation to stand out.

[TapTapTap]

Still going out there in Vermont?

I'm planning to boil later tomorrow if I get a good run today once it warms up. I'm about a quarter full on my raw sap tank from the last couple of days and I think I'll dump it before this upcoming fresh run off a freezing night.

Ken

[sugartree310]

We are still going, we boiled last on Thursday night , we are having a record year as we went by last years record a week ago . Getting close to our 1500 gallon goal. Didn’t run much yesterday maybe only a 1000 gallons of Raw sap since 9pm Thursday night. Planning to boil tomorrow which could be our last .

[sjdoyon]

Still frozen today in the NEK. Most sap runs start early afternoon and finish early evening.
Been a very slow and cold spring. Looks like warmer temps starting tomorrow.

[DrTimPerkins]

Still frozen today in the NEK. Most sap runs start early afternoon and finish early evening.
Been a very slow and cold spring. Looks like warmer temps starting tomorrow.

Very slight trickle in Underhill, but not going to amount to much today. Hoping it thaws a bit quicker tomorrow.

[VTnewguy]

Happy Easter everyone. Boiled last night. Sap still coming in from our cold sugarbush. Going to pull the plug tomorrow afternoon after one last boil. Below average season for us.

[tcross]

had a good run yesterday. and small run saturday. sugar content is down a hair to 1.9%... which i'm still happy with for 2nd week of april. looking like last night is the last freeze in the 10 day forecast. i'm guessing 6-8 days in the 60's and 70's will spell the end. we're not much over 1/2 a crop. most in my area (nek) are reporting the same with a few having a decent year.

[DrTimPerkins]

Nice freeze over the weekend picked things up a bit. Ran a little on Saturday, but better on Sunday. Overall collected about 8,300 gal of sap, but the sugar content is down a bit (vol weighted avg of 1.5 Brix) and it is a bit cloudy, but no off-odor/flavor. One section of the woods is slowing down compared to the other. RO is running now. The crew is planning to boil again tomorrow. Had 460 gal of concentrate in the bulk tank on Friday -- the sap from this weekend will add about 350 gal (at 35 Brix) to that, so about 800 gal of concentrate to boil.

There was a light freeze last night (low of ~30 deg for 5 hrs), so running well already this morning. Not much of the season left. No freezes in the 10-day forecast. Beach weather starting on Thurs with highs of 75, 75, 74, 72 deg F forecast for Thur-Sun with nighttime lows in the upper 40s and lower 50s. Might be doing the last boil in shorts and t-shirts. No peepers yet, but won't be long. Our season will end (middle of this week) pretty close to the normal time.

[sugartree310]

We are done for the year, we tried to boil yesterday and about a hour into it, it stunk the sugarhouse up bad, haven't seen that in a couple years. I should have known the sap stunk some and was cheesy and filtered hard. I even dumped a lot hoping to start with mostly fresh sap, but it was too late. So, we pulled the plug and let the fire go out. We had a great season. we beat last year by nearly 150 gallons. we made .32 of syrup per tap this year best average we have ever had. Time to clean up, pull taps and replenish the wood pile which got hit hard. then back to digging holes and moving dirt. good luck to all those still going may the sap flow.

[billyinvt]

After decent runs on Friday and Saturday, yesterday was pretty underwhelming for us. Cloudy sap + 1% sugar= all done. Never made any really dark syrup this year.
Over 60 gallons finished on 173 gravity only taps is a good outcome. I've already started a list of things to do before next year and I'm headed out to grab a big pile of poplar this afternoon. Never really ends!

[Ultimatetreehugger]

Dr. Tim. Where are you guys production wise? Have you hit .5?

[TapTapTap]

We're done too. Did one last boil off today. Started cleaning up and pulling spouts.

Total for season = 649 gallons on about 1,500 taps (.41 gal/tap).

Ken

[Ultimatetreehugger]

Ken that's awesome! I've only made 770 off 4000...but we will go until sap turns sour.

[tcross]

between the weather and our sugar content, we're calling it quits after tonights boil. sugar content has dropped quick. was 1.9 sunday, 1.75 yesterday and this a.m's sap from last night was 1.4. with no r.o, that's a lot of boiling. the last 6-8 gallons of syrup we've made has a slight caramel/buttery flavor to it. never made syrup that taste like it. currently sitting at 110 gallons of syrup off my 400 taps. down year for sure!

[DrTimPerkins]

Dr. Tim. Where are you guys production wise? Have you hit .5?

Because of the way we do things (collect sap, concentrate to high Brix, store in refrigerated bulk tank and boil only when our two bulk tanks are full), our syrup production always lags behind our sap collection by several days to a week or more. The crew is boiling today (900+ gal of 35 Brix concentrate, so about 360 gal syrup). Should hit the 0.5 gpt of syrup mark by around lunchtime.

Sap flow has really slowed down in the last few days and SSC has dropped off even more (1.5 and 1.3 Brix in our two sections). Given the hot weather yesterday and today, what is forecast for later this week, and the fact that there are no freezes expected here in the next 10-days, we will likely pull the plug after today or maybe tomorrow. No peepers yet though -- will check again this afternoon. Stopping will avoid getting into a sour sap situation (hot weather fermentation in the mainlines causing an off-flavor). We typically try to avoid making any commercial syrup.

That'll put our total production for 2023 somewhere around 0.52 gpt syrup when all is said and done, which is higher than our minimum target (0.5 gpt), but lower than our average 0.58 gpt. That seems to be the situation for colder bushes in this area this season. Assuming this value stands, that means over the past 20 yrs since we revamped our operation, we've had:

- an average production of 0.58 gpt (6.4 lbs syrup)
- 9 yrs (45%) of production over our long-term average of 0.58 gpt syrup
- 9 yrs (45%) of production over our minimum target of 0.5 gpt, but less than 0.58 gpt.
- 2 yrs (10%) where production fell below 0.5 gpt (2012 and 2021)

We've also grown over that time, from 1,549 taps in 2004 to 6,428 this year. Lots of changes.

[upsmapleman]

I would like to learn something. Everyone talks how many lbs per tap they make and wondered how that is figured. I took my total gallons and multiply by 128 and then divide by number of taps, coming up with 50 oz per tap. Is there a easier way to figure.

[Mooneybc]

Shut down this morning as the sap is quite cloudy and at 1% with a funky odor. Ended up with .33gal/tap. The sap content on average was actually much lower this year for me which has bucked the trend for what other producers have seen. Hoping to get to .43gal/tap next year when I go to 5/16 check valve adapters from my 1/4 inch non cv adapters. Congrats on a solid season to all and good luck to those who are still going.

[Mooneybc]

I would like to learn something. Everyone talks how many lbs per tap they make and wondered how that is figured. I took my total gallons and multiply by 128 and then divide by number of taps, coming up with 50 oz per tap. Is there an easier way to figure.

Take your total gallons of syrup divide by the amount of taps you have (that equals gallons of syrup per tap) then multiply by 11 (pounds per gallon of syrup) that should give you a rough guess of lbs/tap

[DrTimPerkins]

I would like to learn something. Everyone talks how many lbs per tap they make and wondered how that is figured. I took my total gallons and multiply by 128 and then divide by number of taps, coming up with 50 oz per tap. Is there a easier way to figure.

To calculate your syrup yield in lbs per tap, start with your total number of gallons of syrup. Multiply by 11 (there are 11 lbs in 1 gallon of syrup). Divide that by your number of taps.

Example below:

50 gal syrup produced x 11 lbs/gal = 550 lbs of syrup.

550 lbs of syrup / 150 taps = 3.67 lbs of syrup/tap

Alternatively, you can take the number of gallons of syrup per tap and multiply by 11. So in the example above:

50 gal syrup / 150 taps = 0.33 gal syrup/tap x 11 lbs/gal = 3.67 lbs/tap

[upsmapleman]

Got it. Thanks!

[DrTimPerkins]

Sap flow really shut down yesterday. We pulled the plug today on collection. The crew concentrated the remaining sap today. They'll boil and boil out tomorrow and will have final numbers then. Not a record year by any means, but not terrible either. We'll exceed (by a small margin) our minimum goal of 0.5 gal/tap.

