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Thread: In the market for an RO

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Location
    Middlesex, Vermont
    Posts
    320

    Default In the market for an RO

    Hi all,
    Decided to take the plunge and purchase an RO as opposed to build one. I've read some about the Deer Run 500's (not a ton of information on here about them). I have some units in my local area, Deer Run 500, Lappiere 250 Turbo, CDL 250, CDL 200. I'd like to be in the 400-500 tap range and ideally be concentrating between 10-12% before it hits the float box. Can anyone shed some light and help me out? Being able to process fast isn't as big a deal as concentrating high. I've read good things about the Turbo 250 but haven't found anything bad about the CDL 250 other than pumps being susceptible to failure due to running dry. Any help would be appreciated.
    Mead Maple "It's for the kids..."
    Paul Cerminara
    2019 - First season ever
    -Goal: 3 gallons
    -Season Total: 7.5 gallons - pulled taps after running out of firewood and time
    2020
    Built 2'x8' Oil Fired with Thor drop flue pans
    -Goal: 20 gallons
    -Season Total: 55 gallons

  2. #2
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Barto, Pa.
    Posts
    36

    Default

    I have a Deer Run 500 electric. I have 850 3/16 taps at my cabin 3 hours away. I am not there everyday so its common to have 1500 gallons of sap to process when I arrive. I rarely see 2.0% sap. Generally start at around 1.8 or 9 and steadily fall to 1.2 to end the season. The first pass thru with better sap gets me to around 6.0 at very close to 500 gallons per hour. I second pass to 12% but flow goes way down. About 250 per hour. Obviously those flow rates slow down as the sugar content falls. Overall I am happy with it. It seems bulletproof, haven t had an issue in 6 years. It does take time to process to the desired concentration though. Hope that helps.
    860 taps/ 1/2 on 3/16
    Leader 2x6 WSE with woodsaver blower
    Deer Run Maple 500 RO

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Location
    Middlesex, Vermont
    Posts
    320

    Default

    That helps a ton, coyote. Did you but the electric unit or did you convert from the gas option? Those numbers are more than acceptable for me. What do you think raw sap gallons you'd need to perform an adequate flushing of the membrane with regards to permeate?
    Mead Maple "It's for the kids..."
    Paul Cerminara
    2019 - First season ever
    -Goal: 3 gallons
    -Season Total: 7.5 gallons - pulled taps after running out of firewood and time
    2020
    Built 2'x8' Oil Fired with Thor drop flue pans
    -Goal: 20 gallons
    -Season Total: 55 gallons

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Walpole, NH
    Posts
    1,188

    Default

    As far as permeate to flush, a rule of thumb for RO, is same amount of gallons as the GPH of the RO. Couple other brands to check out would be MES dolly’s and Next Generation Maple.
    Sugaring for 45+ years
    New Sugarhouse 14'x32'
    New to Me Algier 2'x8' wood fired evaporator
    225 Sugar Maples Currently,(105 on 3/16" and 110 on Shurflo 4008 vacuum, 10 gravity), (16,000 before being disabled)
    1947 Farmall H and Wagon with gathering tank
    2012 Kubota with forks to move wood around

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Fond du Lac, Wisconsin
    Posts
    991

    Default

    I have a Deer Run 250 and you can do a warm rinse by flushing for 5 to 10 minutes and then recirculating heated permeate for about 15 minutes and then flush with fresh permeate. Doing this I can get by with 100 gallons of permeate. I throw some caustic in to wash it every other time to keep it cleaner since it takes the same amount of time.
    Smoky Lake 2x6 dropflu pans and hoods on homemade arch
    Smoky Lake 6 gallon water jacked bottler
    Concentric Exhaust
    250 Deer Run RO
    325 taps

  6. #6
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Barto, Pa.
    Posts
    36

    Default

    I bought it as an electric model. I always use 650-700 gallons of sap as a minimum to run the RO. That will give you pretty close to the 500 gallons of permeate that is suggested. I also do the hot permeate rinse as Super Sapper said. Ray also makes a 375 model but not sure of the membranes. I think that is multiple 4". Mine is a single 8".
    860 taps/ 1/2 on 3/16
    Leader 2x6 WSE with woodsaver blower
    Deer Run Maple 500 RO

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Ashtabula County, Ohio
    Posts
    1,739

    Default

    The 375 that I owned from Ray had 3 4" membranes. It worked well, I just can't take the noise of the piston pump.
    1000 taps on vac down to 3 buckets, 140 taps on gravity tubing, 75 on 4008 Shurflo
    2x7 A&A Raised Flue
    CDL 18" vacuum filter
    NGMP 100 HPRO RO
    2019 Kawasaki Mule Pro MX, Long 510 sap haulers
    Past evaporators: Phaneuf 2x6, A&A 2.5x10, Smoky Lake 2x8 (oil then wood fired)
    Syrup made 2010:36 gal 2011:126 gal 2012:81 gal 2013:248 gal 2014: 329.5 gal 2015:305 gal 2016:316 gal 2017:258 gal 2018:147 gal 2019:91 gal 2020: 30 gal
    Tapping the same trees my great, great and great grandfathers tapped.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Oneida NY
    Posts
    11,092

    Default

    My Deer Run 250 was bought as gas engine, when I converted to electric I didn't notice any gph change. I also go from 1.9-2.1% in, 7-8% out in first pass and 11-12% out on recirculate. Doing a true second pass would require another tank.
    Yes, you will want about 1000 gal for a complete wash, rinse some times. Many times you can run short some on times and thus save water. Personally however, I have a 1000 gal tank, for permeate for my 250, but it is mounted at an angle (tilted lower towards the drain port), likely only holds about 900-925 the way is set up.
    The only times I'm light on permeate is the first boil if it is only 3-400 gal of sap to start. By the second boil I'm regularly over the 500 gal that I might use.
    Dave Klish about 400 taps, down from much more. Retired from collecting and boiling in 2021. Mostly because of a bad hip.
    2012 Mahindra 36 HP 4x4/ loader/cab/heat/AC:-)
    3x8 raised flue evaporator
    250 GPH converted to electric, RO by Ray Gingerich
    6.32 KW solar system, 1.48KW is battery backed up, all net metered
    website: www.cnymaple.com

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Location
    Middlesex, Vermont
    Posts
    320

    Default

    Thanks for the feedback guys. Really helpful. My biggest concern was not having enough sap to create perm for washing. But naturally the last thing I wanted was to buy one this year and end up needing to upgrade next year (though I recognize that'll happen eventually regardless.) My thought was if I could wrangle up enough taps and possibly wait till I had enough to run it after a couple days would be best. Then at least I know I can grow with it instead of grow out of it.
    Mead Maple "It's for the kids..."
    Paul Cerminara
    2019 - First season ever
    -Goal: 3 gallons
    -Season Total: 7.5 gallons - pulled taps after running out of firewood and time
    2020
    Built 2'x8' Oil Fired with Thor drop flue pans
    -Goal: 20 gallons
    -Season Total: 55 gallons

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