Shurflo lift questions

[maple flats]

Before I started changing tees every season, I had as I recall about 3 tees plug, out of about 150 taps. Since I use 3/16 x 3/16 x 5/16 tees, the blockage stopped at a 3/16 fitting, that closed off all sap flow upstream not just 1 tap. In my book that was not acceptable, that's why I started replacing tees. It was not my original idea, I read it somewhere that others were doing it. Back then I think a tee was about $.26 or $.27 each. I've been doing it ever since and will continue. As I say, it's cheap insurance. I suppose possibly you rinse better than I did, but I'll never know because at the price of a new Tee I won't experiment and risk it.

[DMF]

How many taps do you have Dave and how long does it take to you change them out each year? If you do a rinse before the season starts, wouldn't that tell you if a tee was blocked or not?

[maple flats]

BAP, I've never said I know everything, in fact I've made sure to only comment on things I've had experience with, or I open my comments saying I'm just guessing. But, I'll stick with my opinion to replace my tees every year, you can certainly do what has worked for you, obviously it works for you.
I however have seen lots of comments from those who use 3/16 about issues with them plugging up and blocking sap flow.
In your obviously superior experience, what do you suggest those who get plug ups on 3/16 do to avoid the plugging? I'll await your suggestions. Maybe telling how you wash the lines , that might be the determining factor. Once I read about your method I will try it, maybe I can save the time and money and use the same Tees year after year. Please be spefific to help us who have no idea how to clean them so we can also experience no plugging. I'm serious, I want to learn how you get the laterals so clean.
Dave

[DMF]

I'm serious, I want to learn how you get the laterals so clean.
Dave

I don't know how BAP does his but this is how I do mine.

End of season I pull the taps and let everything drain for a few days.

Next, I take a tank of (as hot as I can get) water down to the lower end of the sugar bush. I use homemade lunchbox releasers so I switch the in and out lines to suck the water out of the tank and push it up the lines. Those soda pumps will push uphill over 80' in elevation; it gets slow near the top but it does it. I walk the lines uphill and plug each spout into the tee when I get to it and the water is flowing freely. Once I get to the top i walk back down and start the next line. When that one is done, I usually walk down the previous line and pull all the spouts from the tees to let it drain again.

The next step is to repeat the process with a hot water-Calcium Hypochlorite solution, the difference being that I don't walk down the previous line and unplug; I let the solution sit in the lines.

Ideally, if I have the time, after the solution has sat in the lines for a few days I'll repeat the initial water rinse, and do a rinse in the fall again. What realistically happens is the solution sits in the lines most of the summer or at least until some of the spouts somehow become unplugged fro the tees on their own and the line drains out. Either way they get rinsed in the fall.

In my experience, I've never had to replace a tee due to a blockage, only for leaks due to squirrel chews.

[maple flats]

DMF, do you get any plugging in your tees? I'll give my method, to compare, however I got some plugging and then I started changing the Tees every year, (2 yrs change them, the 3rd year whole new drop, every year new tap.
I , in my first year, filled a tote (IBC) with about 125 gal of good potable water, mixed in 2 qts food grade hydrogen peroxide (35% solution mixed into the water) but after yr 1 I changed to using only water, after reading that others were using just water). I then used a lab wash bottle, the first year I think it was 500ML, year 2 and beyond I got a 32oz wash bottle. I also carried a 2 gal drink type cooler jug. I walked to the last tap, pulled it, squirted maybe 100-125 ml into the tap , held the tap so the mixture sat in it for about 30 seconds, then lifted it and gravity took it down the drop and down the lateral. I then pushed the tap onto the parking stub and walked to the next tap. I repeated until the wash bottle was empty, then I refilled it from the jug I was carrying. I got about 4-5 taps from the 500ml bottle. In yr 2 I found a 32oz wash bottle and I used that, with it I cleaned about 8-9 taps, then refilled from the jug. Starting in yr 2 I only used water, no longer used food grade hydrogen peroxide.
A few years later, I tried and decided to continue using 3/16 on flat ground and even on places where I was pulling sap from below the mainline. In all of these, from yr 1 on I also had mechanical vacuum, in my earliest uses of 3/16 I had lots of elevation drop and had no places where I was pulling across level or up from lower areas, that came later.
Once I stopped using the lease where I had good elevation drop I was reducing my bush, the landowner was planning to take it over and he has now done so.
On my bush, surrounding my sugarhouse is where I experimented with level and then pulling from below the mainline using vacuum. My first try was just 3 laterals at the end of a mainline, where previously I had actually tapped using a short extension ladder to get slope. I then tried tapping at 4-5 ft above the ground using 3/16 laterals and 5/16 drops and taps. I had a line of 7 taps, another of 11 taps and I think the biggest in length had 15 or 16 taps. The mainline had 26-27" of vacuum on it. That worked so well the next year I tried expanding to an area across the driveway into the sugarhouse, all below the mainline and across the driveway. I had a lateral of 25 sugars, a lateral of 25 reds and another lateral of 26 reds. All 3 were 3/16 laterals, each went to a 3 stem red maple next to the driveway. From there I used an elbow upside down, the one leg faced up rather than down. The lateral went up to a limb just over 14' off the ground, then it went over that limb across the driveway to a sugar maple , over a limb at the sugar around the trunk then it angled down towards the mainline about 16' away at maybe a 35 degree decline and entered the mainline using a saddle.
When I cleaned that 3 lateral set up I used the 32 oz wash bottle and clean water. I notice you used hot water, I never tried hot water, I was using water at ambient temperature, because it came from municipal water, I let it set in a SS tank for 3+ days to get rid of chlorine. It was likely about 38-45 degrees F
Whilew I could have used hydrogen peroxide in my water I never did after that first year, not because of the price but rather because year 1 showed that while I didn't realize it when using it, my chlothes told otherwise. After the next washing I discovered I'd gotten some spray , mist and even some larger amounts of liquid on my clothes based on lots of bleaching. I at that time was also in water treatment and I could buy 15 gal barrels of food grade hydrogen peroxide for about $120 at that time, where as a 1 gal jug of it cost $35 plus shipping, The $120 included the shipping and it was 15 gal. It was used in some water treatment systems to treat bad water as in e-coli and other bacteria. I still washed the laterals, cold water and just plain water at that. I just never even considered heating the water. That method stuck with me ever since while I replaced the Tees every year. My experience using this method it why I said the Tee needs to be replaced every year, also any connector too but those are few and far between.

