Cleaning sap lines

[DrTimPerkins]

I believe he’s asking if you do anything to treat/rinse out the main lines or laterals. Based on your second answer, I would assume no?

Correct...as I already said earlier in this thread. We do not clean lines (lateral, droplines or mainlines) in ANY way. Haven't since 2004.

[M&M Maple Grove]

You can’t be that. I was aware there were no sanitation practices being used but it was unclear about any rinsing/flushing of the lines. Is there a portion of the first run that is used to flush the lines?

3/16 gravity vacuum works fantastic until it doesn’t. It has come to my attention I am putting way too much effort into making this system work. Personally, it is time to upgrade to a traditional mainline with 5/16 laterals starting with my biggest offenders and working towards a complete replacement over time.

[DrTimPerkins]

Is there a portion of the first run that is used to flush the lines?

The last couple of years we let a very small amount run out, but most often not. We don't make any dark syrup (almost all Golden or Amber), so it's actually nice to get a little gunk in there to add some color and flavor.

First estimate is that this year will end up right around 0.565 gpt, which is just a whisker shy of our 0.58 gpt average. We had sap/concentrate going thru two different buildings this year (one production and one research), and some then of the excess sap was returned back to production, so it's taking a bit longer to get a handle on the total...plus we need to finalize the boil-out numbers from the two research evaporators. We got a bit of a late start this year due to equipment arriving late. Set us back on tapping by a few weeks so we missed a small first run of sap.

[Swingpure]

Correct...as I already said earlier in this thread. We do not clean lines (lateral, droplines or mainlines) in ANY way. Haven't since 2004.

I have three long lines that go way up, that I would have trouble cleaning. I understand that you do not clean your lines..

My question is when you pull your taps, do you just let them hang for a while, so that the drops drain any residual sap?

Thanks

Gary

[Pdiamond]

That is what I have seen most producers around here do.

[Adk sugar bush]

So.. Contrary to what I’ve been doing, do I understand the best approach - per Dr Perkins comment- is to not clean lines when done? Just pull taps, leave everything attached. Cut taps off in the fall and replace? That’s what is said, I know, just having trouble wrapping my mind around that.

[littleTapper]

As a small producer, I clean mine. I can see the cost in labor/time being significant if you're a large operation.

My three runs of 3/16" get flushed with permeate water at the end of the season. Use a pump sprayer and go to each drop starting at the top of the hill and working down. Then let hang/dry. Lines are still spotless after 5 seasons of use.

My vac lines at home (5/16") are pretty flat. I flush with water; pulling it to the Shurflo from each tap when the season is over. Then I push Star-san from the pump out to each dropline, cap each one off when full and let sit. I can control the pump with my phone, so my son helps by turning it on/off to fill the lines with sanitizer. That sits for a day or so, then uncap and let them hang/dry. Before the season they get flushed with permeate (on a warm day) made from getting the RO ready. They're also spotless after several years of being used.

Is it worth the effort, maybe not.....but then I don't worry or have to look at crap in the lines.

[DMF]

There are alternative approaches to maintaining high sap yields in tubing systems. There's been a tremendous amount of research on this in the past 15 yrs.
https://mapleresearch.org/pub/1019sanitation-2/

I have a question on this report; Does the annual net profit for the check valve represent one year's net profit?

I'm not even sure if I'm asking the correct question. Here's my thought process, please confirm my thinking or tell me where it's flawed. I currently use Zap-Bac spouts. According to the table, the check valve shows a net profit of $2.10 vs. $1.48 for Zap-Bac. Check valve spouts are listed in Bascom's right now for $0.45/each and the Zap-Bac is $0.60. If those numbers represent "year one" then:

Year----CV cost----ZB cost
1-------$0.45------$0.60
2-------$0.45------$0.00
3-------$0.45------$0.00
TTL:---$1.35------ $0.60

After year 3 drops are replaced for both scenarios but the CV needs labor each year. So on year 3 does the net profit for CV scenario drop to $0.75 (plus the added labor) and Zap-Bac remains at $1.48 or is the cost per spouts and labor built into the calculations?

Thanks!

[Adk sugar bush]

Thanks little tapper, although lots bigger than me.
So, still trying to figure out best cleaning approach. You have a good system, but I have no vacuum or electricity for that matter. I have about 150 taps on 3/16, and generally pull taps and flush (at tap) with a squirt bottle of a chlorine solution. Squirrels like chlorine and chew lines, so was really interested in what Dr Perkins said about not cleaning at all. And.. I don’t understand the idea of using new taps every year. Sure, they get junked up, but I’ve always cleaned - ie boiled. Taps here are about $.50, so that’s about $75/yr. for me.
But back to cleaning. I guess my understanding is the residue sap in lines sours then creates a cleaning bacteria which may be more beneficial and more anti squirrel than chlorine.
If Dr Perkins sees this, I’d be very curious about all of this.

[DrTimPerkins]

If Dr Perkins sees this, I’d be very curious about all of this.

Sorry...in a hurry so this might be short on details.

I think I recall you are using 3/16" tubing, which can have a tendency to plug up after a few years. Because of that, the recommendations are a bit different than for 5/16" tubing. With 3/16" tubing you have two basic options (or a combination of the two).

1. Sanitize your lines and spouts well with something (chlorine) and rinse well each year.
2. Replace all fittings (unions, tees, spouts) at least every three years and (preferably) replace (or thoroughly clean, results not quite as good as replacement though) all spouts each year.