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Hello all,
I boiled for my first time ever yesterday and i burned it. Where did i go wrong i had 40 gallons of sap and ended up with nothing. My pan only boiled in the center two dividers not the out two is that wrong. Also do i pull some out when it gets close to 217 degrees then add more i tryed to keep 1.5 to 2 inches in pan at all times. If anyone could help me out i would really be thankful. Thanks again
Chad (captaincpfd)
Captain
How big is your pan? Is it a flat pan with dividers? Mine is 19"x39" Small by my standard (Now any way) A month ago I thought it was going to be big enough. It took 40 gallons of sap just to sweeten the pan to get it to the point I would be able to draw off something. Need another 40 to get a gallon of syrup off of it. And at least 20 to Let the arch burn out with out burning the pan. We started with 200 of gallons of sap this past weekend. It took 12 hrs to get the first gallon boiled finished and in pint jugs started with sweet pans the next moning was able to draw off 4 times at 220 degrees and still had to finish it to density on the stove. Got two Gallons this time. Left the pans sweet and some sap in a pal. My guess is you didn't have enough sap!!!! As for the boil center only. Wood fired arch?? If so full, fast, dry wood and fire it often. Every 8-10 I was feeding it some times faster to keep a good boil.
so what your saying i didnt have a hotten enough fire under it. I had around 30 to 40 gallons of sap my pan is 2x3 G.H. Grimm I found that only the center would boil and it burned.Thanks for any imput you can give a beginner first time at making maple syrup. I know the first time could be good or bad but, thats water under the bridge. Hopefully i can get enough input to make my next time successful. thank you chadQuote:
Originally Posted by gator330
I'm saying you didn't have enough sap to be boiling on a 2X3. You need to add sap as you go. A little all the while and more when you draw off. I wouldn't fire that up unless I had 100 gallons to make a day of give and take. Being shure till you get a feel for it that you have plenty of sap to flood it if things go bad. A pal of sap at hand is also important. Meter the sap to it so that you can keep it at 2" deep till you can bring it down some and be comfortable at 1 1/2 inches. Once it startes to turn it can turn fast and burn easy. Need to feed it as the steam comes off. It will move throught the cannals by density as the less dense Sap comes in the more dense moves away from it and ends up at the draw off. As for the fire YES, hot and fast burn. heat! heat!! heat!!! All over the fire box side to side top to bottom FIRE!!!! That will get a boil going all over the pan.
You need more sap. I ran out yesterday and had to put the fire out....Fast, good thing there was plenty of snow around.
I haven't take a picture of this year's setup but I'd suggest something similar for you. I built a stand (probably over built and way too tall), next to the evaporator, this holds the 100gal stock tank I'm using to feed the evaporator. The stand's just built out of 4x4's and plywood. The tank had a 1 1/4" bung. I reduced this down to 3/4, and put in a ball valve. Than took some 3/8 copper tubing and ran that down to the flue pan. I can just crack the ball valve and get a trickle that doesn't kill the boil. However I'm going to rig up a preheater pan out of a steam tray pan, to gain some more gph. Also keep a 5 gallon bucket of sap handy to quench a burning emergency.
The 30 - 40 gallons of sap will cook down to less then a gal of syrup. If you get down to that you won't have enough to cover the bottom of your pan. and will turn to burnt sugar in a second. Flow is very important a head tank and valve so you can let a little in to keep the pan in sap. The goal is sap on one side syrup on the other in between in the middle. More sap = more taps= more syrup = more time = more wood see a trend here MORE! MORE!! MORE!!!
Hey captain,I only had about 60 gallpns on sat to work with,on a 2x4 pan
so as I got down to the last 6 gallons I didnt feed the fire any more had about a inch in pans, I ended up pulling most of the fire out of the homemade arch, because it I were to draw it all off into pail the pan will scorch instantly, then finished on gas burner got about a gallon.so youll have to do this If you have limited taps,and you want that syrup or wait and fire it up again with mor esap the next day good luck happy scrubing
I hope to get more sap next weekend, my 20 gallons are frozen outside. I am really stoked to do my first boil and now I know to STOP FEEDING THE FIRE when I run low on sap. Sorry to hear how the first boil turned out for you capt. I have been following your posts as I too am a "greenhorn" and know how excited you were to get started.
captaincpfd, it gets better. They are right. Yesterday I had 175 gal of sap to boil. First boil of the season. On my 3x8 I started to boil with about 1.25" in each pan. I quit feeding the fire when I have 18 gal of sap left in my feed tank (a clear site tube teed into the feed line with marks I made to know when to quit feeding the fire.) I was just getting close to first draw when shutdowm time came, hence no syrup yet. Will not boil until likely Saturday. It will just wait because temps are too cold for sap to run.