I'll await to read how BAP cleans his lines if he ever responds. Maybe my error was the temperature or the the amount of solution or when I used the hydrogen peroxide, the contact time.
Dave

[BAP]

BAP, I've never said I know everything, in fact I've made sure to only comment on things I've had experience with, or I open my comments saying I'm just guessing. But, I'll stick with my opinion to replace my tees every year, you can certainly do what has worked for you, obviously it works for you.
I however have seen lots of comments from those who use 3/16 about issues with them plugging up and blocking sap flow.
In your obviously superior experience, what do you suggest those who get plug ups on 3/16 do to avoid the plugging? I'll await your suggestions. Maybe telling how you wash the lines , that might be the determining factor. Once I read about your method I will try it, maybe I can save the time and money and use the same Tees year after year. Please be spefific to help us who have no idea how to clean them so we can also experience no plugging. I'm serious, I want to learn how you get the laterals so clean.
Dave

Dave, you told me in your post that I don’t know anything about using 3/16”. You started it. I am telling you that I use it without having to replace a lot of parts. At the end of the season, I do the same thing that I have for the past 45 years. I pump water with some chlorine in it through the lines. I know everyone will say chlorine causes squirrels to chew but fact of the matter is, squirrels will chew new tubing too. Yes, there is a trade off using chlorine, it can increase the squirrel chews. But, by pumping water through, I find leaks that are hard to find on 3/16 without added vacuum, the lines are cleaner and I have no issues with plugging. I let the drops hang for several days then go back through a plug them. I know research shows that cleaning is not effective, but remember that most research is paid for by the companies that are selling new equipment and they aren’t going to keep paying for research that doesn’t support buying new equipment.

[DrTimPerkins]

…but remember that most research is paid for by the companies that are selling new equipment and they aren’t going to keep paying for research that doesn’t support buying new equipment.

This is certainly NOT the case for research done in the U.S. Research is typically funded by grants or industry (NAMSC grants or association donations). Very little to none is funded by maple equipment companies. Occasionally there is some donations of equipment, but in that case there cannot be any strings attached or an ability of the companies to vet the results ahead of their release. It is pretty much hands off. Typically we purchase (at regular prices) the vast majority of equipment and supplies we test and/or utilize.

[johnallin]

Have to believe that what Dr Tim says is correct.
I’m going for popcorn ��

[maple flats]

BAP, I'm still waiting to learn how you clean the 3/16 lines so you don't get any plugged tees. Please educate us all, it could make the use of 3/16 laterals far more adventacious for many. There are a lot of producers who try 3/16, but then quit it bacause of plugging issues.
Dave

[DRoseum]

Not sure about others, but I clean 3/16 by pumping cleaning solution up the tubing from the bottom, using a booster pump, allowing it to flow out through each drop line, filling the lines entirely and letting sit for ~24 hrs before draining and coiling them up. Haven't had a blockage in 4 years and lines look as clean as new. Have replaced a handful of cracked tees across 8 lines and 112 taps, but none of them have shown any form of residue or blockage.

https://youtu.be/FUrzZQOcyb4?si=X36Vybe8tVFDT6r4

Also back to original thread - I use 2 diaphragm pumps in series (shurflo and aquatec) to pull vacuum and push sap immediately up a 40 ft hill to avoid a 2nd collection tank at that low point for approximately 30 taps. Works great, but I have power at that location which OP does not.