New 18"x48" CDL. Have questions.

Hello,
My family's been at this maple thing since the 70's. Amature at best. From a Coleman stove with a pot, old "Lightning" arch with a 10' flat pan, block arch with a 2'x4' flat pan to a brand new CDL 18x48 with a 3 way flat pan as of a couple weeks ago.

I'm very impressed with the overall quality of the arch construction. Everything looks extremely well put together.
Attachment 16110


Here's where we are having some issues and hoping there are a few others with experience with this model. It's the insulation and fire brick installation. We were sent 60 half bricks and 5 12"x36"x1" sheets of insulation board.
Attachment 16111


I started installing the insulation based loosely on the 1 picture in the instruction manual even though the manual is for a larger sized, and slightly different unit. I started working up the ramp and towards the stack. Everything looking good.


I then started to do the sides near the door and noticed that the 1" insulation board came completely flush with the angle iron at the top. The manual's 1 picture shows the bricks sitting about 1/3 to 1/2 under the top angle iron.
Attachment 16112Attachment 16113


Next issue is that with the grate installed it is impossible to have the bricks slot in between the insulation board and the angle iron beside the grate. It the bricks sit on top of the angle iron. This does not seem right to me.
Attachment 16114

***Continued from above***


It also has the brick protruding into the door opening which does not make sense.
Attachment 16115


I split a couple of the insulation board scraps in half to test a theory... My theory is that this arch was engineered to use 1/2" insulation. With the insulation at 1/2" everything fits perfect. Bricks sit inside the top angle iron and the bottom ones sit tight into the bottom and are no longer in the way of the door.
Attachment 16116Attachment 16117


The local store simply claimed this was what it was and that maybe we were being picky. It was suggested that we taper (shave down) the front bricks so they don't get in the way when loading wood...


Does anyone here have a CDL 18x48? Care to give us a hand?


Thanks so much!

I have the same arch with the drop flue pan. I encountered all the same issues you did. I don't think the unit was designed with insulation in mind. I notched my bricks so they would fit and allow the grates to be removed using an angle grinder. Also, your grates are upside down. Place them vee up so that ash can collect in the vee and insulate the metal from the fire and prevent warping. I can take pictures later if you would find that helpful.

My mason came with 1/4" insulation board.

CDL has this video online, might help out a bit, where did you buy the evaporator Lanark? They should be able to help you out too. I've been in there before and seen evaporators ready to be shipped out already bricked and I'm sure they wouldn't send it out with issues like your having. Give them a call. If not call the one in monkland and talk to Rob. You can text him pictures too.

https://youtu.be/sxN0xxQBslg

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Originally Posted by ecolbeck

I have the same arch with the drop flue pan. I encountered all the same issues you did. I don't think the unit was designed with insulation in mind. I notched my bricks so they would fit and allow the grates to be removed using an angle grinder. Also, your grates are upside down. Place them vee up so that ash can collect in the vee and insulate the metal from the fire and prevent warping. I can take pictures later if you would find that helpful.

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Thanks. I'd love some pictures. You did use the 1" insulation? Did you use bricks from the ramp to the stack as well?

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Originally Posted by Bricklayer

CDL has this video online, might help out a bit, where did you buy the evaporator Lanark? They should be able to help you out too. I've been in there before and seen evaporators ready to be shipped out already bricked and I'm sure they wouldn't send it out with issues like your having. Give them a call. If not call the one in monkland and talk to Rob. You can text him pictures too.

https://youtu.be/sxN0xxQBslg

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That video, even though it's for the larger hobby model does indeed show the bricks sitting on top of grate angle iron and not slotted in beside it. I'm really surprised. Everything fits so much better with 1/2" insulation. When slotted in the bricks stack up to within 1" of the top rail. When seated on top of the bottom angle iron the bricks are over the rail by an inch meaning they would all have to be cut. No huge deal but seems odd. I may try to call the local spot again or better yet go in and have a chat.

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Originally Posted by anchorhd

My mason came with 1/4" insulation board.

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Any issues with it? Sides too hot or discoloured? Do you know the heat rating of the 1/4" insulation?

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Originally Posted by DrewCP

Any issues with it? Sides too hot or discoloured? Do you know the heat rating of the 1/4" insulation?

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Attachment 16126mine did discolor with only half brick installed

I have a Mason 2x4 with raised flue pan:

Attachment 16127

It came with 1/4" insulation which I installed. I bricked the bottom of the firebox with full bricks and the sides with splits. If you look along the bottom of the rail, I cut thin pieces to fit in a 1 inch gap. I should have probably just stuffed the space with some insulation. But it works fine.

Attachment 16128 Attachment 16129

I had to custom cut a significant number of bricks to get them to fit. I rented a wet saw and, after that didn't work, went out a bought a wet saw. Made the job a lot easier.

The arch gets hot, but you can touch it for a second and won't get burned.


Mark

Here is a picture of how I cut my bricks. You can see that the bricks protrude into the doorway opening. I haven't found that to be an issue. All of the lower bricks along the grate are notched (see lower arrow on picture). In addition the front and back bricks in the firebox have an additional notch (upper arrow) to allow the grate to be removed. I firebricked the entire inside of the arch because I bought it used and it came with bricks so I used them. All I did was add insulation underneath all of the brick. Attachment 16130

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Originally Posted by DrewCP

***Continued from above***


It also has the brick protruding into the door opening which does not make sense.
Attachment 16115


I split a couple of the insulation board scraps in half to test a theory... My theory is that this arch was engineered to use 1/2" insulation. With the insulation at 1/2" everything fits perfect. Bricks sit inside the top angle iron and the bottom ones sit tight into the bottom and are no longer in the way of the door.
Attachment 16116Attachment 16117


The local store simply claimed this was what it was and that maybe we were being picky. It was suggested that we taper (shave down) the front bricks so they don't get in the way when loading wood...