Mostly just getting final tallies from research projects and crunching numbers now. Some interesting things so far.....but need to verify things before providing any details.

[Andy VT]

Like Proctor, for somewhat opposite and somewhat similar reasons, my little neighborhood operation also has a delay. I stopped collecting and bulk boiling on April 5, but I'm far from being done with having sap concentrate and finished syrup in various stages in refrigerated and frozen storage. A few minutes ago I crossed the 7 gallon mark for hot-packed syrup in its final containers. Could have collected through Monday or Tuesday if life had allowed, but the season had served its purpose for me (goal was to make at least a quart per tap on buckets which I'll greatly exceed, and learn whatever I need to learn to make next year more fun and sustainable!). Big season for us over here!


I decided to make yesterday's rather large sap haul my last for the year over here in Essex Junction, really only because at this point we have to move on to other activities. This coming weekend will have significant flows I think, but we're going to let them spill. I have 5 gallons hot packed in canning jars, but considerably more than 5 gallons-equivalent at various stages of finishing. I'm guessing I'm going to end up with 12 gallons syrup total from my 30 bucket taps even though I'm stopping early. These neighborhood trees with their full crowns and 2-foot diameter really produce! Almost half are norway maples (which I tapped way too early) and didn't produce much, so the sugars must have averaged well over half a gallon per tap to make up for that.

[Andy VT]

P.S., my gut feel is that I gave up somewhere between 1 and 2 gallons of syrup by ending collection April 5 instead of April 11th or so. My early taps (Feb 13) were basically done but my later ones (March 5) were still going.

Here is an interesting thing about buckets and tapping too early. Most of my norway maple taps were among my Feb 13 taps. I didn't specifically keep track but my gut feel is that these amounted to maybe a cup to a pint per tap. A nearby neighbor did one norway tap on March 12 and made over a quart from it.

[DrTimPerkins]

The peepers finally called it late-Tuesday afternoon. We stopped collecting Wednesday morning -- sap was pretty well shut down by that time. The trees were done.

The crew started tapping on January 17 and finished February 10. Staining was hit 0.16% of the time, which is very low. First sap collection for RO processing was February 14 (dumped ~1,000 gal that came in prior to that). First boil was February 23 (due to concentrating and storing sap in a refrigerated bulk tank). Last (small boil and boil out) was today (April 13). The crew boiled 9 times during the season, averaging 365.2 gal of syrup made per boil (the small boil at the end dragged that down, typically during the season it is over 400 gal per boil). Today they finished boiling the concentrate that had come in Monday through Wednesday and boiled out the pans (first time in several years I wore shorts on a boiling day). Final tally is 3,287 gal from 6,428 taps, or 0.51 gal/tap (5.6 lbs per tap). Not the best year (our average is 0.58 gal/tap), but far from the worst. We managed to break 0.5 gal/tap, so all's good. Vacuum was a challenge this year for a couple of reasons.

Best of all -- NO TRUCKING OF SAP THIS YEAR. That was one of my goals before retiring.

Volume weighted sap sugar content was 1.90 Brix...about average. Niter was just a tad heavier than normal. Syrup grade tended light.

Can't imagine that too many producers (in the U.S. anyhow) will make it through the hot weather today and the next several days. If they do, it won't be table-grade syrup.

Now is the time to finish up with last set of measurements, input and crunch the numbers, and start putting together some presentations. Dr. Abby will be presenting at the Leader/H2O and the Lapierre Open Houses in Swanton, VT, in a few weeks (I'll be away). I'll be presenting at the Bascom Open House in early-May.

[berkshires]

Congrats on a good season Dr Tim. I know this is your last season with Proctor, but I hope you aren't washing your hands of maple entirely, and you'll keep an eye on this board as you sail off into the sunset. :)

Cheers!

Gabe

[DrTimPerkins]

Congrats on a good season Dr Tim. I know this is your last season with Proctor, but I hope you aren't washing your hands of maple entirely, and you'll keep an eye on this board as you sail off into the sunset. :)

Likely won't be participating in maple or on this list a great deal after June 30 (a little perhaps) and probably not from Vermont. My wife and I are planning to relocate to the Ann Arbor, MI, area later this summer or early-fall. Our daughter and her family are moving there in June. Son-in-law is a pediatric gastroenterologist and is starting a new position at C.S. Mott Children's Hospital. He's the guy who goes "fishing" for stuff that kids accidentally swallow...or from the other end if something else is wrong. We want to be closer to the grandchildren (two boys 2 1/2 yrs and 9 months).

[spud]

Best of wishes on your upcoming retirement Dr. Tim. You have been a very big help to me over the last 12 years on Trader. I’m sure the grandkids will be excited to have you close by. As you already know, I have bought two more sugar woods and plan to set them up this summer. I still plan to spend most of my winters in Hawaii, but I have a daughter and son in law who want to help with the sugaring. I just became a grandpa, and they might be building a house on one of my maple lots. If all goes as planned I will have about 12,000 taps. Stay in touch

Spud

[DrTimPerkins]

Thanks Spud. Good luck with your new operation and your new grandchild.

[Andy VT]

Made and bottled another 76 fl oz of syrup today. It was borderline between AR and DR, but I'd say tastes more dark, so calling it dark even though it seems _possibly_ a tick lighter than the border but depends how you squint. Put it into 4 pints, a cup, and the rest added to my fridge dark jar. The sap was from my final collection on April 5. It was concentrated via boiling on either the 5th or 6th and been in a cooler with ice since then. This officially crosses us past a quart per tap (30 taps, more than 7.5 gallons). Got more to go if it'll keep. Next I'll do what's left in the cooler (one more batch) and tackle the frozen stuff after that. Then I can finally post something in the "post your results" thread hopefully before we see apple blossoms!

Should have combined the two cooler batches probably, but they were likely to be different grades, and if one went bad, maybe the other wasn't bad, so kept them separate. So far so good.

Like Proctor, for somewhat opposite and somewhat similar reasons, my little neighborhood operation also has a delay. I stopped collecting and bulk boiling on April 5, but I'm far from being done with having sap concentrate and finished syrup in various stages in refrigerated and frozen storage. A few minutes ago I crossed the 7 gallon mark for hot-packed syrup in its final containers. Could have collected through Monday or Tuesday if life had allowed, but the season had served its purpose for me (goal was to make at least a quart per tap on buckets which I'll greatly exceed, and learn whatever I need to learn to make next year more fun and sustainable!). Big season for us over here!

[johnallin]

Thanks Spud. Good luck with your new operation and your new grandchild.

And good luck to you Dr. Tim, wishing you all the best in your retirement and enjoying your family.
Grandkids are really cool, for the second time in my life I had kids who actually believed I could walk on water…
The first kids were their parents…but that was a long time ago, in a far away Galaxy.
Oh, watch out for the UFO’s in Ann Arbor…back in the 60’s I remember they saw some over that way.

[Ultimatetreehugger]

Spud! Welcome back. I look forward to seeing your updates again. Best of luck on your new venture!

[Mooneybc]

Hi everyone! I hope y’all had a great summer and fall! I’m very much looking forward to this season. I’ve seen a few larger (15k tap+) operations already tapping here in Northern VT!

Question for the thread. I have a 2000 gallon polyethylene tank that is leaking around the bulkhead in a consistent manner. Does anyone have any recommendations for food grade sealants that I could use to paint/spray/caulk around the bulkhead? I’ve fiddled around with the bulkhead several times and can’t seem to get it to seal just right.

[spud]

Thanks Treehugger. I see a bunch of people in my area tapping and getting a good amount of sap this last week. I have never tapped in December before. I’ve always been an advocate for early tapping but I think this is a little too early. Typically in my area the real season starts mid March and goes on till around the 20th of April. I want my tap holes to be as fresh as possible for the 6 weeks of peak sap runs. I plan to wait a while on tapping this season. Time will tell if I’m making the best decision.

