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Thread: BUSCH Rotary claw dry pump?

  1. #1
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    Default BUSCH Rotary claw dry pump?

    I am looking to buy another vacuum pump for my new set-up. I was alway's told the Busch rotary claw pump was the best. CDL no longer is selling this pump. I am now being told that if any sap should get into this pump the claws will expand and kill the pump for good. I have always been told that there is no fixing this pump once it dies. How many of you Traders use this kind of pump? What do you think of it. I thought Dr. Tim once said that PMRC uses these pumps and they swear by them (although i might be wrong). I like the fact that is uses less power and is small and compact yet giving very high vacuum. I really like the fact that it is not oil or water cooled. What are you're thoughts everyone? Thanks in advance.

    Spud

  2. #2
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    Jan 2005
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    Allegheny National Forest
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    spud, I bought a 51 cfm Busch pump for this season. So far it has performed flawlessly. Mine has a vfd and a single phase to three phase converter running it along with a Johnson temp control. It is true that you should not get water in one. However, there are ways to ensure that you do not. I have a manual and electric moisture traps ahead of my pump. The electric trap will shut the pump off. Call Lapierre in Swanton. They come pretty much plug and play. All you have to do is connect the power.

  3. #3
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    UVM Proctor Maple Research Center, Underhill Ctr, VT
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    Yes, we have two of the Busch (model 1142-3) pumps at UVM PMRC. Advantages....high vacuum, good CFM removal at high vacuum (not the best, but quite good), low maintenance, quiet, small, no oil or water to deal with, VFD-controlled. Disadvantages.....cost, catastrophic failure if you pull sap through them.

    So basically it comes down to the need to have a bullet-proof moisture/liquid trap system. We use a mechanical trap followed by the electric moisture trap. I've been told that there is a slight possibility that they can be repaired onsite if the damage wasn't too severe, and a reasonable possibility of factory repair, but that the pump will be out of commission for the season in that case.

    We have used a wide variety of vacuum systems here over the years, everything from 3/16" natural vacuum, to sap pullers, dairy pumps, vane pumps, liquid ring pumps, and now the rotary claw pumps. A lot depends upon what you want out of it, what you want to spend to get it, and what sort of maintenance you're comfortable with. Since none of us actually live at PMRC (it just feels that way sometime), low maintenance and low operating supervision is very high on the list of desired attributes. We do still use some LR (oil-cooled) pumps for certain research areas (so we can keep the production bush taps separate from the research taps), and Tim Wilmot actually bought a Sap Puller this year to see about using low vacuum pumps to augment natural vacuum in 3/16" lines.
    Dr. Tim Perkins
    UVM Proctor Maple Research Ctr
    http://www.uvm.edu/~pmrc
    https://mapleresearch.org
    Timothy.Perkins@uvm.edu

  4. #4
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    Thanks guy's for the information. Sounds like the double moisture trap set-up is the key to keeping the pump safe. Dave Y I will call Tom this week and see what he has to say. Thank you again.

    Spud

  5. #5
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    Feb 2005
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    northern n.y.
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    So in your opinion & experience Dr.Tim what is the overall least maintenance,and highest vac level pump to get?I was thinking of a busch but not any more.I run 27" of vac. and want a relatively bullet proof pump.
    Thanks,Lee
    3x12 D&G Champion, 1100 taps w/27" of vac.New in 2013 600gph RO. 10 buckets for the kids.

  6. #6
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    Mar 2008
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    Canterbury, NH
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    We installed a 3 hp BUSCH pump last season. It is quieter and uses less power than the liquid ring pumps we were using before. No cooling water or oil needed. The unit runs cool to the touch all season long. The VFD speed control with the vacuum transducer is way more sensitive to vacuum level than a regular vacuum gauge or by feeling how much air is blowing out of the pump. A quick glance at the VFD digital readout will tell you how tight your system is. We bought our pump after the 2012 season some shopping around and asking for competitive bids form the dealers lead to a 30% discount off the regular price. I was surprised to find that Leader offered the best price delivered to us by our local dealer. The thing is quite heavy.
    http://www.northfamilyfarm.com

