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Thread: Sap leaking from taps

  1. #11
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    Ive noticed lots of times when I tap that the tree looks wet around the hole right after I tap but then it soon goes away. Especially on smooth bark smaller trees. I first thought maybe I was messing up and a mainline was froze backing up the sap but its happened often enough that I kind of layed it up to maybe kind of like a bruising or something when you tap. Sounds nuts but don't know why. Soon goes away and has no real adverse affect. I use only the best bits and drill on high speed and I think I pretty much have the hang of proper tapping. I don't know why it does it. I never see any drips though or vacuum leaks associated. Maybe that's what he sees. Theron

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moser's Maple View Post
    I thought it was recommended to tap on high speed to prevent less wobble when drilling the hole? Trying to put my fingers on the source
    Jake Glen Goodrich (in seminar on Lapierre Video) says tap at least 2000 rpms and same speed all the way in and out. He says if the drill has 2 speeds use highest if it has 3 speeds use middle.

    I think he is seeing exactly what Theron is talking about more of wet spot. I have had this in the past after tapping and in a day or so its gone.
    Last edited by unc23win; 01-11-2015 at 07:21 AM.
    Jared

  3. #13
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    Higher rpms are better for a straight and true hole. If you use a stop on the bit, and support the drill with two hands, perhaps even leaning your elbow on the tree, and of course use a tapping bit you should end up with a clean hole that won't leak. As other suggested, be careful with red maples to not drive the spout too hard.

    I too find that for a day or two after tapping a tree when the sap is running, there may be a wet spot around the taphole. A perpetual leak is different.
    About 750 taps on High Vac.
    2.5 x 8 Intens-O-Fire
    Airtech 3 hp LR Pump
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  4. #14
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    Like most I had split and leaking taps when I started, but rarely see more than a wet spot around a tap now. what i learned was get the drill up to RPM before you push . I don't stick my drill to the tree and push until it is running. It's all one motion continuous in and out. I may run my bit back in once to clean, but that's it. I usually cut a small green twig and and fray the end and swab out the hole with that. I used to split some trees because I carried a framing hammer to set taps. I now have what is almost a toy or tack hammer and when the tap seats that little hammer will bounce off that tap like a spring. It takes away the variance of listening for the proper thud. I'm sure there are better ways, but for a small hobby guy I think I do pretty well.

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moser's Maple View Post
    I thought it was recommended to tap on high speed to prevent less wobble when drilling the hole? Trying to put my fingers on the source
    On The older guns you had t use high to get to a speed that would provide a good clean hole by removing debris. The issue with high on the new guns that do 20,000 rpm and more is that you actually have a much higher chance of wobble and walking of a bit. The other issue is the high speed creates a large amount of friction on the wood as you are coming out of the hole and causes to things to occur: heating of the woods capillary cores and the grinding affect of the wood chips.

    CDL's & Brandon Precision tappers have a specialized Dewalt Drill that is a 12K high speed, to reduce damage to the hole. Due to the design of the unit, to set against the tree, to make a consistent hole; the unit is supported by the tree. So as long as the operator holds the unit in place high speed will not wobble a straight bit and the spring loaded head removes the bit in a rapid cleaning stroke and the cool run bit protects the hoe.



    If we think of the speed of: the bit brace...60 rpm on a fit person.
    The gas drill we used had a top speed of 3000 Rpm at full throttle and stopped rotating when the bit was not depressed to illuminate the grinding of the chips.
    Then we have the latest tapping bit with the fluted spirals to reduce friction on the hole wall.

    I recall at a seminar many years back; the answer to why not use a fostner bit...the smooth body of the cutting circumference wood sear the holes edge and greatly reduce sap flow. The speed of the gas units was designed to make a cool, chip free hole, when using the tapping bit made for the unit. The manufacture also added that a rapid bit speed could make poorer holes from excessive bit wobble.

    When I am tapping I oftern do set to high speed but only depress the trigger part way to keep speed low and high out of the tree for a moment to cast off all debris.

    I was most impressed by a specialists comment: "Treat the hole well and it will treat you well."

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by BreezyHill View Post
    The issue with high on the new guns that do 20,000 rpm and more is that you actually have a much higher chance of wobble and walking of a bit.
    20,000 RPM? Is this typo by chance? Is that a cordless drill? From what I have seen of Bosch, Makita, DeWalt the fastest is like 2200 RPMs. Glenn Goodrich in his Lapierre seminar recommended 2,000 rpms.
    Jared

  7. #17
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    Got to be a typo, or else Breezy Hill has access to some serious cordless drills.

    The last time I had my hands on a precision tapper, which is an awesome concept, it was coupled with a typical Dewalt cordless. Perhaps that has changed, but the bit was not spinning at 12,000rpm. Now they are actually selling it as a separate unit to adapt to your own drill.

    Another worthwhile investment is a real tapping mallet. I have been using the one made by Loac for a few years now and really like it. I also really like their spout puller.
    About 750 taps on High Vac.
    2.5 x 8 Intens-O-Fire
    Airtech 3 hp LR Pump
    Springtech Elite 500 RO
    14 x 24 Timber Frame SugarHouse
    16 x 22 Sap Shed w/ 1500 gal. + 700 gal. tanks
    www.littlehogbackfarm.com

  8. #18
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    Only use tapping bits, never a wood boring or metal boring one from a hardware store. They ARE different and they cut cleaner holes. I use 2 speed cordless drills and only use high speed. Be careful not to wobble the drill. Then tap in with a light tap. I use 7" lineman's pliers, using the flat side to hammer, usually 3-4 gentle taps, then the sound changes, don't tap anymore. You can also use a light wt hammer like a tack hammer, or a tapping hammer with a nylon head.
    Dave Klish about 1320 taps in '15, doing fewer each year, about 450 planned for 2020 (and after?)
    2012 Mahindra 36 HP 4x4/ loader/cab/heat/AC:-)
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  9. #19
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    Will the DSD tapping hammer from Maple Guys work with 7/16 metal spiles? Would it be worth getting one? Ted

  10. #20
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    I've had that wet stop around the tap as well. I asked an older gentlemen that did has done some studies with Cornell with his woods about that wetness around the tap. what he explained to me is that a hairlines cracks in the outer membrane of the tree. What causes this is either a dull bit, movement when starting the drilling proses, or your taping the taps in just a hair to much. But lose of sap is nothing. I was told not to worry about it.
    2011 55gallon drum evaporator 25 buckets;2012 shanty, and 2 1/2x8 evaporator, 200 buckets;2013 400 buckets; 2014 752 buckets 250gph RO, filter press;2015 1000 taps on line ; 2016 sold equipment, sold sap; 2017 sold sap; 2018 logged woods, added another sugar bush, 250 taps on high vac, 2x6 leader with max flu, new MES dolly 300, made 138 gal syrup; 2019 new CDL 600 expandable, new Wes filter press , bigger generator, 500 taps made 110 gal syrup; 2020 800 taps new vacuum pump.

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