Spud

[VT_K9]

Last week I put an anchor into a tree and the chips were definitely wet, not running out of the hole but wet. We have been working to replace about 1500' of mainline this year and are almost done. Some was just a remove the old and replace (going from black poly to CDL Blue) and in one are we re-routed the run.
We Just need to finish tying the pipe to the support wire. Then fix a few areas from tree damage and add taps. I hope to be tapped in at the end of January this year.

[spud]

I started tapping early in the week. I have about three more days and then I will be done. Sap was running a bit today into the tank, even though my pump is off.

Spud

[Mooneybc]

I’ve started this week as did my neighbor. Also upgraded to an H20 Electric releaser from a manual one so I’m excited about that. Cheers to all on a good season!

[spud]

I was able to get 1500 gallons over night. Should continue to run till late Saturday. After that, we are back to winter.

Spud

[spud]

Sap ran all night and should continue till 10 pm tonight. I’m up to 5000 gallons of sap this morning. Only testing 1.6% but should start going up with a few more runs.

Spud

[mainebackswoodssyrup]

Good to hear from you spud. How many taps you got in this year?

[spud]

I have 3500 taps in my new woods. There is another 300 I will add for next season.

Spud

[spud]

Sap is still running 100 gph. I should hit 7000 gallons by freeze up tonight. Sugar went down to 1.3%. This two day run was nice, it helped me find and fix most of my leaks.

Spud

[Mooneybc]

I’ve gotten about 2 gallons of sap per tap over this run as well. Testing quite low at 1.2 and 1.0. Looking like we’ll have a nice long freeze over the next 2 weeks. Agree with spud; this was a good opportunity to go hunting for leaks. I was able to tighten up to 28 inches of vacuum over this run.

[VT_K9]

Still working on getting the taps in. Work was very busy last week, and I was not able to get free to work in the woods until well after dark. CDL was down today to install the pump control for the vacuum pump. It's a neat system and I look forward to not having to keep watch on temps and going to the sugarhouse at late hours to turn off the vacuum. The system can also reduce vacuum to levels to decrease ice issues at lower temps. We have a few deer and squirrel chews which were missed in December when new taps were put on or happened since then.

Mike

[Mooneybc]

Turning off the pump for the next two weeks. Back to bitter winter

[spud]

Some sap was dripping into the tank this afternoon but not enough for me to turn the pump on. I was able to wash my tank today and have it ready for the next run.

Spud

[spud]

I got about 1000 gallons yesterday. Sap ran a little all night. Sugar has gone up to 1.7%.

Spud

[Mooneybc]

A little over 1 gal of sap/tap at 1.5%

[Andy VT]

I think I'm going to tap for buckets this coming Monday or Tuesday, February 26 or 27. I was aiming for March 1, now adjusting slightly due to really warm temperatures in the 10 day forecast. However, I'm going to hold off maybe a week after that for the norway maples. My neighbor tapped norway about a week later than me last year and got 4 times the yield. I think the norways may heal faster.

Right now it feels like its just going to shoot up to 70 degrees any moment, but we really don't know, do we?

[Mooneybc]

Is anyone else anxious after looking at the 10 day forecast that we are looking at a very early budding of the trees?

[spud]

I’m hoping after the next couple of weeks, we will have winter again for a while. It’s still very early. My sap normally runs till April 20th or close to it. I’m thinking it’s going to be a great year.

Spud

[tjanson]

Tapped our ~45 trees in Underhill yesterday. Was running a bit at ~30 deg and sunny.

[spud]

Where in Underhill are you from? I grew up on English Settlement Road, on the valley side.

Spud

[Mooneybc]

Surprised today- no run at all. It hit 43 degrees but the trees didn’t let go. Should be a big run tomorrow and Wednesday.

[Andy VT]

Yikes, the one big silver maple we tap has buds opening a bit. That's one full month earlier than last year for the same tree. So, we'll skip that tree this year. 5 tapped so far. I was going to tap the norways a week or so after the rest but once I saw buds on a silver, we're going for everything. Tapping the remainder starting in the morning. Hope the coming warm spell is short! It will freeze slightly tonight.

[spud]

I never turned the pump on yesterday. The wind is blowing this morning but I will be turning the pump on at 6:30. With the kids being off from school this week, we are going to chase leaks later today. Trying to get tight before asap.

Spud

[tjanson]

Spud, I'm over on the other side on the Northern end of Rt 15. In the summer I do occasionally take the "shortcut" over to Underhill Center via Poker Hill and English Settlement.

Didn't have much in the tank yesterday at 5pm, but it was running well at that point and I had full vacuum at the top of my natural vac lines.

[spud]

Chasing leaks today. Got vacuum to 26 at the releaser. I have one more section to check but it will have to wait till tomorrow. Sap is running 275 gph.

Spud

[tjanson]

We ended up with 1.6 gpt from the past 24 hrs.

[Mooneybc]

Also chased leaks today and got vacuum to 28.5. However, it was not a great run. About 1gpt sap maybe a bit under which is disappointing.

[spud]

Sap slowed down last night, but it’s still running at 150 gph. I got 2500 gallons yesterday from 3450 taps. Not a great run but things are going well. Should run till about 9-10 tonight. Sap is testing at just 1.5%.

Spud

[tcross]

i got about 1/2 a gallon per tap yesterday. really didn't start running much till noon-1:00. haven't tested the sugar yet, but last run was 1.5%... hopefully it's better than that! should be interesting boiling in 30-40 mph winds this evening! got the vacuum up to 27 at the releaser and in the woods. got a small leak somewhere in the releaser connections to fix once this run stops. hopefully that'll get me back up to 28 where i like to be!

[Mooneybc]

Since yesterday when it started to flow I got 1.8gpt at 1.3%.

[spud]

In the last two days I got 1.4 gpt with 1.5%. Hoping Saturday is the start of something big. I’m only at 4 gpt this season.

Spud

[tjanson]

I'm at 2.7 gpt for the past 2 days. Sap still looking nice and clear in the tank after all that warmth. I'm feeling good about it keeping until we can boil it all this weekend. No snow around in the yard this year to pile around the tank.

[spud]

Pump has been on all day but I got near no sap. I was hoping I could get 1000 gallons or so. I’m hoping tomorrow will be a gusher.

Spud

[hogisland42]

Glad it wasnt just me

[VT_K9]

it was not a great flow day for us either. Spent time at Town Meeting and had some minor issues with vacuum to sort out. Pulling 27.3" now. Finally, all tapped in and ready to collect and prep the RO.

[Mooneybc]

That wind storm a few days ago took out some trees so I was chasing leaks today. I got vacuum up to 29 inches (I think). I have two gauges and they both say 29.9, so I’m not sure what is up with that?

Anyways it was not a day of running sap for me either. I also spotted 4 trees in my backyard with buds on them already. I am about 900ft in elevation.

[spud]

I’m hoping I don’t have limbs down in my woods. My vacuum is 28 at the releaser but I know parts of the woods is just thawing out. My sap is running 125 gph and testing at 1.8% now. I have about 1200 gallons in the tank. It should pick up in the next few hours.

Spud

[Mooneybc]

1.2gpt today at 1.6%. We still haven’t had that big run yet.

[spud]

.85 gpt today. Saps still running about 125 gph. Sap testing at 1.8%. Tomorrow should bring about the same.

Spud

[DrTimPerkins]

Kind of a slow thaw and slow, steady sap run. Trees were really cold-soaked after the low temperatures we had, so they're taking their time thawing out.

[DrTimPerkins]

...I also spotted 4 trees in my backyard with buds on them already.

Do you mean you can see that the trees have buds or that the buds are swollen/opening? Are these sugar maple or red maple?

Trees always have buds (unless they're dead). That's not a problem. Also, red maples tend to flower early, but flower buds don't impact buddy off-flavors.

I've only seen sugar maple break bud early (and then suffer frost damage) twice in the 40+ yrs I've been studying them...but then again...it's been a really hot winter/spring so far, so who knows?

[spud]

Got another 3000 gallons today but the sugar dropped to 1.5%. Looks like we will start having freezing nights starting Wednesday night. It looks like I’m getting a little less per tap due to some smaller trees. I’m sure this also is why my sugar is a bit low compared to others.

