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I borrowed a neighbors 4WD 4 wheeler this year and so far I love it. I have an older 4WD Kubota tractor with AG tires. On frozen ground it's great. Once the ground thaws, not so much. Leaves too many deep ruts everywhere, especially through woods trails where you can't take a different track to avoid going through the same area over and over collecting sap. So for me, it's a small 300CC 4WD Quad.
But ultimately, I'd rather have an Argo or Max2, if I could afford either, and had wider trails.
Make sure you get the 4 x 4 on the tractor and ask to have the rear tires loaded. I had this done on my little JD and it makes a world of difference when getting around.
Nice, good tip - I am planning on a 4x4 tractor given I have many hills and slopes on our property. I also plan to use it for heavy duty tasks like moving snow banks and dragging the driveway.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pdiamond
When you weighted your tires, did you find that you had any issue with sinking into snow or leaving deep ruts?
I'm solidly in favor of four wheel drive also. It really helps in so many tasks, and when not needed just don't use it.
We have a tractor with four wheel drive with no loaded tires (jd). It does good, including for snow bank moving. We can always use the JD weights on the front to give a bit more traction there if needed. We just call them "the weights" but I think they may be called "suitcase weights" or something like that.
We also have a tractor with four wheel drive, WITH loaded tires (Kubota). It does great too and does much better in a soft field pulling an implement. Not better in the woods, makes deeper ruts. Not better all around the property, makes couple inch deep ruts except when the ground is bone dry and hard.
Just another opinion, others may differ, and your mileage may vary!
take care
Mark
No more than usual and I had the dealership do it. The rear tires are loaded with beet juice. That is what I meant by weighted rear tires, there is nothing extra on the rim.
I have a Massey Ferguson 1735 (36 hp) 4wd and I never loaded the tires and it does fine. Do you guys think the loaded tires make more ruts? Of course when I compared the specs to the same size John Deere the MF weighs 800 pounds more as is. That's why I bought it and had a better price. I have owned it going into its third year and it is a working beast. I had a 1968 ford 3000 2wd for 15 years before that and man it was like a gift from heaven getting this tractor.
I think sizing a sap hauler to the amount of sap you will be moving would be ideal. Our plan this year is to use a small trailer to haul a 275 ibc with the 2wd 1951 ferguson. We've used a grizzly atv in the past but sap volume keeps increasing. If the ground stays frozen we may use the kubota l48 and pallet forks, but thats usually only early season. The kubota also has r4 tires which are useless.
The lighter the vehicle the less damage it does to the ground. At 2800lbs the ferguson chained up goes anywhere and isn't to hard on the trails. Last year we used a carry all on it but the weight of sap hanging off the back so far back(100 gal +3" pump and hose) had the front tires of the ground constantly.
I stopped by the local John Deere dealer (bad idea)...and found this cherry 2018 or 2019 XUV 835M. It's got a power dump, roof front bumper and it looks like both rear and front locking diffs. Anyone have one of these?
They want $14k...seems reasonable. It's got like 100 hours on it.
Attachment 22045
My sister-in-law and her husband have one and they really like it. It seems to have a little more power than our Kubota
Interesting. There was both a Diesel and Gas model...this was the Gas one. The dealer said the diesel has more torque (duh) and the gas has more "top-end power."Quote:
Originally Posted by buckeye gold
My father had a fair amount of problems with his diesel John Deere. Not engine related but it left him walking home a few times. It is really loud and rattles. Not really enjoyable to ride in IMO. It is also leaves ruts as big as a small tractor.
I'm not sure if my SIL's is gas or diesel, my kubota is diesel
Did you put a down payment on it for them to hold it for you? ha ha
You can find left over models or demos if your patient and check a lot of dealers. We bought our Kubota that way it was a whole model year off, but they had used it as a demo and it had less than 10 hrs on it. We bought it for $2500.00 off sticker and still got full warranty. I had to drive over an hour to the dealer, but I'll drive an hour for $2500.00 anytime. That's probably what the JD is. They don't last long so decide fast or it'll be gone.
good adviceQuote:
Originally Posted by buckeye gold
We tapped out new sugar bush today for the first time and only a tiny portion of it at that, all on buckets.
I paid close attention to the different areas we were navigating and, with a couple inches of wet, loose snow, it was tough going in my ATV with even the dry weight of buckets, kids and tools in my tow behind trailer.
We have several spots in our 30 acres that have fairly steep inclines for short sections and the only vehicle that really had it easy was my neighbor's snowmobile.
For all those who have recommended various utility side-by-sides, are you easily traversing any steep sections? I'm assuming that is both with and without payload. I read several people who mentioned the heavier / diesel machines get bogged down due to their own weight in wet conditions.
We had 9 people out in the woods today and only 3 could ride out with equipment on our individual atvs and snowmobiles. I'd at least want to be able to bring my kids along for the ride as they get better - right now they right up front of me on the quad.
There is nothing that does well in the slop. The point where the snow is slushy, the ground has frost in it and the ground surface is just greasy. A 4wd tractor will go, but will tear the living heck out of things, a UTV will struggle and spin a lot but not make the ruts. A little weight in the UTV helps. Just put them in low range and go slower. There's a reason many sugaring people call it mud season as well as syrup season. That is one of the big advantages of tubing, you can collect all the sap in one spot and hopefully on solid ground. There are days you just have to avoid going in the bush. If I have to go I go early in the day when it's still stiff from the cold night. When I done buckets I collected as soon as I could see, while it was froze, if I didn't my woods would be destroyed. I just stay out once the sun turns it to slop.
