SAPerator Pan Build

[sweetwoodmaple]

Well, thanks to Sugarmaker, I'm off to build another revision of the steam/preheat pan. I have the parts and pieces fabricated and I'm in the process of learning TIG to put everthing together.

My pan is a low profile that nests under my existing steam hood (it is phantom in the renderings). It also has an outer tray that collects all the condensate, including what comes off the existing steam hood.

I potentially need a float box, but this system is only going to be a supplemental to my main float and feed into the evaporator.

I will post pics as I proceed.

See the end of Sugarmakers WRU for some of the other description of my system. I am going to use a SPA pump to bubble the sap.

[Sugarmaker]

Brian,
I am not taking any credit:) All you young man! Yea I am a instigator of these type of things. I like the thumbnails of your design, nice job getting them posted. Let us know how you do on the fab work and the TIG welding.
Regards,
Chris

[Dennis H.]

Very nice design. Very compact. I like the fact that it doesn't add much height evap.

Are they drip catchers under the tubes? They look like flat plate that hang down at an angle with a like bend at the very bottom.

Remember Pics, we love lots of pics!

[sweetwoodmaple]

The tubes have a 1/2" drop towards the back drip tray. The bottom fins catch condensate from the bottom of the pan and send it back through to the tray as well.

[Sugarmaker]

Brian.
Ok if those fins work to remove condensate, I will take just a little credit for brainstorming that with you:) Yes if this SAPerator works under the hood it saves a lot of head room in a short sugar house. I added 22 inches to the evaporator pan height with the WRU.
Regards,
Chris

[sweetwoodmaple]

Got the formed parts this week.. Thanks to my Dad for an early Christmas present!

Everything is 18 gage stainless. The tubes are .070, but hopefully it still works ok.

Also got the TIG setup yesterday. Still need the electrical plug wired and the clamps on the Argon hose.

[Sugarmaker]

Brian,
Looking real good!
Chris

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

Brian,

I would think with such short sides you are going to get a lot of sap splashing in places it isn't supposed to and may lose quit a bit of sap.

[sweetwoodmaple]

Yes, I am concerned about that, though the pan isn't actually boiling, just filled with air.

If needed, I can bend some splash guards that I can weld on the inside.

Looking at Leader's version, it does not appear they have a lot of distance above the tubes...perhaps 6". I will only have 4".

Also, looks are a little deceiving as my tubes are 2.75" in diameter. I only have the sap planned to submerge about 1/3 of the tubes, letting the splashing action do the rest.

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

Brian,

I haven't used one or seen one in action and others on here have but from what I was told there is a lot of splashing that takes place inside of it. Hopefully others that have one can chime in.

[Sugarmaker]

On test run I get about 3-4 inches of vertical bubbling sap action. Not really sure if this is good or bad since I also have not seen comercial ones working.
Brian,
Sounds like you have a backup plan in place to compensate if needed.
Hows the welding coming along? There are some good threads on TIG welding on the trader.
Regards,
Chris

[sweetwoodmaple]

Tig welding is ok. Found out that auto darkening helmets aren't always the best for low amp welding. The first day I got some bright spots and couldn't consistently see the weld pool.

I dusted off the old helmet and it worked good. I did a corner fusion weld of 18 gage material. Not too bad, but alignment is critical. Any gaps and the material wicks away and does not fuse.

I ordered a few more accessories for the welder this week, including some 1 mm diameter filler material for welding the tubes.

About a months more practice and I might be ready. ;))

[WMF]

Most higher end helmets (like Miller) have adjustable sensitivity and will darken reliably at low amps. They are well worth the cost.

[Bucket Head]

Also in regards to auto-darkening helmets, some have two arc sensors and some have four. You want one with four sensors for TIG welding. Together, they pickup the low amperage TIG arc better than the two, so the lens changes when it's supposed to.

Steve

[sweetwoodmaple]

Yes, exactly.

Most of the folks I saw doing low amperage had Hornell helmets. Those cost half as much as my welder.