Spud

[tcross]

we're certainly not getting any great runs here, but the sugar content is staying strong. even without any freezes the past few days, we're still at 2-2.25%. had frozen over puddles in the driveway this a.m, hopefully that'll help keep the flow going. if the forecast is correct, it's looking like great sap running weather for a while, starting thursday/friday.

[Mooneybc]

Over the last 2 days it ran about 1.75gpt at 1.3%

[Mooneybc]

Do you mean you can see that the trees have buds or that the buds are swollen/opening? Are these sugar maple or red maple?

The reds are definitely swollen and opening. The sugars are swelling.I tried inserting pictures of each but the website is telling me the upload is failing. If I can figure out how to post the pictures I will do so.

[spud]

In the last 24 hours I have dropped to .65 gpt and sugar is 1.4%. I’m looking forward to the upcoming freezing nights.

Spud

[tcross]

bout the same as spud here. bout .5 gpt the last couple days, but my sugar content is still 2%... so the pump is still running. i'm not sure if i've ever ran my bb4 dairy vacuum pump for 6 days straight. She's gonna need an oil change come tomorrow evening when it freezes up again! should have some good runs by the weekend.

[Mooneybc]

Last 36 hours was 1.15gpt at 1.1%. I’m hoping the upcoming cooling temps will bring the sugar up a bit for me.

[DrTimPerkins]

Spud posted....In the last 24 hours I have dropped to .65 gpt and sugar is 1.4%. I’m looking forward to the upcoming freezing nights.


Last 36 hours was 1.15gpt at 1.1%. I’m hoping the upcoming cooling temps will bring the sugar up a bit for me.

On extended thaws and sap runs, the bulk flow of sap transitions from coming down from above the taphole over to sap being pulled upward from below the taphole. When this happens, assuming your vacuum is good enough, water is pulled up from the soil into the roots and up the stem and out the taphole. This dilutes any sugar that is present in the wood. The result is that the sap flow becomes fairly constant, but the sap sugar content will steadily drop until there is a refreeze and recharge of the stem with moisture. Sap sugar content (and sap flow rates) will go up again when the trees subsequently thaw.

[spud]

I’m close to 2000 gallons for the day. I should be froze up by 10 pm tonight. Tomorrow is full sun and 45 degrees. Should be real good.

Spud

[spud]

Woke up to 25 degrees this morning. The lawn is white with frost. Full sun today and 45 degrees. Let’s all hope for a gusher and higher sugar. I feel I’m at 1/3 of a crop so far. Lots of time left. Good luck everyone.

Spud

[johnallin]

On extended thaws and sap runs, the bulk flow of sap transitions from coming down from above the taphole over to sap being pulled upward from below the taphole. When this happens, assuming your vacuum is good enough, water is pulled up from the soil into the roots and up the stem and out the taphole. This dilutes any sugar that is present in the wood. The result is that the sap flow becomes fairly constant, but the sap sugar content will steadily drop until there is a refreeze and recharge of the stem with moisture. Sap sugar content (and sap flow rates) will go up again when the trees subsequently thaw.

So it is possible to pull mostly water up out of the ground. That's really interesting and kind of what I suspected. I swear some of my trees look shorter now :o
Up until Sunday; I had my vac running for 10 days straight and got sap - even in 60 deg temps.
The sugar on the last weekend was below 1% and it sat for a day in +70 degrees...it was too cloudy and I dumped it.
I'm still in and hoping the 48 hr freeze/thaw cycle we have coming will offer up one last boil. Good luck to all.

[Andy VT]

28 bucket taps here. All 5/16" sap-meister including my 3 hanging buckets (the other 25 are tubes to pails). Tapped most 2/27 but a few 2/26 and 3/1. Currently stand at 2.7 gallons sap per tap for the season. Don't know the sugar content but these suburban trees are big with full crowns. Also finally made my first 2024 syrup batch yesterday, about a gallon on the extreme light end of the Amber (rich) spectrum. Sailed right through 3 prefilters and the orlon cone. 26 degrees this morning at 6AM, the first freeze of March here. Hoping that extends things a bit.

[Andy VT]

Note: I did dump a few gallons (probably 5 at the most) of very yellow "rain" sap the other day, plus a half gallon of chipmunk-drown sap. Not counting any of that!

[spud]

Sap is running 490 gph. Sugar is going up. Going to be a good day.

Spud

[Ultimatetreehugger]

Sap has been running 750gph off 3750 taps since 1pm. The releaser hasn't stopped pumping since 1. I think it's time to upgrade the pump?

Sugar content jumped from 1.5 to1.9.

[Mooneybc]

Closing in on 2gpt for the day. I haven’t tested sugar today but I will tomorrow. At this time the majority of my sugars have swelling buds

[Andy VT]

That's a mind boggling one-day flow per tap to a bucketeer! Wow!

[Andy VT]

(just realized this was a somewhat dumb thing to say... I've definitely seen 2 gallons per tap before with buckets... but not this year yet... )

[spud]

Closing in on 2gpt for the day. I haven’t tested sugar today but I will tomorrow. At this time the majority of my sugars have swelling buds

That’s great production for the day. Are your trees large? Sap ran all night but it was slow. I got 800 gallons overnight. Sap is now running about 100 gph but should continue into the night before it freezes up.

Spud

[Mooneybc]

It’s actually a fairly young bush with smaller trees. Last night finished at 1.85gpt at 1.1%. It slowed up big time today.

[Andy VT]

Now 3.8 gallons sap per tap for the season to date. Some potential freezes in the 10 day forecast.

[spud]

Sap ran a bit last night and should run until 7 pm tonight. My sugar is still only 1.3%. I’m at 10 gpt for the season right now. The weather in my area looks very good for the rest of the month. I’m still hoping we go a week or more in April. Hoping for 70,000-80,000 total gallons for the season. Not much I can do about the low sugar. We still have a lot of time to get a lot of sap.

Spud

[Mooneybc]

Spud, I appreciate your optimism! What elevation are you at?

[spud]

Spud, I appreciate your optimism! What elevation are you at?

My pump house is at 1100 feet and the upper woods is 1250. Sap is still running a bit today. Most years I go till the 20th of April. Not sure if it will last that long this year. What is your elevation?

Spud

[Mooneybc]

I’m at 900 feet

[tcross]

had some good flows friday through sunday. sugar content dropped a tad to 1.9%. hopefully the freeze today will bump it back up. had a good old fashion march snow storm saturday evening into yesterday. fat, heavy snow!
must have had some good wind because all my tin blew off my wood piles. we've made over half of what we did last year already. looking like another decent week this week and into the weekend.

[spud]

I turned the pump on at noon today. I’m hoping I will get a 3-4 hour gusher starting at about 2. Every drop counts.

Spud

[spud]

My woods is just starting to freeze up. I got 850 gallons in 7 hours. Sap is only testing at 1.3%. This is not what I hoped for. It appears my sugar is going to be very low for the rest of the season. The neighbors around me are having the same low sugar. I can only hope for a very high gpt this season, to make up for the low sugar.

Spud

[Andy VT]

My bucket operation, mainly tapped on 2/27, now stands at 4.3 gallons sap per tap from mid-morning collection. Spot checking a few buckets just now I'm guessing I'm at or near 5 with what's in the buckets now not yet collected. It's going to be a good freeze tonight and a warm day tomorrow and some good sugaring weather in the 10-day forecast, fingers crossed! My elevation is about 300' I think! You guys have me wondering about my sugar content... I need to break down and get a sap hydrometer anyway to enter the RO world... maybe I'll pick one up.

[spud]

Sap is running 250 gph and climbing. Sugar is still 1.3%

Spud

[tcross]

looking like another disappointing run today. got too cold here last night it think. woke up to 21 degrees... same the day before. this happened to me all last year, which caused a horrible year. next hand full of days are looking a little more promising. fingers crossed!

[spud]

looking like another disappointing run today. got too cold here last night it think. woke up to 21 degrees... same the day before. this happened to me all last year, which caused a horrible year. next hand full of days are looking a little more promising. fingers crossed!

