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Thread: Honda WX pump question

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Nov 2015
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    Cornwall, CT
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    Default Honda WX pump question

    I use a Honda WX10 pump to push maple sap ~350 linear feet and a rise in elevation of probably 35 feet up to my sugarshack. I use 1" black poly water pipe for the line.

    It takes about 45 minutes to pump 550 gallons up to the shack, or about 12 gals/minute actual pump time.

    Thinking about getting a WX15 pump to speed things up.

    The WX10 is rated at 32 gals/minute.
    The WX15 is rated at 74 gals/minute.

    If I step up to the WX15 but use the same 1" poly will I get any faster results or do I need to get 1.5" pipe to make it worth while?
    If I go to 1.5" line should I expect an actual 24 gals/minute pump time?
    1980 - 6 taps, stone fire pit, drain pan evaporator, 1 pint of syrup
    2016 - 55 taps on 3/16 and gravity, new sugar shack, 2x3 Mason XL, 16 gallons of syrup
    Inception of Young Love Maple
    2017 - 170 taps on 3/16, 30 on buckets, 2x4 Mason XL, NextGen RO. 50 gallons of syrup
    2018 - 19 more acres, 250+ taps on gravity and buckets, 2x5 Smokey Lake arch and Beaverland pan.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Location
    Upper Valley, NH
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    Rover,

    Just offering a thought here: I would approach this problem from the other way around. With all of the other information you've provided above, research the pump curves (sometimes called "efficiency" curves) and match a pump to your need. There are a ton of videos on youtube and such that explain how to read the curves. There are also discussions about the head distance you are trying to raise the liquid, and the impacts of diameter and length of pipe.
    110 Taps on 3/16" "natural vac"
    Leader Half-Pint Supreme with AUF
    Souped-up RO Bucket
    3 Black Rescue Dogs
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  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
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    Walpole, NH
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    You consider putting a shallow well water pump on the end at your sugar house if you have electric to speed things up. If you are pushing with the gas pump and pulling with the electric pump, it should speed up the transfer because the electric pump will keep the head pressure down on the gas pump. How much, I don’t know but shallow well pumps are cheaper to buy than a new WX15 and new 1.5” pipe.
    Sugaring for 45+ years
    New Sugarhouse 14'x32'
    New to Me Algier 2'x8' wood fired evaporator
    225 Sugar Maples Currently,(105 on 3/16" and 110 on Shurflo 4008 vacuum, 10 gravity), (16,000 before being disabled)
    1947 Farmall H and Wagon with gathering tank
    2012 Kubota with forks to move wood around

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Oneida NY
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    Keep the WX 10 but use a 1.5" pump line, the larger line will move the sap a lot faster.
    Dave Klish about 1320 taps in '15, doing fewer each year, about 450 planned for 2020 (and after?)
    2012 Mahindra 36 HP 4x4/ loader/cab/heat/AC:-)
    3x8 raised flue evaporator
    250 GPH converted to electric, RO by Ray Gingerich
    6.32 KW solar system, 1.48KW is battery backed up, all net metered
    http://s1041.photobucket.com/albums/...anssugarhouse/
    website: www.cnymaple.com