My other problem is that my flourescent lighting goes bonkers due to the interference. That flickering doesn't help the situation.

I'll just put a halogen work light in the area so I can see dimly in the old style helmet and leave it go at that for all the long distance welds. For tacking and positioning, the other helmet works fine.

[Sugarmaker]

Brian,
You still under the hood staring at the glow of the TIG welder. Need pictures! Need updates! Need sap!

Chris

[sweetwoodmaple]

Well, spent two weeks learning TIG, then started on the pan about a week ago.

The first fitting I welded in took 4 hours. Welding a heavy section like a fitting to thin metal is tricky as is let alone that I tried to do it edge to edge with no overlap. I had a section run away from me and I had to blob on the weld and grind. I almost had an aneurysm in the process.

I learned that gaps are very bad and should be avoided at all costs if you are using only fusion and no filler metal.

About 12 hours into the process, I have about half of the main pan done. 4 tubes completely welded in place, the partition stitched in and two of the four corners fused together.

As you can see from the photos, the tubing must have had some carbon on the surface as it is now rusting. I will have to get some acid and passivate the whole thing before it's all said and done.

[Haynes Forest Products]

SWM nice looking pan I like the idea. Put some super bubble gasline leak tester on the welds and blow air on the inside to look for leaks. It beats filling with water.

[lastwoodsman]

Impressive! That is an art form---
Woodsman

[Sugarmaker]

Brian,
Very Nice! Plan to bring this to the NWPA maple meeting! The welds look very good! And it looks like your design too:)
Chris

[Big_Eddy]

Someone help me out. How does this work? I'm not familiar with the steamaway. Where is the sap, and what does the spa bubbler do?

I like the design and the fabrication looks top notch. I want to make one too, but I wouldn't know what to do with it when it was done :D

[Sugarmaker]

Big E,
Concept is that bubbling sap (air agitated) splashing over hot steam filled tubes will allow additional water to be released in the form of steam. Therfore taking 2% sap to 3 or 4% sap before it enters the boiling rear pan of the evaporator. This will allow you to make more syrup faster and uses the steam that would have gone up the stack to remove more water from the sap. So no additional energy required except to run the air blower for the bubbler. Several posts on here that point back to some patents on these units. Brian has a unique under the hood design that is very interesting.
We will be watching!
Regards,
Chris

[Big_Eddy]

So basically this is an alternate form of preheater. Instead of having sap flow through a serpentine set of sealed tubes under the hood, the sap sits in a shallow pan through which there are steam filled tubes. The air blower increases heat transfer by keeping the sap in the pan moving, and a float system keeps the pan full while preventing overflowing.

End result is that you preheat the sap to the same temperature as you would with a standard preheater, but with the Saperator being open to the atmosphere, some percentage of the water in the sap is able to evaporate thereby increasing concentration.

Advantages

increased concentration
no risk of vapour lock.

Disadvantages

need for an additional float system
reduced reserve volume available to flood the pans if needed. (Plumb in a bypass)

I suppose the same thing could be accomplished by flowing sap through an open-to-air serpentine channel system above the sap pan - again requiring a float system to keep the preheat channels full.

Thanks - think I get it now.

[Sugarmaker]

Big_eddy,
Yes you got the idea and next you will be building one of these too:)
Don't let the float thing hold you back. think of them as your friend, helping watch the sap level.
For flooding the pans it should work as well through a steam away as through any float box on your boiling pan. I have the same size sap line entering and leaving the steam away as I had without. Just less head pressure. The steam away holds about 20 gallons of sap.
By pass options are never a bad idea. I keep the OMG bucket of sap close at hand while boiling too.
Chris

[Thad Blaisdell]

I can tell you that with my steamaway. Older model. I put in 8.5% and get out 12%.

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

Average gain of evaporation of 60 to 75 percent, so way better than a preheater which is probably about 10%.

[sweetwoodmaple]

Well, at about 24 hours of welding (about 15 linear feet of tig weld), have the water portion of the pan done, including all the fittings and 8 tubes welded into place. I still have to do the leak check.