When does your season normally end? Are you facing North?

Spud

[Andy VT]

Now 5.7 gallons sap per tap for the season to date. Goal is 10 gallons (though last year was more like 14). The last 36 hours or so was definitely my biggest run yet at about 1.4 gallons per tap. Would easily be 2 per tap if I were counting only the sugar maples and not the norway maples. Now if the sap could just go ahead and not go bad between now and Friday when I can boil next.... that'd be great... (I think it'll be OK but that's always a stressor, isn't it?)

[spud]

I got 1.47 gpt since yesterday at 10:00 am. Sap ran all night at 170 gph. House temp is 32 and I know part of my woods froze last night. Should be another big day.

Spud

[Mooneybc]

1.5 gpt yesterday but at 1.1%.

[tcross]

Hey Spud,
our season normally ends 2nd week of april. i'm in Derby vt, north Facing at about 1,200 feet. half my bush is in a swampy valley that stays cold. the sap ran very hard for me between 4 and 7 p.m yesterday. sap testing 2.2. had 29 on the thermometer this a.m. Should be a good day today!

[tjanson]

Big run yesterday, roughly 2 gpt. My neighbor had one tree fill an old style bucket twice in 24 hours. What is that, 4-5 gpt?!

[spud]

I got 3000 gallons so far today. Sap still testing 1.3%. I’m not getting rich but I’m having fun 😁. Sap should run all night and tomorrow.

Spud

[Mooneybc]

Last 24hours was another 1.25gpt at 1.1%. Sap is getting stinky and cloudy.

[spud]

I got 2000 gallons today. Tested 1.2%. Should run all night.

Spud

[Mooneybc]

From last night to now I got 0.5gpt at 1.0%. I think this might be the end. My next freeze isn’t until Monday. So we shall see either way.

[spud]

It started to flurry for a few minutes this morning at 5am. Sap ran all night and I have 1100 gallons in the tank. With next weeks five day freeze up we should be good into April. Keep it going.

Spud

[PARKER MAPLE]

Hey Guys
So happy to be back on here and visiting. I started this thread many many years ago. And have lost track over the year. Started to read on it here and there this year and I’m so glad it’s still up and going
Sounds like everyone is up and running. With some big differences in the seasons given the areas you all are in.

Good luck to everyone
Looks like after next weeks freeze here we should go another week or so.
Our sap has been running very very strong here where we are. Some very very good sugar to start and now is more back to normal where it runs typically. We have 12 more barrel to fill and we will be at a full crop. I hope it holds on. The 7-8000 gallons runs have really help us out here in early March to late Feb.

PARKER MAPLE

[spud]

Welcome back Parker Maple. Your thread lives on. I remember when you started the thread. I’m glad you’re having a great season.

Spud

[spud]

Sap ran all night and I woke up to 2000 gallons in the tank. Sugar is 1.2% but sap is very clear. Freeze up starts tonight and should recharge the trees.

Spud

[PARKER MAPLE]

We too had a good run 1900 + 950 over night
Just boiled in and made around 60
Grade has lightened nicely

Keep it rolling

[spud]

Saps been running 200 gph most of the day. Should run till midnight.

Hey Parker doe you ever hear from Thad, Randy, Flat Lander or General? Wondering if they’re still part of Maple Trader?

Spud

[Mooneybc]

2 Day run of 2.15gpt at 1.0%. Good freeze for the next week or so hopefully recharges the trees for one last big run.

[PARKER MAPLE]

I see Thad last spring. I purchased a sawmill from him.
I haven’t heard from anyone else. Disappeared like I didn’t for a bit I guess 😂

[johnallin]

Been following your thread…we all started about the same time 2009 +/-

It’s real good to see some “old familiar faces” on MT.

Sounds like you guys are having a much better season than we did here in Ohio.
All we need now is for Haynes to chime in ��

[spud]

Haynes was a funny guy. I’m not sure where he went. Saps still running at 8 pm but I expect it to freeze up real soon. I’m still hoping to go till mid April. Time will tell.

Spud

[spud]

I just looked at the 30 day forecast for my area. After this 5 day cold spell, we still will have 5 more freezing nights all the way to April 5th. If that’s the case, I should get sap to about April 10th before it dies out. How are your guys doing in mid Vermont and lower? Are you done?

Spud

[DrTimPerkins]

All we need now is for Haynes to chime in ��

You'd know for sure if he did. He was one of those characters that was hard to miss.

[Andy VT]

Update on my bucket operation over here.
I last collected on Friday 3/15 and had it all boiled at least to a concentrate by Saturday. Sap was quite cloudy. The earlier stuff which I think I collected Wednesday night made good syrup that was on the dark end of the "Amber-Rich" spectrum and the later stuff is ready for kitchen finishing, suspect it'll be "dark robust" if it in fact is good. Last night I visited all buckets and dumped whatever sap was in them (there was some) and swapped out some of the buckets for clean ones, rinsed others, and others looked OK and I kept them in place. We haven't had a freeze in quite a few days. Most buckets are former bakery frosting pails, 5 gallon size. This is all in prep for the coming run I think we'll see this week with several freezes in the forecast.

[johnallin]

You'd know for sure if he did. He was one of those characters that was hard to miss.

Yes he was, and had a special talent for mixing up the English language, kind of a Yogi Berra way of expressing himself.

[Andy VT]

Forgot the sap collection totals in my last post.
I replenish my feed pan with a 2-gallon pail. I track sap yield by tallying this bucket.
If you assume I'm filling my tallying bucket to 1.8 gallons, I'm at:
6.1 gallons sap per tap so far. If 1.9 gallons:
6.4 gallons per tap so far.

[spud]

Woke up to about 6 inches of snow this morning. As much as I hate snow, this should really help to keep the season going.

Spud

[PARKER MAPLE]

Still going down here in south central Vt. Making very nice amber rich and it’s going through the press well. Sap ran yesterday a little more then 1g per tap at 1.4 %. This week will be a slow week for us as we are in the higher elevation and very susceptible to the wind. Lots of time spent in the woods. Yesterday sap ran all day and hit 150gph a couple times. But mostly was just a smooth steady pace

[Andy VT]

I've added up some numbers for my city bucket operation.
.16 gallons syrup per tap so far. Goal of .25, though last year was something like .37
All tastes good. The lightest was amber, just shy of delicate. The darkest was in the mid-range of dark robust (this was from the end of that last long no-freeze period).
Sap so far is 6.78 gallons per tap.
So sap to syrup ratio is 43:1, and that's with some of that sap still partially concentrated in the evaporator, so I might be pretty close to 40:1 (these are big yard sugar maples and some yard norways.)
However, some trees were showing signs of drying up on that last run before this hard freeze.
This makes me think 2/27 may have been too early for bucket tapping, even with the crazy warm February.
But we'll see.
Next run Sunday.
I've been going to at least what the Murphy cup tells me, or a smidge more. The murphy cup is set up for 66.9 equivalent; the bare minimum in Vermont but seems to be the goalpost in most other places. So I try to get just barely beyond it and stop.

[spud]

Sounds like you’re doing well and having fun Andy. Have you considered reaming your tap holes for the upcoming runs? Do you plan to expand your tap count in the future?

Spud

[DrTimPerkins]

Have you considered reaming your tap holes for the upcoming runs?

Reaming is not a recommended practice due to the fact it greatly increases the size of the internal wound.

[Andy VT]

I am indeed having a lot of fun! This city sugaring thing is a fun twist on the hobby that I am enjoying enough to stave off any big sugarbush purchases so far, haha! I do see potential for up to 200 taps in very close proximity. It would have to be buckets; lines just don't work in the city! But if 3 neighbors got into it... 200 buckets could be quite manageable. 28 buckets big enough to last half a week (5 gallons per tap on the productive ones) have been very easy by myself. Love the productivity of these big old full-crown city trees, which at least partly makes up for the inefficiencies of buckets. Also love the captive customers. They love that this sugaring thing is happening in the neighborhood. We aren't and won't actually make money but selling to neighbors is part of the fun of it too, for them and us.