    Tim
    2,500 taps on two pipelines
    Busch Vacuum Pump
    MES Three Phase Three Post RO
    2X10 Leader Vortex Max Flue pan, Enhanced Steamaway
    Electricity made with wind and solar

  7. #7
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    I do not belevie that there is such a thing as a bullet proof pump. liquid ring pumps need to be cooled and if you are using water for a seal you have to worry a bout freezing. oil flood also need to be cooled and then there is the issue of leaking oil. So far this is what I have excperinced with my busch pump. the pump comes on at 32degs and shuts of at 31degs. It makes 27hg if your woods is tight.once it makes the set vacuum level it will idle back. when the extractor dumps the pump ramps up to make any lost vacuum. the pump runs cool to the touch. I have two moisture traps that will shut the pump down if sap is sucked back to the pump. There is an oil level that needs maintained , however, I dont think it will use much. My pump is 4.5 miles from my sugar house I do not have to go turn it on or off. I think this is a very reliable system. I would recommend it to any one willing to pay the price.

  8. #8
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    Jan 2012
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    Middlebury Center, PA
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    Dave Y I think everyone would love to have it as easy as you described when it comes to pump maintenance and set up. I was just wondering what are you calculating your cfms per tap at? 1 per hundred 2 per hundred or more?

    Thanks
    Jared

  9. #9
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    Apr 2009
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    Bristol, VT
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Y View Post
    I do not belevie that there is such a thing as a bullet proof pump. liquid ring pumps need to be cooled and if you are using water for a seal you have to worry a bout freezing. oil flood also need to be cooled and then there is the issue of leaking oil. So far this is what I have excperinced with my busch pump. the pump comes on at 32degs and shuts of at 31degs. It makes 27hg if your woods is tight.once it makes the set vacuum level it will idle back. when the extractor dumps the pump ramps up to make any lost vacuum. the pump runs cool to the touch. I have two moisture traps that will shut the pump down if sap is sucked back to the pump. There is an oil level that needs maintained , however, I dont think it will use much. My pump is 4.5 miles from my sugar house I do not have to go turn it on or off. I think this is a very reliable system. I would recommend it to any one willing to pay the price.
    Why not just leave the pump on 24/7? It seems that this turning on and turning off according to a temp. sensor is far more complex than necessary. Besides, just because it is 31 at your pump does not mean it is 31 in the woods where it matters. I have been getting runs here recently when it is below freezing according to the thermometer but the sun is warming the trees and the sap flow is melting the ice in the lines. These aren't great runs but it all adds up to more syrup. One extra gallon of syrup will more than pay for the cost of the electricity.

    Trusting a temp. sensor, or even yourself for that matter, to know when the sap will run decreases your productivity in the long run. Turn it on at the beginning of the season and turn it off when the peepers start peeping.
    Last edited by GeneralStark; 03-26-2014 at 09:15 PM.
    About 750 taps on High Vac.
    2.5 x 8 Intens-O-Fire
    Airtech 3 hp LR Pump
    Springtech Elite 500 RO
    14 x 24 Timber Frame SugarHouse
    16 x 22 Sap Shed w/ 1500 gal. + 700 gal. tanks
    www.littlehogbackfarm.com

  10. #10
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    Nov 2010
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    Barnet, VT
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeneralStark View Post
    Why not just leave the pump on 24/7? It seems that this turning on and turning off according to a temp. sensor is far more complex than necessary. Besides, just because it is 31 at your pump does not mean it is 31 in the woods where it matters. I have been getting runs here recently when it is below freezing according to the thermometer but the sun is warming the trees and the sap flow is melting the ice in the lines. These aren't great runs but it all adds up to more syrup. One extra gallon of syrup will more than pay for the cost of the electricity.

    Trusting a temp. sensor, or even yourself for that matter, to know when the sap will run decreases your productivity in the long run. Turn it on at the beginning of the season and turn it off when the peepers start peeping.
    What do you have for a releaser? If a mechanical releaser is full when it freezes it sucks the next morning.
    Well actually it does not suck at all.
    William
    950 taps
    3 X 12 Thor pans on a Brian Arch
    CDL 600 expandable

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