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Thread: Cdl hobby ro

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    ontario
    Posts
    184

    Default Cdl hobby ro

    Looking for any reviews on these ro's. i have cdl dealer about 1.5 hrs away...
    2010 - 28 taps, homemade brick arch
    2011 - 421 taps, 2' x 6' homemade evaporator
    2012 - 276 taps
    2013 - 385 taps, new 2' x 6'
    2014 - 600 taps, new 7" short bank filter press

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    ontario
    Posts
    184

    Default Ro

    I live in Ontario Canada... anyone recommend a good ro? Is it worth considering a used one?
    2010 - 28 taps, homemade brick arch
    2011 - 421 taps, 2' x 6' homemade evaporator
    2012 - 276 taps
    2013 - 385 taps, new 2' x 6'
    2014 - 600 taps, new 7" short bank filter press

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    North Augusta
    Posts
    69

    Default

    Hi

    I would recommend starting with a used one, merely because of the cost, if you can find one that is. I have a commercial RO and built another as well. Ro's are not that complicated when you break it down.

    Feed pump
    Sap filter
    High pressure pump
    1 or 2 membranes
    Maybe a recirc loop
    Some plumbing to connect it all up

    I was able to build a 330 GPH ro for about 2500-3000 all stainless fittings including the pumps. The same RO from a commercial supplier would be about 9000

    Good luck. I can guarantee once you use an RO you will never boil straight sap again that's fine dam sure
    Powered by 3X8 Lapierre Waterloo Small
    with 2011 volcano oil fired burner
    330 GPH RO
    736 TAPS - Pipeline
    Siro filter
    2 kids and 1 Stupid jack Russell Terrier
    1 beagledor (beagle/lab mix) "Remi"
    "memories of the old way"
    Kioti CK27
    Facebook Halladaymaple

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Location
    Eagle Mills, NY
    Posts
    8

    Default

    Halladay: what membranes are you running and at what psi? what is your permeate rate/membrane?

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    North Augusta
    Posts
    69

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by neil2fish View Post
    Halladay: what membranes are you running and at what psi? what is your permeate rate/membrane?
    I use MES 4x40 membranes. I run 250 psi. Sorry I don't know the flow rates of membranes, however i look to match my evaporator boil rate of 1 gallon a minute. In doing this I get to 8.0%
    Powered by 3X8 Lapierre Waterloo Small
    with 2011 volcano oil fired burner
    330 GPH RO
    736 TAPS - Pipeline
    Siro filter
    2 kids and 1 Stupid jack Russell Terrier
    1 beagledor (beagle/lab mix) "Remi"
    "memories of the old way"
    Kioti CK27
    Facebook Halladaymaple

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Thetford, VT
    Posts
    213

    Default

    We have been running a CDL Hooby RO 250 for the last four years. It has worked great, that is until we screwed up and did not drain it properly at the end of a long day. We had to replace the high pressure pump. We used a couple rebuilt pumps. They worked for short time. Our dealer support is great. They loaned us a used CDL Hobby 250 and worked on ours. We were concerned at first and relieved to find the recommended replacement part is a new high pressure pump. The rebuilt units were not holding up well.

    Other than that hiccup, which was initiated by user error, I would strongly recommend a CDL Hobby RO 250. You will need a 20 AMP circuit to run it (USA). You will need to have 250 gallons of permeate to clean it. Rinse for 120-125, wash with about 5 gallons with soap, rinse with the rest. We started using the RO with 275 taps on a sap puller. At first we eyeballed the 125....the opportunity to expand the sugar bush was high and the cost to expand a 125 to 250 was more than the $500 difference between the two. We did some math and figured we could have enough permeate to clean the 250. Well go time came and honestly I was a little concerned. On short runs in cold weather we waited an extra day to boil. Once the season got going and I kept the cleaning to 250 gallons no problems. One we went beyond 300 taps and then to full vacuum there is not a concern. Basically take 300 gallons of sap (2% for easy math). The RO will remove 50% (by volume of permeate (water)). Leaving 150 gallons of 4% concentrate (sap). We ran the sap through a second time leaving us with 75 gallons of 8% concentrate to boil. Take the 300-75 gallons and you have 225 gallons. Not quite enough for cleaning. Step it up to 350 and you have enough at 262.5 gallons of permeate for cleaning using the above theory. Now with 500-700 gallons of sap to process I often will run 150 gallons through the first rinse and then wash using about 5 gallons with soap, and then rinse with what I have left. I have been told you cannot over rinse a membrane. Our membranes are still running strong after 4 years. Search for posts by me as I have made several references to our Hobby RO 250. This year we will hopefully (running out of time) will have about 800 taps (up from 400) to run through the RO. Next year we are going to upgrade to a CDL 600 along with a new evaporator.