I did decide I won't redrill any tapholes after watching Dr Abby's presentation last year or so. I do wish I added more taps around March 5 or March 10 to compare notes with the earlier ones. But I've decided the ship has sailed on drilling more holes this late. Maybe I'd do it in the woods but not on other people's nice yard trees, although they'd probably let me. I don't have any woods.

But I'm taking a lot of notes on my results and all of yours too! Really having a blast with it.

[220 maple]

Dr. Tim,
Reaming a tap hole won’t work, maybe one good run! My father would pull the spile and move over an inch and drill a new hole, we had a nine week season one time with that practice! That is a wrong practice also! I would say to him he shouldn’t move spiles, his standard line I’m not going to be here much longer! So it was his trees as long he was the owner, as soon as they became mine, I quit reaming holes and never moved a spile! I did start bumping the tap hole to get extended production, had to participate in a panel discussion about what I was doing by bumping a hole at the the Southern Maple Symposium, Dr. Tim was there, walked up to me and said bumping a tap hole was a new term to him! I forced Proctor to get money to research what I was doing, good or bad. Research shows it’s not a good idea, creates a big stain by bumping, last two seasons it was a waste of time to bump a hole, therefore my trees never got messed with! If I would bump a hole it doesn’t matter, my son has zero interest in drilling a hole in a tree, so after I’m done the trees will happily celebrate that they won’t be messed with again! I have a picture somewhere of a tap hole almost healed on May 3rd, I had pulled that spile first week of March that year! Does your trees close tap holes like that? I’ve heard they don’t heal that quickly? Our growing season is much longer. I heard that there was some holes bumped in WV, also heard they have made 12 barrels extra so far? And will be making more this week because of freezing weather. Dr. Tim bumping is bad, but the question I’ve asked is bumping that bad compared to pulling a spile and drilling a new hole? I quess I’m like father by doing that to a tree!! Why it won’t matter in the future is climate change is going to march up through the maple belt in the next 25 years and bring you to your knees! Sorry to be Sugar maker bearer of bad news, we’re dealing with it now! So it’s coming your way! Sorry
Mark220maple
Mark220maple

[Andy VT]

Tapping another hole in the same tree in the same season is definitely worse than renewing the same hole! It's basically borrowing from next year to boost this year. Which could be OK if you at some point plan to take a year or years off. But I'm glad your Dad made maple syrup and that you do too!
(P.S., I don't think this was misinterpreted but just in case; when I say I wish I did some more later taps, I meant in trees that have not yet been tapped)

[spud]

Sap is running 275 gph since about noon. Tomorrow should be a big day.

Spud

[spud]

Sap ran till about 10:00 pm last night. I got 3000 gallons yesterday and still testing 1.2%. We had a good hard freeze last night. Today should be a gusher, and continue for three days.

Spud

[tcross]

took too long for the trees up here to thaw out yesterday. got less than 1/2 gpt. hopefully today is a better day. it's starting off 18 degrees warmer so there's hope.

[Andy VT]

About .6gpt here between Sunday (my 2 latest southern taps ran, tapped March 1 I think) and of course especially Monday (yesterday). Was definitely expecting more. If today is also light I'll be fully convinced I tapped too early and my taps have healed up too much.
But I'm just over 7gpt for sap now for the season. Maybe I'll still make 10, teaspoon by teaspoon!

[Mooneybc]

It did not run as hard for me yesterday either. About .5gpt. Hopefully today and the next few days it kicks up.

[DrTimPerkins]

Dr. Tim,
Reaming a tap hole won’t work, maybe one good run! My father would pull the spile and move over an inch and drill a new hole, we had a nine week season one time with that practice! That is a wrong practice also! ...

The sap yield gained from reaming, freshening, bumping, drilling deeper, drilling a 2nd hole, etc. are highly variable. Some years you may get a reasonable amount of additional sap. Some years you may get very little. What we do know however is that doing this makes a MUCH larger wound, often more than twice the volume of the original wound. We did an experiment where we tried to drill just an inch or two above the initial taphole, thinking it would remain within the initial wound. This still resulted in a much larger wound volume.

Regardless of that...those practices are not banned (except perhaps by organic certifying agencies). Your trees = your decision. But better to make an informed decision than an uninformed decision. We don't tell people they can't do it....but it is important to have the research so that folks understand the consequences of that and factor those in before doing it. Perhaps it is a practice that shouldn't be used regularly, but rather be reserved for otherwise disatrous seasons.

Mark...you should be happy to know that the term "bumping" entered the lexicology of maple. It is referred to on page 6-26 of the 3rd edition of the new maple manual. Congratulations :lol:

[DrTimPerkins]

It did not run as hard for me yesterday either. About .5gpt. Hopefully today and the next few days it kicks up.

Trees were very "cold-soaked." Takes some time for a big object (like a tree) to thaw out after being down in the teens or colder for an extended period. Air temperature might seem warm enough for the sap to run, but tree temperature is still really cold and the tree is frozen solid. They'll thaw out after a day or two of warm weather.

[spud]

Sap has run very well all day. I got 6000 gallons in the last two days. My sugar went up to 1.4% so I’m making big money now😁. Weather looks outstanding for the next two weeks. I hope to get another 30,000 gallons🤞🤞🙏.

Spud

[Andy VT]

OK, now we're getting somewhere! I'm now at 8.6 gallons sap per tap for the season to date. Two southerly taps have stopped flowing completely; haven't seen a drop since the deep freeze. The other 26 running well. The norways running better than all season, though still behind the sugars. If this is the end, at least I can call it a "below average" season and not a "really bad" season. And it may well not be over.

Thanks for the contributions to this thread everyone! Dr Tim, thanks for weighing in, I just learned more good stuff, especially the temperature effect. So it totally makes sense that Monday was a little light even though it got quite warm and sunny.

[spud]

Sap is running at 150 gph as of 5 am. Rain storm on its way but sap will continue to run. Looks like I’m getting 1+ gpt each day now. Pump is running at 27 now, but during the day if the sun comes out, it goes down to about 25. It’s a combination of tree gas and I have a 3hp pump running 3400 taps.

Spud

[tcross]

good sap run yesterday. not too sure how much i got, but when i started boiling last night it was coming in as fast as i could boil it off. based off syrup totals and sap sugar content i'd say around 1.5 gpt. Nitre has turned from the sludge type, to the big flakey type that sticks to the pan. 10 day forecast looks like perfect sap flow weather up this way.

[Mooneybc]

Thanks Dr. Tim for the info on cold-soaked trees. Very interesting. Received about 1.25gpt at 1.1% over the last few days.

[ecp]

I see the GPT mentioned a lot so I'm going to ask the question. Are you all putting flow meters on your releasers? Guess that leads into the next questions what is everyone using for flow meters on their releasers. Its good data but in my case looking in tanks is just so hard to tell because its being pumped around and judging what's in the tank is at best a guess. My sap spiked up to 2.4 today (yes seems odd to me) actual flows unknown.

[spud]

I bought a FloMec from FW Webb. About four years ago it was around $375-400. Sap is running at 160 GPH today. I was able to get the vacuum back up to 27.5 inches. Sap is still as clear as water and testing 1.3%.

Spud

[tjanson]

I see the GPT mentioned a lot so I'm going to ask the question. Are you all putting flow meters on your releasers?

I just am measuring the depth in my tank and calculating gallons per tap for each run. I made a chart that gives gallons of sap for every inch of depth. Round bottom CDL tank, so the math is fun.

Good run(s) monday through yesterday for me in underhill. Hopefully the ice I left in the tank from last week helps keep the sap good until Saturday.

[Andy VT]

Also thanks Dr Tim for the perspective on the tapping and bumping theories. No laws against it, and not even an absolute right or wrong. Just data and personal choice. Speaking of that topic, I've sometimes thought that for a bucket operation, which is what I'll have for the foreseeable future, it might make sense to double tap half of the trees one year, and double tap the other half of the trees the opposite year, so that you only have to visit half the trees each year for theoretically the same yield and same sustainability. Perhaps even better sustainability due to less soil compaction. Not sure if I'll ever have reason to test this theory. I have a suspicion that 20th century bucket operations had this in mind when we see old pictures of what appears to be overtapping. They might not have been quite as overtapped as we assume from a picture.

[Andy VT]

9.5 gallons per tap for the season. Very clear sap. But it must keep until Friday if it is to become good syrup. Fingers crossed!
10 gallons is in sight now!

[spud]

Woke up to another 2500 gallons in the tank. Sap running 135 gph but should increase in a few hours when the sun comes up. Going for two more weeks.

Spud

[ecp]

Woke up to another 2500 gallons in the tank. Sap running 135 gph but should increase in a few hours when the sun comes up. Going for two more weeks.

Spud Good deal. The weather certainly does look promising for 2 weeks depending on location.

[Mooneybc]

“I see the GPT mentioned a lot so I'm going to ask the question. Are you all putting flow meters on your releasers? Guess that leads into the next questions what is everyone using for flow meters on their releasers.”

I use the markings on my poly tank to eye ball how much is in there. I do not have a flow meter but have thought about getting one for my pool pump I use as my transfer pump. They are a steep investment that doesn’t add monetary value to production.

[tcross]

got about .8 gpt yesterday. sap still testing 2%. I don't have an R.O.... with some of the sugar content some of you guys are, unfortunately, getting i think i would have thrown in the towel by now! looking like a small freeze here tonight, then good freeze thaw cycles for the next week or so. i have to spend some time after work moving a few more cord of wood into the sugarhouse.

[DrTimPerkins]

…it might make sense to double tap half of the trees one year, and double tap the other half of the trees the opposite year, so that you only have to visit half the trees each year for theoretically the same yield and same sustainability.

Not likely to be advantageous. On buckets you might get about double the sap with two taps on a LARGE tree. Typically you’ll get somewhat less than double and well under double for trees under 18” dbh. On vacuum you will definitely not get double the amount of sap from a second taphole. In many cases you’ll get about the same from two tapholes cumulatively as from one taphole, or maybe somewhat more if trees are bigger. Depends on the size of the tree and the vacuum level used.

[tjanson]

got about .8 gpt yesterday. sap still testing 2%. I don't have an R.O.... with some of the sugar content some of you guys are, unfortunately, getting i think i would have thrown in the towel by now! looking like a small freeze here tonight, then good freeze thaw cycles for the next week or so. i have to spend some time after work moving a few more cord of wood into the sugarhouse.

No RO either, I got 180 gallons of 1.2%. I am questioning how much longer we want to go as we are almost out of the pine sugaring wood and might be getting into the "valuable" hardwood firewood stores soon. On our 2x4 it'll be alot of firewood and time for 3-4 gallons syrup.

[Aaron Stack]

On another topic, does it look like sap will be running still the week of April 8th?

Taking a trip to Northern VT to view the eclipse and was hoping to stop by a few sugarhouses on Sunday the 7th and Tuesday the 9th. Staying in Stow and would love to visit anyone willing.

[spud]

I think sap will be running the weekend of the 13th and possibly beyond. We have freezings nights for the next 10 days with snow towards the end of next week. Today the sap should start running hard at 10-noon. Let’s hope the sugar goes up a bit. Good luck everyone.

Spud

[Mooneybc]

Ran slightly today. Got roughly .4gpt in the last 24 hours at 1.0%

[spud]

Yesterday I got 2000 gallons at 1.1%. Weather looks real good for the next ten days. I’m hearing some woods are drying up. A lot of people start tapping the day after Christmas. I hope to go for another two weeks.

Spud

[Mooneybc]

I finished tapping on 2/2. My sap is not very clear, stinky (comparatively) and slimy. Testing consistently at 1.1/1.0 for the last week or so. I’m not sure if there will be much more production for my woods even with the good weather. I’ll report out either way. Happy Easter to all!

[spud]

Happy Easter everyone. I was able to get another 2000 gallons yesterday and testing at 1.1%. Todays run should start a bit earlier and last longer then yesterday. Sap quality is very good. The 10 day forecast is great, so we should be able to go two full weeks into April.

Spud

[Andy VT]

I made it to a quart of syrup per tap for our city bucket operation! The final batch was a little earthy and/or butterscotchy... color in the lower half of the "dark robust" range. Think that's saleable? I think I could go farther with some freezes and snow in the forecast but life is happening and I decided I'll quit there. All sap (that I decided to boil) has been processed into syrup, now just need to bottle, clean up, distribute, and "market". I think it turned out to be a good season! I'll post a more thorough summary at some point. Happy Easter!

[spud]

Sap is running real good today. I should get a gallon a tap today. It’s been running 400gph.

Spud

[spud]

I got 3200 gallons yesterday. The woods did not completely freeze up last night. A trickle of sap ran on the south/east side. Should have a good day today. Sap still testing just 1.1 gpt. I’m up to 65,000 gallons on 3400 taps. Hoping for more.

Spud

[tcross]

had our longest boil of the year yesterday. a good 9 hours. had sap from friday/ saturday's run to boil. that combined with a very strong run yesterday kept us busy all day. nitre is becoming a real PITA. sap testing 1.8%. the 10 day looks real good. We're getting a new GSP puppy Friday. sure hope he likes the sugar house, cuz it looks like he's going to be spending some time in there with me over the weekend!

[Mooneybc]

Didn’t get any sap today. When I got home I had no vacuum at my releaser. The pump was still on but was acting like the moisture trap had set off. But the trap was not set off from what I could tell. I turned the pump off, disconnected at the slip connect, reconnected, turned it back on and got instant vacuum. In two hours since getting vacuum back I got about .25gpt.

[spud]

Sorry you lost vacuum for part of the day. It’s good you got some sap though. Sap slowed down for me yesterday. I got about 1500 gallons in all. Woke up this morning to 24 degrees. Should have a very good run today and then all night. Weather man is saying I could get up to 14 inches of snow tomorrow. This will recharge the trees and give us another week or better. Good luck everyone.

Spud

[DrTimPerkins]

In case anyone missed the big story yesterday...

https://www.uvm.edu/news/story/uvm-tapped-house-nations-strategic-maple-syrup-reserve

[DaveB]

In case anyone missed the big story yesterday...

https://www.uvm.edu/news/story/uvm-tapped-house-nations-strategic-maple-syrup-reserve

Good one...:lol:

[spud]

That’s funny Dr. Tim. You had me believing until I got to the fighter jets for our maple security.

Sap ran pretty good today. I have 1800 gallons in the tank right now and it’s running at 90 gph. I should have about 2800 by morning. That a little under a gallon per tap. I’m hoping the big storm helps us to have another week of sap flow. Time will tell.

Spud

[220 maple]

Spud,
I’m so glad you moved back, your daily updates keeps me logging in and checking how you’re doing, 65000 gallons from 3400 taps. Keep on rolling hope you post your final numbers in two weeks!
Mark220maple

[spud]

Thanks 220 Maple. Sap ran a trickle last night and woke up to 2100 gallons in the tank. Supposed to get 8-18 inches of snow later today and tonight. I’m hoping this recharges the trees and we go another week or better. Sap now testing at 1%. Sap is a little cloudy but very good.

Spud

[spud]

Sap really slowed down today. May wind up with 1500 gallons by morning. It’s raining now and the snow is on its way. We could be done by weekend. Today’s sap test .9%.

Spud

[Mooneybc]

I am holding out hope that the snow storm will charge up the trees one more time. Just not holding onto too much hope!

[tcross]

woke up to a good 9-10" of snow this a.m. supposed to get another 4-8 i guess. boiled last night what came in yesterday... which was not a whole heck of a lot! trees are slowing down big time. hopefully this snow will help. last nights boil had a little different smell to it. sap is clear and syrup tasted perfectly fine. hoping to have a couple more good runs over the weekend if the sap quality holds up and the snow recharges the trees a bit. never ended the season with snow on the ground. there's a real possibility of that this year now.