Thanks, all good points - my work / life schedule doesn't allow me to get out into the woods early but it's a good point that you need to try to focus your efforts when the ground is sloppy. My long-term thinking is that I will tap for tubing and try to centralize the collection point to a single place as close to the sugar shack (TBD) as possible...maybe even pump from it / to it.Quote:
Originally Posted by buckeye gold
But, if I'm going to drop $15-20k on a machine for the woods, I'd want to be sure I can get out there.
Another option to consider is a Japanese Kei truck. Last fall I bought a 1994 Suzuki Carry for less than $6000. These are essentially the same size as a large UTV. Advantages of these are: inexpensive compared to UTV; greater hauling capacity, both in terms of space and weight; if 25 years or older, can be licensed for the street. Cons are: not as much articulation as a UTV; very limited interior room.
So far it's worked out great for our operation. We tap trees on commercial property owned by a university and managed by a commercial real estate firm. The area I have to drive on to collect sap is mostly grass, but there are areas that are deeply shaded and not much grass so those areas get really wet and muddy during sap season. Because I'm just a "guest" on the property I want to tread as lightly as possible. The Carry does a pretty good job of treading lightly, better than my Kubota and trailer did.
Attachment 22072
Those Suzuki carrys are cool I was just looking into them an NY is cracking down on their road legal status.
The other option for spreading weight and gaining traction is a set of tracks for a utv/atv.
I have a Kubota RTV 900 and I reversed the n
back wheels so tire chains would clear the springs and it works great
Returning to this thread months later to share I finally settled on buying a UTV, at least as my first vehicular upgrade for the new sugar bush. I agonized over the choice of make and the current inventory shortages did not help me but I landed on buying a Honda Pioneer with the convertible dump-bed / rear seats. The main factors for me ended up being that I have some sharp "break-over" angles (as we used to say in 4-wheeling days) on our trails and the Honda has the shortest wheel base while also offering room for kids in the back. It is also an automotive transmission instead of a CVT, which has numerous advantages it would seem but the main ones I'm interested in are superior engine braking and less wear on the system when operating at lower speed / gear.
The Honda also had a cost for entry that I could budget for at this phase of life (2 kids, partially employed spouse).
Sounds like I should take receipt of the vehicle in a couple of weeks, after they've mounted up a winch, plow, roof and a few other accessories. I'll post some pics when that time comes...I appreciate all the input I got from folks. I think there may be an older, utility snowmobile in my future and eventually a tractor, I that order.
We use a Honda Pioneer, absolutely love it. But my favorite still is the ‘85 Big Red I can sneak through a lot of places with that. Then when there’s too much snow I bought a cheap $400 snowmobile. Which works great just had to put a good track on it.
I have a kioti tractor 40hp, The machine is awesome no complaints, but I am limited to the time in my bush if I don't want to rut it up badly. I've noticed once you rut up a trail or section of the bush the water just lies in it during the wet seasons. I think it weighs around 4400lbs. But having a bucket on the front and skidding logs out of the bush to my cut area when its dry or froze up is pretty handy. 2wd tractor I would be inclined to get some chains.
As our maple season starts again here, I realized I never shared pictures of my Honda chariot...here she is doing various chores around the house in prep for maple season, namely firewood and testing the farm cart that will haul my new 200 gallon SS tank:Quote:
Originally Posted by ADK_XJ
Enjoy your new purchase! The pics didn't show up in your last post and I am not able to upload photos into any of my posts, not sure what the issue is.
I have Kioti CK2610 on order and hopefully taking delivery at the end of March or early April. Front end loader, 60" rotary cutter (brush hog) and will be getting a grapple as well. Didn't really get for sugaring purposes but will definitely be used for the wood part of the syrup process. I have a Kubota BX2200 as well that we use to tow the collection tank and also for snow blowing the road around the property for collecting.
Looking forward to the Kioti and being able to hold logs up with the grapple when cutting them to length!
I noticed that and couldn't seem to fix the issue re: photos...I'll try to do it once more here but we'll see.Quote:
Originally Posted by MRFNY
Would like to hear about your Kioti once you receive it, as I detailed below (above?) I have been in a debate for several years of what piece of machinery to buy first and Kioti was high on the list of options if i went tractor. Everyone I've spoken to raved about the way that CK line packs the weight and performance of a larger tractor into a compact frame.
It's possible there will be a tractor in our future someday and, if I were buying one new, I'd look closely at a Kioti for sure.
Seems to be a known issue with posting pictures that they are working to correct.Quote:
Originally Posted by ADK_XJ
I'll definitely let you know about the Kioti when I get it, I'm anxious and excited to get it! I heard the same things you did about the CK line, seems like you get a lot more bang for your buck over the other orange colored tractors.
I looked at Kiot before I bought my Massey Ferguson and I talked to an owner and they seem to be a good solid tractor. I couldn't get one for at least a couple months and I was wanting to trade my old Ford in and their offer was offensive. The Massey dealer had tractors on the lot and tripled the trade allowance. Like I have said before, I have owned the Massey for 3 years and I am very happy with it.