    Good luck,

    Mike
    Tapping since 1985 (four generations back to early to mid 1900s). 200-250 taps on buckets and then tubing in the mid 90s. 2013- 275 taps w/sap puller 25 gal. 2014-295 taps w/sap puller 55 ga. (re-tapped to vacuum theory) 2015-330 taps full vac. 65 gal, 2016-400 taps 105 gal, 2017-400 taps 95 gal. 2018-additional 800' mainline and maybe 400 new taps for a total near 800 taps. 2x6 Leader WSE (last year on it) supported by a 250 gph RO.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    ontario
    Posts
    184

    Default Cdl ro

    Thanks so much for the info... I am sitting around 6-700 taps on vacuum so it sounds like the cdl 250 would match up great! Just need to find a used one I could afford in Ontario.
    2010 - 28 taps, homemade brick arch
    2011 - 421 taps, 2' x 6' homemade evaporator
    2012 - 276 taps
    2013 - 385 taps, new 2' x 6'
    2014 - 600 taps, new 7" short bank filter press

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Thetford, VT
    Posts
    213

    Default

    If you look at your gallons of sap per day and have enough, and enough money, you may want to look at a larger unit if you plan to expand. Whatever the size RO is the minimum amount of permeate for cleaning. Last year when it was cooler (early) we would get about 700 gallons of sap in 1 1/2-2 days. With this amount we could start the RO at about 7am and finish clean up around 2pm with about 10-13 gallons of syrup. This is with the 250 and a 2x6 (no extras on it). We are hoping to hit 800 taps this year and anywhere from 1-1200 the next. We set the goal of the infrastructure (mainline, pump line, and ready for vacuum line) to get the 800 and then continue to expand that line so we would have enough sap for the 3x10 and a 600 gph RO next year. It is my Father and I and we have quite a few projects on our plate as it is and figure get the source of sap this year and build and expand next.
    Tapping since 1985 (four generations back to early to mid 1900s). 200-250 taps on buckets and then tubing in the mid 90s. 2013- 275 taps w/sap puller 25 gal. 2014-295 taps w/sap puller 55 ga. (re-tapped to vacuum theory) 2015-330 taps full vac. 65 gal, 2016-400 taps 105 gal, 2017-400 taps 95 gal. 2018-additional 800' mainline and maybe 400 new taps for a total near 800 taps. 2x6 Leader WSE (last year on it) supported by a 250 gph RO.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Cayuta NY
    Posts
    720

    Default

    Not to throw a wrench in your plan but, with 6-700 taps on vacuum I think you will want a bigger RO. Unless you have a fair amount of free time during the season to let the RO run before you start boiling. Last year I ran 500 taps on vacuum, I originally was going to purchase an MES dolly 2 post machine but after talking with Frank and Clayton I went with a 3 post 300gph machine. I believe the CDL machine and the MES machine are in design the same. Both use a procon vane pump as a feed and high pressure pump and both have a secondary recirculation pump. For me the largest sap run I had to process in an evening was just over 1000 gallons of sap. I would collect the first load of sap and start the RO, letting it recirculate into the raw sap tank to bring the sugar up, usually this process took about 2 hours, and would bring the sap to about 3.5-4 brix. Then I would switch the valves to the feed tank and bring the sap to 7-8 brix. To match my evaporator I needed to run 1.5 gpm on the concentrate side. By doing this I would boil no more than 4 hrs during the biggest runs. So food for thought, How long do you have to wait on the RO, and How long do you want to spend boiling.
    Jeff

    470 taps
    Kinney KS-15 High Vac with Bernard Single Releaser
    Leader 2x6 Patriot raised flue
    Leader 2x4 Steamaway
    Wildfire arch
    MES Dolly 300 3 post RO
    Sheets 5" Filter Press with air pump
    and still lookin to get bigger

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    ontario
    Posts
    184

    Default Ro

    Good info... I would love to get a bigger ro but not sure I can afford it... the hobby ones seem to run around the $5-6000 range. I would love to check out the mes units but I live in Ontario and not sure what I would do about parts and service
    2010 - 28 taps, homemade brick arch
    2011 - 421 taps, 2' x 6' homemade evaporator
    2012 - 276 taps
    2013 - 385 taps, new 2' x 6'
    2014 - 600 taps, new 7" short bank filter press

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