[blissville maples]

All done in poultney vt ...2000 gallons if sap at .9% just isnt exciting! Weird seeing snow and being done. Unfortunately the trees have nothing left. With this cold weather and no freeze the trees are in shutdown mode as I call it and wont produce any amount of sap unless we had a prolonged freeze of atleast 12-20 hrs which wont be happening this year. Polar vortex has been favorable for cold but it never materialized. We just had a median zone reversal and split PV which usually happens in February and triggers severe winter weather but not this time, this will likely lead to a cool april, but unfortunately did nothing for the maple season.

Weather has sucked to say the least our last week has featured a low of 31/33 for 2 hrs...5am to 7 am, not enough cold to induce sugar production from the trees. We saw 1.7 for a run or two.
70% of our sap was less than 1.25.

Less than an average year we only made .48# per tap far cry from.last years 6.3 which was our best year ever. We usually have several days making 160-200 gallons of syrup. This year we made 170 once and 130+ only a few times.

My biggest take on the last two years is that mother nature controls the maple industry! Sanitation, 28" vaccum, 4 taps per
line, CV's, none of it matters. Its 80% weather dependant, there is
no normal or standard in this industry theres what mother nature allows in a given season that's it!

Good luck to those still going, im going RO shopping 

[spud]

Woke up to near no sap in the tank. The woods froze up at 11 pm last night. Getting very heavy snow now and the roads are terrible. We have about six inches of snow now, with another foot to come. The woods could stay froze till Saturday which would be great. Hoping for a few more good runs.

Spud

[Mooneybc]

13 inches of the white powder today and still had school!

[spud]

We got around 16 inches and the trees are white. I let my kids stay home from school yesterday. Once the branches thaw we could either get a great run, or the season will be over. Usually when a person ask for a miracle, they say the planets have to line up for that miracle to happen. On Monday some of the planets will be lining up. This is a good sign. 😁🤞🤞🙏.

Spud

[mainebackswoodssyrup]

Best of luck spud, our trees are white over here in western Maine as well with fresh snow. 1 bush was still pulling this morning but the others are all done. We seem to have a very similar start, heavy run and end as you. Hope you get some more, we're all done tomorrow.

[spud]

Sap started running at 10 this morning. I checked again at noon and it running 300 gph. Should run till 10 tonight and then it will freeze up. Hoping for a good weekend. Thank you everyone for posting and joining in on the fun. Let’s hope the price of syrup is good this year.

Spud

[Mooneybc]

It did not run today for me. Thinking I’ll be pulling taps this week.

[VT_K9]

It's coming in pretty slow today for us. I think by the middle of next week we'll likely be done if no sooner.

Mike

[220 maple]

Spud
Same event happened here in West Virginia off of snow storm where the snow was coating the trees for a day just about a week ago at the camp that shutdown on the last day of March, they got a good sap run after, taps in 8 weeks, so I’m hoping same happens for you! How long have your taps been in production?
Mark220maple

[spud]

My first run was Feb 9th. I’m thinking by Wednesday I will be done. If I could get another 10,000 gallons, I might be able to afford a set of Ping golf clubs. 😁

Spud

[spud]

Yesterday I got 2100 gallons and today it’s running at 250 gph. It’s going down to 27 degrees tonight and then 48 and sun tomorrow. We have three more freezing nights and then things warm up on Wednesday. Sap quality is cloudy but very nice.

Spud

[spud]

I just checked the tank and I have 1750 gallons from yesterday’s run. Right now it’s 25 degrees at the house. Supposed to be full sun and 45 degrees today. Hoping for a good run.

Spud

[spud]

Saps running 300 gph and testing .9%.

Spud

[Mooneybc]

Turned off the pump today because of minimal production over the last week. Sap is milky and .8%

End of year numbers:
800 taps
18,175 gallons of sap
235 gallons of syrup (just over a barrel short of last year)
Tap holes stayed productive for 9 weeks plus one week of small production.


Good luck to all who are still going!

[spud]

Woke up to 1800 gallons in the tank. It never froze in my woods last night. I suspect I will be shutting the pump off later today. No more freezing nights in my forecast. Sap is testing .9%

Spud

[tcross]

i unfortunately pulled the plug friday. Took a trip south to pick up a new puppy friday a.m. Returned to full tanks of 0.9% sap. without an R.O, that's not worth my time. it was odd because our last run was 2 days before and the content was 1.8%. sure would have liked full tanks of that! the sap was pouring in yesterday without my pump on... still tested 0.9%. all in all, we had a very average season.

[DrTimPerkins]

No more freezing nights in my forecast. Sap is testing .9%

Sap still running a bit up on the mountain in Underhill, but we're clearly in the phase of the season where sanitation is critical to maintaining good sap flow. The nice cold and snow we had bumped the sugar back up some, running 1.7 Brix in the main bush and 1.3 in the lower section. We will probably be OK for at least a few more days, and perhaps more, but nothing close to a freeze in the 10-day forecast, so the end is coming. We're within our normal season-end window.

It'll likely end up close to an average season for us, mostly because we got nailed by the wind storm in early-January (the bad thing about being high up on a mountain with western exposure), which took over a month of work to clean up. If the snow had been deep it would have been disastrous. But it did mean that tapping wasn't able to get started until later than normal and we missed those early sap flows. That and a ****?&&& pesky leak somewhere in the mainline system (we suspect UNDER the road where we can't get to it right now) hasn't allowed us to get the vacuum to where we want it. If not for those two factors, it'd probably have been a really good season. But...we're satisfied with what we got. Some seasons tend to be more of a struggle than others. Hope to have some preliminary results within a week or two.

I should also note that I'm largely a spectator myself this season...since I'm out here in Michigan where I can only see what is happening at PMRC via the cameras/sensors/data. Can't do much other than provide advice and consolation as needed and asked for. Thankfully we have a real dedicated and experienced crew that doesn't need me to tell them what to do anyhow.

[spud]

Sap is running 125 gph and I think I will keep the pump on till tomorrow. I plan to pull spouts as soon as I shut down. I still have 200 more apple trees to prune. Lots to do this spring. Hoping to get my other new woods set up this summer.

Dr. Tim. I hope you’re enjoying your new living conditions. I’m sure the grandkids are happy you’re there. I hope you enjoy the quality time.

Spud

[spud]

I shut the pump off this morning. Woke up to 1100 in the tank but the sap had stopped. My total for the season is 74,300 gallons on 3400 taps. Not the greatest of numbers but I’m still happy. The season went great and I had no issues at all. I will start pulling spouts tomorrow and then finish up on pruning my apple trees. I hope everyone has a great summer.

Spud

[MapleCamp]

Thanks for all the updates Spud, have a great summer

[Ultimatetreehugger]

Still going here in lyndonville. Slow but steady and low sugar. Like PMRC I have been hunting a leak all season and a constant battle with a lifting pump. That said I am still having a record year. I'll post totals when available.

[VT_K9]

This season's last boil was today. Ended with 277 gallons on 825 taps under vacuum. Our latest season end April 15, so were finishing in a reasonable time frame. Our sugar content is normally low, maybe 1.5-1.75%. We fought a few leaks early on this year. Due to my full-time job, we were behind trying to finish projects we wanted to do last summer/fall so we started later than we wanted. We have an addition at the sugarhouse to complete (16' added to the garage area). Double the size of a collection point from 800 to 1600 gallons (double he length of the building and build a warm room inside) and upgrade from a mechanical releaser to an electric releaser at this station. We plan to install a solar system (with batteries) to run the electric releaser. The tank swap will require removing the 1600-gallon tank at the sugarhouse and replacing it with a 2100-gallon tank (need to cut a hole in the wall for this one). That should be a fun day. Great to hear about everyone's successes and learning opportunities.

Mike

[tjanson]

Boiled what was in the tank on Sunday. Pulled taps on Monday before the eclipse. Sap was only testing .9-1.0%. we have about 13 gallons bottled and maybe another 1.5 ga waiting for bottling.

[DrTimPerkins]

We're done. Sap still running, but too slow to keep it fermenting in the lines. Last boil was this morning. Trees are ready for the next phase and so are we. Overall not the worst or the best season, but happy with what we got. Now we need to finish up a bunch of measurements, clean-up, and pull taps.