  5. #5
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    Apr 2016
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    SW Ontario
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    Quote Originally Posted by maple flats View Post
    Keep the WX 10 but use a 1.5" pump line, the larger line will move the sap a lot faster.
    agreed - The friction losses in a 1.5" pipe are about 11% of a 1" pipe... Will make a huge difference.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
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    Catskill Mountains
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    I pump sap up hill to my truck with a 2" pacer pump and three 1" lines hooked to manifolds that I made. Quick couples on all the ends makes for easy assembly at the pump and truck. I can drive 1/2 mile to and from the tanks and fill the 300 gal tank in 15 minutes.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
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    Covington, New York
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    Quote Originally Posted by maple flats View Post
    Keep the WX 10 but use a 1.5" pump line, the larger line will move the sap a lot faster.
    I use a WX10 to pump through 330 feet of pipe with an elevation of roughly 75 feet. I went with 3/4" pipe for one reason, I wanted to limit what came back to the tank when I finished. Even with the 3/4" pipe, 9.5 gallons comes back.
    Noel Good
    1998 to 2009: 15 taps on buckets, scavenged fire pit and pans
    2010: New 2x4 SS flat pan w/preheater
    2015: New to me Lapierre 18x60 raised flue, new shack, new everything!! 59 taps 23.75 gallons made
    2016: 85 taps 19 gallons
    2017: Purchased 2.5 acres and tubed half with 3/16. 145 taps total 49.25 gallons made
    2018: 200 taps (162 on 3/16ths 38 on buckets) New NextGen RO 63 gallons made
    2019: 210 taps 73.5 gallons made
    www.wnybass.com

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
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    Thetford, VT
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    We have a WH15 pumper to pump sap through 750' of 1 1/2" poly with a rise of about 65'. We move 23-25 gallons per minute. There is about 75 gallons of sap left in the line when the tank is empty. We either drain it back to the tank or into a cube to bring up to the sugarhouse.

    When pumping alone, when we had a 230 gallon tank at the sugarhouse, we started the pump and let it settle in to running. Then we ran the pump for 9 minutes and 30 seconds. This would just about fill the tank to the brim, maybe an inch to spare.

    We used the Honda pump select feature on their website and found it to be reasonable accurate. We tried several variations of pump, suction, and output line size. Check it out.

    Mike
    Tapping since 1985 (four generations back to early to mid 1900s). 200-250 taps on buckets and then tubing in the mid 90s. 2013- 275 taps w/sap puller 25 gal. 2014-295 taps w/sap puller 55 ga. (re-tapped to vacuum theory) 2015-330 taps full vac. 65 gal, 2016-400 taps 105 gal, 2017-400 taps 95 gal. 2018-additional 800' mainline and maybe 400 new taps for a total near 800 taps. 2x6 Leader WSE (last year on it) supported by a 250 gph RO.

  9. #9
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    Apr 2018
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    North Abington, PA
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    In my experience, you will be much better off spending the money on larger pipe instead of a larger pump. I need to do this myself, but we pump through 3000 feet of 1" pipe and upgrading that much pipe is pretty costly.
    2400 taps all 3/16 gravity
    New CDL 600 GPH RO that is freaking awesome
    4x14 Leader/CDL rig with a steam-away
    Still havin' fun

  10. #10
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    Oneida NY
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    Using a WX15 years ago I ran 900+' from the tank to the haul tank at the road with a total drop in elevation of 15'. The year I put it in I ran out of 1.5" pipe before I got to the road, so I coupled about 400' of 1" pipe in the middle. That year it took me 45 minutes to pump 280 gal of sap. By year 2 I had changed the section of 1" to 1.5" and it then took me 16 minutes to pump 280 gal, and that year I also hauled a second tank in a trailer which when full to the tip top also held 280 gal. It then took 31 minutes to pump 560 gal, start to finish, same pump. Even with gravity helping it made that much difference. Those 280 gal numbers are what I guess an 275 IBC tote when filled to the very top, only a guess. By the way, my couplings were all insert SS fittings, which leave no lip to even slightly affect the flow.
    Last edited by maple flats; Yesterday at 10:26 AM.
    Dave Klish about 1320 taps in '15, doing fewer each year, about 450 planned for 2020 (and after?)
    2012 Mahindra 36 HP 4x4/ loader/cab/heat/AC:-)
    3x8 raised flue evaporator
    250 GPH converted to electric, RO by Ray Gingerich
    6.32 KW solar system, 1.48KW is battery backed up, all net metered
    http://s1041.photobucket.com/albums/...anssugarhouse/
    website: www.cnymaple.com

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