Purchasing Sap? What to pay...

[jim finen]

Are there any NY Producers that are purchasing sap? If you plan to sell the syrup you make in bulk, what would you pay to someone that you purchase the sap from?

If you are planning on selling your syrup bottled, how much would you pay for the sap that you purchase?

I have been given a chart that shows what the "bulk" pricing per gallon of sap should be paid but if you were to pay that then you wouldn't be making any money. I have also had someone say to pay a flat rate per gallon of syrup that you make from their sap.

Any feedback would be greatly appreciated.

Jim and Margaret

[maple flats]

The Maple Digest publishes a suggest price list every year in the Jan. issue. Last year I sold sap and was paid by that and this year I hope to buy sap and will use that chart. It is based on a 50/50 split of the wholesale value of the syrup that will be made from it, thus it is a sliding scale based on sugar % of the raw sap. I understand some pay less and some pay more.
Do you plan to sell or buy? I think the Maple Digest price is fair, but as your production capability increases you might want to pay more. Some ask why pay more than others might pay. Those buying sap are making more product without adding to your work in the woods and the more you pay, the more the seller will want to expand his production. A seller who does not see a profit will soon lose interest. Those buying sap make their money in the sugarhouse.
Dave

[jim finen]

Dave,
You make some valid points. However, when we reviewed the numbers from the digest last year we found those prices to be high vs. the cost that we had into production. Yes, it is less work in the woods to obtain that sap, however, it is more costly for fuel to boil, jugs, electricity and other costs incurred by the producers up front. I do not think it should be a 50/50 split when the seller is not having to put in as much time and/or materials that the buyer has to. On top of that, the buyer is paid right after the season. The producer has to sell his syrup before being paid and may end up sitting on it for 6 months to a year before seeing his return.
We purchase sap and found that paying $10/gallon of syrup made from the sap was a fair price. Since the bulk rate is lower this year from last year, some say that the $10 was too high. That is why we are asking for different thoughts from people.
Thank you for your input, any other thoughts you may have will be greatly appreciated.

Jim and Margaret

[wiam]

Why would anybody pay a different price depending on where the syrup will be sold? When the syrup comes out of the evaporator it is pretty much bulk. Your time, containers, propane and marketing is what makes the retail price.

[jim finen]

William, yes when it comes out it is all bulk....but do you feel that a 50/50 split is fair? The bulk rate around here is apx. $28.00/gal. You would be willing to sell yours at $14.00/gal and then have to pay for all your expenses? My unit costs me $4.00 in fuel for every gallon I make...Not leaving me much profit if that were the case.

[spud]

Here in Franklin County Vermont people pay between 60-70% of bulk price for sap. That means sap that test 2% gives you .48 cents per gallon if your being paid 65%. We have one neighbor that pay's .55 cents per gallon for sap of any sugar content. The one thing they all have in common is they are making a profit. Now i have been told by some Traders that some operations may not be as efficient as others. Some Traders feel that a not so efficient sugarhouse should not have to pay as much for the sap they buy. My feeling is that if you do not have an efficient set-up then you (probably) should not be buying sap from others. A sap seller should not have to take less because of your poor set-up. If there is only one buyer in a 100 mile radius of your home then they still should be paying what the Big Boy's are paying up north. Their set-up cost are no different then the big operations up north. What i think happens is they know you have to sell to them because there is no other buyer's around. So all they do is take advantage of the little guy because they know they can. It's no different then (some) mom and pop stores that have been screwing people for years and then Wal-mart comes to town. I agree with Maple Flats when he said you might want to pay a little more for sap. This will encourage smaller producers to add more taps to their operations and everyone makes a little more money out of the deal. If you treat people fair you will gain respect and your business will prosper. For those of you that say you cannot make a profit when paying 60-70% for sap i say you can if you know what your doing. Merry Christmas to all.

Spud

[SWEETER CREATIONS]

Jim : There is alot of things that person has put out also the cost of the tubbing a vacuum system delivery to the sugar house etc . He has spent more than 10.00 a gallon if he set up this bush with new equipment. I think a 50/50 split is more than fare . So I'll ask you do you want to work for 4 dollars a gallon ? Mike