As for burning it you must have gotten too low sometime. As you gain experience things will get better. I suggest you make some sort of feed line and start with a mark at lets say 5 gal as when to stop firing. Let the rig stop evaporating and see if you have more sap than needed to keep your desired depth. To learn 2" is good, as you get experience you should slowly lower the depth til maybe 1.25 or even 1" deep. The shallower the faster the boil AND the faster problems need attention, just get good at deeper and over several days reduce depth. As for only boiling in center, some questions. Is your rig outside with cold air hitting the sides? Is your arch insulated or firebricked? When I had a 2x3 size I found it best to fire every 6 minutes, split the wood wrist size. I now fire every 5 minutes. Give it all the air it will take. Now for the best part, you have burned a pan so by definition you are now officially a syrup maker, and you got it over quickly!
I got some great advice on here I had touble getting started to,I also had about 40 gal to strt and had to pull fire out wthout getting anything,boiled about 100gal this weekend and went much better had my emergency buket and shutdown with that got about inch and half of liquid in evap now,I have good dry wood split pretty small,and fired quite often,we have a 18x48 D@G so were close to same size Good Luck
Captain: The great thing about this sport is everything you do is something you have done in the past. Its not rocket science it only seems that way. Ever cook Bacon and within 1 min it goes from just almost right to burnt. Potatoes boil over and you didnt shut the fire off in time and it was slow to respond.
When it comes to things are looking great to BURNT is You have 4 choices
1 turn off heat 2 remove from heat 3 add more liquid to cool down 4 think and plan ahead and let it slow cook till done.
Welcome to the world of success and failer you will soon have more success's than failers like in golf this IS WHAT KEEPS US COMEING BACK.
captian,
Sorry to hear about your burnt pan. But I have been boiling for about 50 years and I still burnt mine good on Friday night so it can happen. Did you check your pans for any high spots? I think you must have not had enough sap to keep pushing the syrup through. In hind site shut the fire down quicker next time where you still have a reserve of sap available to increase the pan depth. and the end of the boiling.
Regards,
Chris
captain- is your evaporator level ? you say you burnt the center section which ussaully means your evap isnt level
Chris thanks for the advise i'm beginning to think i didnt have enough sap to boil from the sounds of it. I leveled the arch and pan so i'm good there. I put fire brick up to the top but they were 2inches wide think that is my problem could it be they block off some of the out side i'm gonna remove them before the next boil. thanks chadQuote:
Originally Posted by Sugarmaker
My evaporator is inside a 10x14 building which is now my sugarshack as i told another gentlemen i may know now what my problem is i put 2inch brick all the way to the top of my arch. It blocks off some of the outside sections. Do you think this could be some of my problem also not enough sap on hand i wont do this again i learned from my mistake the first time. Thanks for the help and i like hearing your input. thanks chadQuote:
Originally Posted by maple flats
captain,
Last year I brought home 60 gallons of sap and started a fire on the 3 x 10 and used it to push out several gallons of WIP that was on the rig. The key is to know when you should stop firing so that you have enough sap to allow the evaporator to go to cold. A hot evaporator will continue to evaporate for hours after you stop stoking, if the fire brick are hot and or you have a big bed of coals.
Making syrup in the center section is a problem that I have had happen also. Usually do to not enough sap pushing the syrup. I did this on my very first boil in our new sugar house about 8 years ago. the preheater was air locked and was not providing enough sap. The center section made syrup faster due to the intense heat in that area of the fire box and 'walla' burnt syrup.
Chris
Ya i didnt know upfront about stop feeding the fire but that is a learning curve now i do thanks to all on here. I got out about 90 taps now put out some more today with the kids let them do all the work so they know how to do it had alot of fun doing it with them. It made there day doing all of it on there own. Well thanks for the input hopefully i will move forward now i got my burnt pan behind me and success from here on out. thanks again chad
sugarmaker thanks for the help i would boil down about 1/2inch then add to that out of my preheater pan back up to the 2inch mark or so i guess i thought i could boil a little to long didnt realize i should have left it in the pan till i got more to boil and finished off then thanks again chad
here is something to think on
When you start with your 40 gallons with sap at 2%, you want to raise that by 2% to 4% you've got to boil off 20 gallons
When you reach 65% and you want to boil a further 2% to hit 67. You only need to boil off about a cup of water. That will go real fast.
NEVER put the last of your sap in with the fire still burning.
All this will make you very jealous of the oil burner guys.
Click and its over.
Woodchuck like us gotta plan about a half our ahead.