+ Reply to Thread
Results 1 to 10 of 10

Thread: to lift or not to lift...

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    madison ohio
    Posts
    78

    Default to lift or not to lift...

    I am thinking about lifting 400 taps around 17 ft. with a cdl sap lifting system. I currently have them pumped to the sugarhouse thru an electric releaser and gear pump, which at times has failed to do its job over the last 5 yrs. So I'm asking for input on switching or staying the course? Obviously changing over to anything would have a cost over staying, but I'm open to hear your thoughts....
    Thanks
    Matthew Cross
    Madison, Ohio
    400 taps on vacuum with surge sp-22
    200 buckets
    30 x 10 leader max w/ Pre-heater

  2. #2
    Haynes Forest Products Guest

    Default

    I would go with the weakest link theory. If you have all the systems in place to get the job done but have a faulty pump then upgrade the pump. A gear pump for sap transfer doesn't make sense to me.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Middlebury Center, PA
    Posts
    1,387

    Default

    My thinking would be that if you have electric pumping is better than a lift whether it is pumping with and internal pump or external pump set up on a float in the tank. I am guessing that you have an electric releaser and your using an external pump. Sounds to me like your weak link is your pump or your releaser. If it is your pump as your system is tight your getting maximum sap just your pump is failing to pump. If its your releaser then your not maximizing your sap production.

    I installed a Lapierre Sap lift and like it a lot however I chose it because I did not feel the number of taps (200) justified running electric for an electric releaser with internal pump or a releaser with any sort of external pump set up.
    Jared

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    Granville, PA
    Posts
    256

    Default

    Turn your gear pump into a cream machine and purchase a new sap pump.
    Matt,
    Minehart Gap Maple

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    South Colton, NY
    Posts
    573

    Default

    We lift 475 taps 16 feet with a CDL Dual lifter. It works a lot better than the old ladder we had. We also have a single CDL lifter that lifts 225 taps 12 feet and it works well also.

    We also have 3 Bernard dual mechanical releasers that drop into tanks which then pump to the shanty (NOT under vacuum). This is preferable to the lifts.

    I would get the pump off vacuum or put it inside the releaser instead of switching to a lift.
    3,100 taps
    60 cfm flood
    HC2
    5 by 14 oil

    Brian

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Westminster, VT
    Posts
    708

    Default

    Do the CDL sap lifter have to be drained during freezing temps?
    I was told the ladders tend to freeze first is this true as well?

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Bristol, VT
    Posts
    1,803

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by PerryFamily View Post
    Do the CDL sap lifter have to be drained during freezing temps?
    I was told the ladders tend to freeze first is this true as well?
    Sap lifters generally are designed to drain when the vac. to them is shut off. They use a small flapper valve that opens when there is no more vac. on the chamber so the sap can drain out. It works ok in practice but if you like to leave the vac. on 24/7 like me, then isolating the lifter so you can shut it off before it freezes full of sap is a good idea. I have mine in a small shelter that I heat with a lamp because it is right behind my sugarhouse and I only shut it off if it will be frozen for several days. I also removed the flapper valve because it would stay open after a freeze up.

    Lifting sap is a compromise. Pumping uphill will always be a more effective means if production is your primary goal.
    About 750 taps on High Vac.
    2.5 x 8 Intens-O-Fire
    Airtech 3 hp LR Pump
    Springtech Elite 500 RO
    14 x 24 Timber Frame SugarHouse
    16 x 22 Sap Shed w/ 1500 gal. + 700 gal. tanks
    www.littlehogbackfarm.com

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Hoosick Falls
    Posts
    2,006

    Default

    In our operation we pumped sap to the sugar house and haled using tanks and trucks and tractors. The weak link is a great decider on what to do.

    Now all our sap comes straight to the sugarhouse using ladders as needed. This was started back in the 1970's and has been expanded this decade to increase the efficiency of time spent and extra equipment to maintain and service.

    Yes ladders will freeze; but in our location there tends to be very little in the lines at the time of freezing due to the chill coming down the hill thru the bush. The ladder that freezes first is located 6 feet above the brook bed and 14 feet from the brook. This is where the cold air collects and flows down the brook bed.

    1/2" ladder risers thaw before our 5/16 risers.

    Lifters have a unique issue of the dump valve dumping sap from the system when vacuum is lost. This occurs when lines plug with slush or if a vacuum pump shuts down do to heat, low oil, power loss, or any number of additional issues that happen in a sap operation. I have also seen valves stuck open due to ice; and the entire system suffered from low vac until the issue was resolved.

    Lifters can also suffer mechanical failure that will disable the system as well. If a ladder plugs a riser then the other risers often will speed up their flow and take up the slack has been my experience over the years.

    Manifold ladders work far better than spider lifters, cost less, easier to clean and have better flow rates.

    I use and support injectors to increase the flow rates and vacuum past ladders when needed. On a tight tubing system injectors will work well; on a less than tight system injectors will not be needed.

    As you have found; pumps have their challenges and pit falls. As will all other options that will open the system to the chance of vacuum lost thru drain portals.

    Personally I would do two ladders to lift 17'. Reason for this is 2 short ladders will be far easier to build and maintain than a 17' and the air injected at the first will be utilized in the second ladder.

    Your sp-22 should be able to handle ladders with no issues.

    Good Luck!

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    madison ohio
    Posts
    78

    Default

    thanks everyone for the info an advice
    Matthew Cross
    Madison, Ohio
    400 taps on vacuum with surge sp-22
    200 buckets
    30 x 10 leader max w/ Pre-heater

  10. #10
    Haynes Forest Products Guest

    Default

    Glad we could help..................So is your head still spinning out of control? Let us know if we can add to your confusion in any way possible. Have a nice day.

+ Reply to Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts