WRU in process

[Gary R]

Brandon,

It would be easy to measure. Every bit of condensate you collect off the preheater is a gain. Leader probably wouldn't want to sell a "Preheater/Steamaway combination because it would cost more than the rest of the evaporator. How many floats are you going to have to watch Chris?

[3% Solution]

3rdgen,
I figure we increased about 10 gallons per hour which is an increase of 50%.
That's an average, we have had it as high as 65% when things are right.
It still isn't running the way I want it to yet, hopefully this year it will be.
To me (now this is my opinion only) a steam-away is the way to add on, you get the best of both worlds, pre-heater and evaporator.
Hoe this helps.

Dave

[Sugarmaker]

Dave,
Glad you jumped in your rig is similar in size to 3rd gen. I would have had to scratch my brain to adjust for the size increase.

Brandon,
I have not heard of anyone doing it ( adding preheater also) and I am sure that it must have been tested. I assume that if it did add efficiency it would have been recommended too.

3rd gen,
As far as savings if you add in your (my) time as real dollars I am sure it would be cheaper to buy a new one. I was looking for a used one and gave up. They are out there, but not many just the right size. I had most of the stainless that I gleaned off bulk tanks. Some time, some basic fab skills. and a desire to improve the efficiency of the operation.

Will I get it done this year? Really all depends on the weather. I will continue to play with it until the weather breaks then go like heck to get ready to make syrup.

I need to get some more pictures for you guys!

GaryR,
I have thought about the condensate water from the outside of the preheater. Follow me and challenge me too. The drips are made from the steam on the outside of the pipes. Yes its good to not have them drip in but the more I think about it they are not reducing the sap volume. The drips are just a by-product of the process and need to be removed so the don't drop back into the pan and add water back into the sap.???
But the preheater does use the steam to bring the sap from say 40 degrees to 200 degrees.
I will have to watch two float boxes. one on the WRU and one on the rear pan.
My float on the rear pan may not have as many issues with much less head pressure (only 20 gallons of sap in the WRU). The float in the WRU has not been chosen yet.

So is it better to splash 200 degree sap (from a preheater) onto 200 degree steam pipes or 40 degree sap onto 200 degree steam pipes? HUMM? I am sure there is a thermal dynamics of physic guy out there that can make a recommendation.

Regards,
Chris

[jrthe3]

chris why couldn't you plume it so you can use the preheater and not use it and see withch works better

[3rdgen.maple]

Thanks gents for the feedback. I often have questioned why not just have a steamaway instead of a preheater then I seen their price. It has got me really thinking. I made some calls today and from the numbers some dealers gave me on gph they all put me up to a 20 gph increase with a 4 foot flue pan. They put the 3x8 bare bones at around 60 gph. I am getting 40 now on my best days so the numbers add up. I just have to do some math in my head on what I think I can handle with 60 gph or just go with the 3x8 and build it up from there. At what point dose tha madness end....I have 6 weeks of boiling on my rig and already looking to get another.

[Sugarmaker]

3rdgen,
Not sure it ends till we are resting in the ground. I haven't seen many that can walk away form it. Something about fire and boiling, I think it may be from the stone ages
Talk to Jim Brown on here he pumps a lot of sap through his rig with a R.O. and a steamaway. He has lots of taps too for his size operation.

Some pictures too!

Chris

[Sugarmaker]

couple of other shots too. ( Opps may have duplicated some? Once you have seen one WRU you have seen them all!)

Got some more holes punched in it and ordered the rubber grommets and door handles from McMaster Carr, the grommets will allow some of the pipes to pass through and limit the steam.

Also ordered the grommets for Keith's hood too.

I got sticker shock when I went looking at copper to plumb it tonight at Lowes. It is going to be $200, ouch. No wonder I am eating peanut butter for lunch!
Blower will be another $200. another tank of welding gas $40, sealing gasket material $200......it just goes on and on and on

Regards,
Chris

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

I thought the same thing about Leader saying a preheater doesn't help until it was explained to me that yes, there is a lot of steam off of the steamaway but there is so much cold air blowing thru it from the high pressure blower, it kills any efficiency gain with the preheater.

[Gary R]

Chris, I am following you. Sorry guy's, I should think more before I "speak".

Try a plumbing supply store. By this time you should already have an account set up with them Venango, Trumball, Dobie tec.

[Sugarmaker]

GaryR
I had to think about that condensate from the preheater also. I had myself convince for years, that the condensate coming off the preheater was water I didn't have to boil, I was sure I was saving gallons of water, But the water has already boiled, turned to steam, and back to water. The good thing is that you catch it before it drips back in. Heating the sap prior to going into the flue pan is a definite advantage! How much? Dealers say 10 to 15 percent?

I think Deckers stainless fittings were cheaper than copper!

Boyd,
Looking like I will not plumb the preheater in for the first go. I know it could be set up that way. I am going to look at the float system you recommended.

Brandon,
Cold air blowing or hot air blowing? Not sure what the air temp will be after boiling for several hours??? I will try to monitor that somehow? If I ever get this thing going.

Eric came over and in 20 minutes gave me some good suggestions for blower location, (maybe down near the floor?). Also we reviewed all the welds he is going to have to make on the tubes. He made suggestions on plumbing the float box to the WRU to make it function better by adding two short nipples and a union. Plus we designed a support bracket for the float box which will make it look good too. ( that's code for: hiding some of my poor welding)

Good news too! He has been called back to work after being laid off the better part of a year! He works in the maintenance department of a die casting shop.

Regards,
Chris