My plan 2022/23

[wobbletop]

You do you, but I don't think anyone (very few) have stopped using RO once they see the benefits.

Why not run RO at the same time as you are boiling? The RO output can feed your pan or sap tank directly.

[Swingpure]

I must say, I enjoy reading you thinking out loud but there is definitely a certain whiplash aspect to it!

Lol, I can see how one may feel that way.

I suppose if you can sell your stuff for most of what you paid, nothing really lost, but may I suggest an in-between option?
It seems you were stressed by the thought that the system must be balanced and absolutely all sap must be R.O.'d before entering the pan.
But clearly you are prepared to boil with no RO at all for this year.
So... what if you used your system once this year? Twice? Just to get to know it a bit? Maybe you'll find you even use it more. Or not. Doesn't matter.
Any amount you use it will be a bit less boiling, and a bit more learning. Or, even use it zero times but you've got a head start on your 2024 system in that case, and plenty of time to find deals on any remaining pieces you need.

What you say makes a lot of sense to me. I can give it a try. Keep it on a small scale. I do have a collection barrel right outside the garage and I have put a hole through my garage with a pipe through it, so that I can pump directly from the collection barrel into the RO raw sap barrel, so I can try and just RO what I get from the collection barrel, which based on last year, was 10 to 20 gallons each day. It should be more this year as I have 24 more taps running into it. I can start it when I get up to collect and use the concentrate part way through the day.

I would not have to flush as much and can use my one existing permeate barrel for the flush and have two other containers for the waste flush. If it doesn’t work, I have not lost anything and it does work and I get comfortable with it, maybe I could process more sap through the RO.

I will not buy another pump or any additional membranes, the 400 and two 150’s will be good enough. I have everything already set up to start tomorrow if I had to.


Thanks for the great suggestion.

[Swingpure]

You do you, but I don't think anyone (very few) have stopped using RO once they see the benefits.

Why not run RO at the same time as you are boiling? The RO output can feed your pan or sap tank directly.

I will give ROing a try as Andy suggested and if it pans out, and if it works well, I will see if I can somehow rig something next year to feed the concentrate to my feed tank. It is not a good fit the way I am set up now.

[Z/MAN]

Swingpure, I have been thinking right along that you might be biting off too much at once. Start the season with your new divided pan, learn everything you need to know to run it smooth and be comfortable with it. Then, and only then start playing with your RO. A little at a time and you will figure it out. There is no rule that says you have to RO all your sap. You could do small amounts and mix the concentrate with your raw sap until you are comfortable running it full time. Nobody will crucify you for it. Running the RO sounds a lot more complicated then it really is and learning it (part time) will help. You have jumped into this craziness with both feet and everything else you could find. Slow down, take a deep breath, and enjoy all the new equipment you purchased. Little steps will still get you there!

[Andy VT]

Yep, what Z/man said! Glad to hear you'll keep what you've bought. You'll know when you're ready to try it out; no need to sweat it. Maybe you'll want to up your permeate storage (not sure) but that's all! Every gallon of permeate you end up making will be a gallon not to boil. Maybe you'll make a lot, maybe a little, maybe none; it's all good! And report all your results of course because I'm going to get into RO for 2024.

[Super Sapper]

To start with, I would just recycle your concentrate back into your sap tank. You can start it whenever you want, several hours before or just when you start up the evaporator. There is a lot of emphasis on getting a certain concentrate flow or concentrate level when you are just trying to reduce your evaporator time. I will say that you will be hooked on watching all that water come off before evaporation.

If you have a head tank, run an overflow line from it to your storage tank. You can then just run RO without worrying about matching flow with the evaporator. Just run the RO to take off the maximum amount of permeate and not how high of brix in your concentrate. On some this allows the RO to run a faster flow and keeps the membrane cleaner and thus takes off more permeate.

[Swingpure]

Thank you for all of the suggestions. I do feel better that I will only RO when time permits. I think I can manage ROing the sap from the one collection barrel, but if it really complicates things, I can stop at any time.

I do agree that the key for me this year is to learn how to work with the divided pan and if I can do that and if I have some time to RO, I will. I realize there is so much I do not know about divided pans and do not yet know the questions to ask about it.

Today I flushed out all of my collection and storage barrels and other storage vessels. They were in remarkably clean shape.

I also played with how the transfer tank would sit on my ATV. It actually took me a few different setups to find one I liked. I will have to build a ramp so that my ATV sits higher in relation to my barrels, so that I just have to open the tank valve and it unloads into the barrel.

I also decided that I will unload some raw sap into 5 gallon pails. I wasn’t going to do that, but I did find last year that each morning I could take a chunk of ice out of the pails, nature’s RO. It will just mean more cleanup time, as I rinsed out each pail at the end of each day.

https://share.icloud.com/photos/01cH...hWmt7E2pmGJSNw

https://share.icloud.com/photos/02a3...hx7oI1ubmVFihw

[Z/MAN]

You will offload your atv tank much quicker if you use your pump. (No ramps) Stick it in the tank and you will empty that tank in minutes.

[Swingpure]

You will offload your atv tank much quicker if you use your pump. (No ramps) Stick it in the tank and you will empty that tank in minutes.

You are 100% correct. I actually had purchased a 1100 gph (18 gpm) bilge pump that would fit in the narrow opening at the top of the tank. Essentially it would take 2 minutes to empty the entire 35 gallon tank.

I tested draining 5 gallons from the 15 to 10 gallon mark and it took 4 minutes 25 seconds, to drain 5 gallons. So a little less than a half hour to drain the entire tank. A no brainer. I ordered a spare bilge pump just for back up.

This bilge pump needs an 1 1/8” id hose which I found out is a rare cat in these parts, so I ordered one on Amazon. Not to give Amazon a plug, but when you live away from the big centers, Amazon can fill the gap of things you want, sometimes with next day delivery on certain items.

https://share.icloud.com/photos/035Q...FdrRk_zfy86zYA

[nhdog]

i can't help but wounder if your new bilge pump and hose are food safe ? your are going to be making a lot of syrup for just your home use alone so i expect you will be selling or giving a lot away. just food for thought.