Next is the water channels and outer frame. I still have the copper bubbler tubes to drill and solder.

Finally, I need to get a float box made up.

Optimistially, I'm almost 1/2 way done! ;)

Don't think I'll be close to making the maple meeting with this one, Chris. Plus, don't want to show it off until it actually works!

If I get 40% gain on this one, I'll be happy. The 15 gage thick stainless tubes won't help in that regard, but oh well.

[Sugarmaker]

Brian,
Your progress sounds a little better than me last year . It took me the rest of the summer to get it ready.
Sounds like the Saperator is coming along nicely.
I would agree that if I see 40-50% gain I will be happy.
Chris

[sweetwoodmaple]

Chris - Looking back through your WRU posts...(a big mistake), I noticed talk about using hot condensate to preheat. I looked up the Dr. Tim post and also noticed the post from WVM about not using the steam from the steamaway as it is cold from the introduction of outside air.

So....I was either going to run about 15' of copper pipe through the hot water in the outside channels. Or pay $60 bucks on Ebay for a plate heat exchanger and try to use gravity flow to preheat incoming sap.

Will this ever end??

[Sugarmaker]

Brian,
Your in BIG trouble:)
Chris

[sweetwoodmaple]

It's worse than that....If you look at your parallel flow preheater...I'm going to nest one of those throught the center of my 2-3/4" diameter tubes. That way, since the tubes are so big, the steam will be heating the stainless of the saperator AND the preheating tubes at the same time.

Therefore, no worries about using the steam above the bubbling sap and it being colder.

Similar concept in the newer gas/oil heaters. The inlet air is warmed by the outlet exhaust, but it's a tube inside a tube so you only have one hole to cut in the side of the house.

I'll post a CAD rendering when I get the chance.

[Sugarmaker]

Brian,
Sounds like a good concept! Hope you can pack all that into the unit!
Chris

[sweetwoodmaple]

A few progress photos.

It has been a struggle to say the least. Me and thin metal fillet welds do not get along. Also, the whole unit has about 1/4" to 3/8" of twist. My design with the tubes is so rigid that it does not comply when sitting on a flat surface.

I have most of the guts of the float box, but still need the sheet metal. I will be using 1" copper to feed everything.

I am going to make this in parallel with my current float box, with a bypass/shutoff valve in case I want to just run straight off the tank with no Saperator. Chris - I think that is how you arranged yours as well?

[Sugarmaker]

Brian,
Real nice pictures of the UNIT! Coming along nice whats the % completion? Are you going to make it?
Hope you can get that pulled down to the pan. Bending and Welding does strange things to warp stuff.
I have a deep float box feeding the WRU and it then feeds the lower float box on the rear pan. Very similar to a steam away. I do not have a bypass to go direct to the rear pan float box. I do have a by pass for the preheater above the WRU, so I can either feed through it or not.
Chris

[sweetwoodmaple]

A couple more progress shots (bottom side view). I got the fins welded on the bottom of the pan. I am now working on welding the back of the fins where they come through to the drain tray.

I'm giving myself a 50/50 shot of having this done in a month. Perhaps a late season addition might be the best option.

[sweetwoodmaple]

Here are a few CAD images of my idea for the nested parallel flow preheater. First image is looking from the back of the pan. The underside view is where the steam enters the tubes, and the outlet of the prehater over into the float box (not hooked up in the image).

The inlet and outlet are 1" copper, reducing down to 3/4" copper for the 8 parallel tubes.

The condensate that drips from the prehater will run down the bottom of the steam tubes, along with the condensate from the tubes themselves.

Not sure about efficiency. Perhaps my steam temperature will be reduced too much by having it contact both the pan tubes and copper preheater.

[Sugarmaker]

Brian,
Nice seeing you at the NWPA maple meeting,
You have a nice family.
The design looks OK to me. good use of your area and the steam.
Welding seams look real good.
Chris

[Sugarmaker]

Brian,
Get out from under that hood and give us a status update.
Is this unit going to be in place and ready for this season?
Just about time to tap!
Regards,
Chris