Does anyone here have a CDL 18x48? Care to give us a hand?


Thanks so much!

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I just set up and bricked my CDL 18x60. I found the bricks were tight At the bottom but I had room for 1/2" insulation blanket and bricks to fit on the inside of the cast frame, as on the left hand side of your boiler. Mine came with 1/2 inch insulation blanket, so I assume that is what they are bilt for. They had to be pushed in hard but didn't overhang as you show on the right hand picture.

I have had my first fire and boil, No discoloration only using 1/2" insulation blanket and bricks as of yet.

Thanks so much for everyone's input and experience. I think I'm going to go ahead and brick it as per the video and taper the front brick to keep it out of the door. I'm not super happy about it but can't get the 1/2" 1900-2300*f insulation board in time for this season. I'll post finished pictures later this week.

Kinda takes the warm and fuzzy feeling away from getting a brand new rig when you have to jimmy rig it together. They should already know this about it requiring 1/2" and if they are going to sell you the bricks they could at least give you the tapered cuts. Or a pattern. Kinda like when you buy a Woodstove the bricks come cut. This isn't the first rig they have sold. I would call them and tell them to get you the 1/2" right away or find it for you somewhere. If you were a big producer and had their $20,000 RO and needed a part they would had it to you the next day. Why are you any different. Still a customer spending good money. I hope they aren't charging you for the new insulation. It's their mistake not yours

Had a chance to actually go back up to the local CDL store with a dozen pictures on my phone to have a chat. Everything I'm doing is what everyone else does..... When I brought up the fact that everything fits way better with 1/2" insulation he agreed 100% but stated that people buying this type of evaporator were on a budget and would likely balk at paying another $100-150 to get the 1/2", same heat rating, insulation. I completely disagreed and suggested that the reason people buy this small evaporator is because they only have 50-75 trees but want a professional grade (but smaller) evaporator to work on!! There is no question that we would have gladly paid that money for the 1/2" insulation to ensure "fit and finish".
I'm stuck for this spring but will likely rip everything out this summer once I get a reliable lead on where to get the proper 1/2" insulation. It's really too bad, this arch is so well engineered, crafted and assembled. Selling it with the 1" insulation really takes away from final product.
Oh well, as long as it makes steam we'll be happy.

Here's how I bricked it. Pretty happy with how it turned out. I made all my cuts with a basic homeowner wet tile saw. Worked great.

Attachment 16267Attachment 16268

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DrewCP

Had a chance to actually go back up to the local CDL store with a dozen pictures on my phone to have a chat. Everything I'm doing is what everyone else does..... When I brought up the fact that everything fits way better with 1/2" insulation he agreed 100% but stated that people buying this type of evaporator were on a budget and would likely balk at paying another $100-150 to get the 1/2", same heat rating, insulation. I completely disagreed and suggested that the reason people buy this small evaporator is because they only have 50-75 trees but want a professional grade (but smaller) evaporator to work on!! There is no question that we would have gladly paid that money for the 1/2" insulation to ensure "fit and finish".
I'm stuck for this spring but will likely rip everything out this summer once I get a reliable lead on where to get the proper 1/2" insulation. It's really too bad, this arch is so well engineered, crafted and assembled. Selling it with the 1" insulation really takes away from final product.
Oh well, as long as it makes steam we'll be happy.

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Why would they not just sell you the 1/2" originally then? $150 is peanuts when your buying an evaporator. My guess is they just don't have or can't get the 1/2". What CDL location did you buy this from? I would get in contact with someone at CDL and find out what size the arch was designed to have. When spending big money on something that is sold by a huge and reputable maple dealer that has been in the business for a long time you expect that they can get a hobby arch right.
You can't go wrong using larger insulation though. It will hold more heat and sides might not discolour as much. That's one way to look at it.

Try this web site. Ceramic fiber online .com. They have everything.

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Originally Posted by Bricklayer

Why would they not just sell you the 1/2" originally then? $150 is peanuts when your buying an evaporator. My guess is they just don't have or can't get the 1/2". What CDL location did you buy this from? I would get in contact with someone at CDL and find out what size the arch was designed to have. When spending big money on something that is sold by a huge and reputable maple dealer that has been in the business for a long time you expect that they can get a hobby arch right.
You can't go wrong using larger insulation though. It will hold more heat and sides might not discolour as much. That's one way to look at it.

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There is no listing in the CDL catalogue for anything but the 1" stuff. I'll be honest, if the quality of the unit wasn't what it is I'd be way more vocal about this situation.
But again, I need to reiterate, we are completely satisfied with the unit. It is extremely well constructed and it does indeed make syrup! I don't want to discourage anyone from buying this unit from this company. I just think the fit and finish with 1/2" insulation would do justice to this great little units overall high quality build.

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Originally Posted by Flatpan1

Try this web site. Ceramic fiber online .com. They have everything.

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Thanks, That is one of the places I found the 1/2" stuff with the correct heat rating.