What would you do? Upgrade or RO?

[Sly41985]

I've been thinking of either upgrading 2x6 pans, buying 2x8, or purchasing hobby RO. Last year we had just over 200 taps, which on the leader wse, made for long boil. We have potential to up our tap count. Just wondering what people's thoughts were on the matter. few things to know first. Evaporator most likely will be wood. We've got 130 acres of hardwoods. Only electricity we have is a generator(run a Honda 2000)I've seen claims online of a 2x6 that's airtight, blower, and high output pans getting double what my wse gets. Let me know what you guys think!!! Thanks.

[flhr10]

I have (had) a Leader WSE 2x6. Boiled on it for 5 seasons. My boil rate was a consistent 30 gallons per hour. Running between 350-400 taps each year on bags. This past summer I traded my WSE pans on a new set. I got the Revolution syrup pan from Leader and the Max Flue from Leader. If the claims are correct, my boil rate should be 40-45 gph. I'll see how it goes. Will be adding a hood and pre-heater after this upcoming season. Also I won't be tapping any trees this year. I'll be buying my sap from a friend running tubing.

[Potters3]

Just my opinion adding a R/O is the best money spent to go faster. When you take 2% sap and make it even 4% you just cut your boil time in half. But that would require a bigger generator or a gas powered R/O. I am on my second R/O and still think they where worth ever penny spent. I work full time so there is no way I would have enough time to boil or cut wood to boil that long. We have 2600 taps now

2%/86 = 43 evap to get a gal of syrup
4%/86= 21.5, I know rough math but close

[Sugarmaker]

Sly,
My 2 cents:
If you like to boil then upgrade to a 3 x 8. That will keep you going for several years with out the R.O. as you expand. Boil rate will be improved from where you are now and you get a new rig. (2 x 8 is not much of a jump) A 3 x 8 would handle 600+ taps. When your ready to double your tap count you have the right size evaporator, add the R.O. at that point.
Regards,
Chris

[maple flats]

Having gone thru this type question, I'll answer from my perspective. At 200 or even up to 6-800 I would stay with the 2x6 and get a 250 GPH RO. Ray Gingerich makes them with a gas engine. PM me if you need his contact info.
Then add a hood on the flue pan and a pre-heater. With that RO and a pre-heater you will be able to process 800 taps in the same or less time as what it took for 200. Another thing to improve the hourly evaporation rate is to add AUF and then even AOF (air under and air over fire). To boil with no other changes other than a 250 gph RO just run it from 2% to 8% in one pass and then run a second time from 8% to 12%. If you started at 2% it takes 42 gal to boil away to make one gal of syrup (43 gal sap minus 42 gal water is 1 gal syrup). If you boil 8% it takes it only takes 10.875 gal to make one of syrup and if you run it up to 12% it only takes 7.25 gal to make one of syrup. The RO is your best investment.
On your WSE if you get 25 GPH evaporation it takes you over 1.7 hrs to get 1 gal of syrup. If you boil the 25 gph with 8% concentrate it takes you .425 hrs to make one and boiling 12% it takes you .2125 hrs to make one gal of syrup. These are all still at the 25 gph. Do some homemade improvements and it can get even better.
If buying a new 2x8 it would cost more that a 250 GPH RO from Ray.
Others may also make gas powered RO's too. Just think, even at 8%, you can get 4x the syrup from the same amount of wood fuel.

[minehart gap]

I am also on the RO bandwagon and would suggest one. But keep in mind that you will not just need a RO. Even the gas powered RO's require a heated room or take it home every chance that it may freeze, also a way to heat permeate for cleaning the RO and 1 or 2 (or more) additional tanks as well as minor other items.

[wnybassman]

I faced this decision last year (minus the electricity issue) I have exactly 200 taps and was doing 14+ hour boils on my little 18x60 raised flue evaporator. I decided on the RO route midway through the season and never had a boil over 2 1/2 hours after that.

[Russell Lampron]

I recommend going with the RO. With my 2x6 and RO I easily handle 725 taps on vacuum. I have my evaporator hopped up enough so that when I have 1200 gallons of sap concentrated to 14% I can boil it all in in less than 3 hours. Before the RO and evaporator mods there way too many 12 hour plus boiling sessions which made it hard to go to work the next day.

[VT_K9]

We were where you are now about 4 years ago. We added a sap puller to 275 taps without changing anything. We went from 20-24 gallons of syrup to 35 gallons of syrup. We bought a CDL Hobby 250 RO. WHAT A DIFFERENCE. We eventually expanded to about 400 taps. Two years ago we planned to expand. We hoped to get 800 taps in place last year, still using our 2x6 WSE and the 250 Hobby RO. Unfortunately we made a lot of headway on the infrastructure, but not getting the lines up and taps in, too many projects. So this year we are building a new sugarhouse, setting up a new evaporator, and adding the 400-600 taps to get started this year.

In our research we found a little more width will contribute far more than a little more length in evaporator size. Most everybody will quickly recommend the addition or upgrade of an RO before a new evaporator. You will definitely get a bigger bang for your buck with the RO. We could not upgrade the evaporator without a new sugarhouse because there was no room unless we went to a 3x6 (yes three by six). I would recommend the RO first. With the size of the property you will probably do the evaporator upgrade too in a few years. Get the RO. The recommendation for one of Ray's gas units is consistent with what I have seen over the years.

Good luck,

Mike

[minehart gap]

Another concern that you may come into would be days with little sap flow. You will not make enough permeate to clean the RO in these situations. Probably the best bet would be to go with a 125 RO (or around that size) and still have long boils on big flow days, but less time than you boil without the RO and eventually get a smokey lake or A&A sheet metal evaporator for bigger evaporation rate. Oh wait, that's my dream.