Coffee Urn or Stock Pot + valve?

[maple marc]

I am debating whether to bottle with a coffee urn or a 5 gallon stock pot with a ball valve installed. Need to purchase either. I have read all the threads regarding coffe urns, and my concern is maintaining a proper temperature without overheating. Seems like urn heating elements can create problems. I make only 30 gallons of syrup, bottling 2 to four gallons at a time, but much goes into glass, so it's critical I do not create more niter at bottling time. I filter a second time just before bottling. I know some of you guys use the stock pot with valve. This way I could raise the temperature to 185 on the stove, then start bottling, keeping an eye on the thermometer.

Thanks for ideas,
Marc

[Gary R]

I was looking at using an urn. They aren't that easy to find the right one and they do cost a bit. I used a cheap stock pot. I welded a SS nipple on as low as I could. I also bought a single electric burner. This allows me to have the pot right at the edge of the counter to fill bottles. I clip my thermometer on the side of the pot and adjust the burner to maintain temp if needed. I think it might be a little more reliable and easy to clean.

[KenWP]

I use the stock pot with a valve I installed on the side of it also. It sure beats trying to pour syrup into a bottle with a funnel. I get it to the right temp and then turn the element down to low to maintain temp and bottle. Only takes a few minutes to bottle a couple gallons and your done.

[wnybassman]

What kind of valves are you putting on stock pots? Weld on or some kind of non-welded type?

[KenWP]

I use something Haynes came out with. Take a 1/2 nipple and put a ball valve on one end and useing a washer on the outside and a rubber gasket drill a hole in the pot just big enough to fit the nipple in. For a nut on the inside cut the end off of a half inch coupling and tighten it on. Have done two now and haven't had any leaks. Make sure you have the ball valve the right direction so it opens away from the pot. Then I put a piece of copper pipe with a bend on the outside of the valve for filling jugs.
There is boughten gizmos that do the same thing for around $20 that somebody will post here in a while. But this other way can be bought local. Some wine makeing stores do have the gizmo also at a price. All depends how handy you are. I allwasy could invent things so it works great for me.

[Peepers]

Thanks for sharing your experience guys, this is great info!

I was also thinking of getting a coffee urn this year to hang a cone filter in and bottle but I like this stockpot idea better for several reasons:
- A lot of the cheap 42 cup urns are aluminum whereas I'd like to stick with stainless
- The heat on most urns appears to be heavily concentrated in the very center to perk coffee fast
- I'd rather have a metal ball valve vs a cheap plastic coffee urn valve.

My only question is what is the best/easiest way to rig up a cone filter in a stockpot like this? I guess I could cut a hole in the lid for the filter and put 4 bolts or hooks in the lid to hang the cone filter loops over.

I might be kidding myself but I don't see me making more than 10 gallons a year for the foreseeable future so I'm trying to keep the equipment/complexity/cost in check.

Thanks!

[Haynes Forest Products]

If you use a coffee urn fill it with hot filterd syrup and then the element wont burn/boil/over heat. It will maintain a nice controled temp.

[Gary R]

Here's a picture of what I did. Soft and hard copper. Other guy's have made something that sits on the lip of the pot. They look cleaner than mine. The one thing to be careful about is 2 gal. of hot syrup is heavy and dangerous. You do not want it tipping over.

[Haynes Forest Products]

That does look like a quick way to look like Gorbachev. I have an old one that was tall and tippy and when your sitting down bottling I was leary of my design. Why so high out of the pot? If your adding as you go and drawing off at the same time Lower will work.

[Gary R]

Haynes, that base is wide and sturdy. I don't plan on looking like an old Russian with a skin disorder any time soon. It could be a few inches lower. I am only filtering 2-3 gal. at a time. I dump it all in at once. I didn't want the filter sitting in the filtered syrup. Canning is done in a few minutes.

I'm thinking of making a water jacketed filter / canner. Using flat filters. Sounds like a fun thing to do.

[lpakiz]

Peepers, If you don't want to ruin the cover off the coffee pot, go to the local Goodwill store and look for a lid. SS can be found easily. You may have to buy the pot to get the lid. Probably less then $2

[Peepers]

I'm still undecided - urn or stock pot... I have to pick one tho because the funnel method bites and I'm not ready to spring for a fancy Leader or Bascom filter box.

Gary - do you have a third leg on the back of that filter support or do you find 2 legs adequate? I like the suspension idea so that I can see how much syrup has filtered through and can get a thermometer in there easy.

[maple marc]

Thanks, guys. I'm going to go with the stock pot, weldless fitting and ball valve. I've got the pot--hardware will cost $22. I like the idea of bringing the temperature of the finished syrup--after final filtering--back to 185 on the stove. Then I will move the pot to the counter, perhaps on a STABLE insulated stand where I can easily operate the ball valve and fill the bottles. I'll watch the digital thermometer to ensure it doesn't drop below 180.

Now if I can just find a step bit to drill that pot.........

Marc

[Haynes Forest Products]

one other nice thing about a good coffee maker is the valve that is a no drip and it springs back to closed position after you let go. And there food grade.

[Gary R]

Peepers,

There is only 2 legs. The base is at least twice the diameter of the pot. I've had the filter full of syrup with no problems. Remember to use multiple paper pre filters. If the top one get clogged, you need to lift it and dump it into the next pre filter.

[BryanEx]

This is my version for cone filters... cost all of 1 beer to make because the 1 x 2 was left over from a previous project. I will admit it was my second try because I made the legs the height of the filter on my first try so the filter touched the bottom of the pot. Oh what I wouldn't give for a wood stretcher once I realized my boo-boo.

[Haynes Forest Products]

You mean you cut it off twice and its still to short:o Im wondering if that composite material is F_ _ _ G_ _ _ _:lol: You could screw a toilet seat to that and use it camping so it could be used all year:evil:

[KenWP]

I made a round filter holder that fits on legs on the side of the pot. Extremely tippable and if you don't use proper clamps the filter comes off when you pour syrup in it and it takes hours to clean up. I have no idea why it takes hours to clean up but somebody I know used my gizmo and had that happen. His she who has to be obeyed called him a few choice words also even thou she was the person who stole the proper clamps for her stupid rose bushes or something and he used cheap clothes pins.
I have this year designed and made a beer keg filter instead that will also keep the filter warm so it dosn't gell like the other gizmo does.

[Riley/MN]

for someone that is looking for a pot, check this one out...

200 QUART HEAVY DUTY STOCK POT WITH SPIGOT (http://cgi.ebay.com/200-QUART-HEAVY-DUTY-STOCK-POT-WITH-SPIGOT_W0QQitemZ140385900462QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_ DefaultDomain_0?hash=item20afa6d7ae)

[BryanEx]

My wife says you could boil people in a pot that size. :lol: If it had a lid it would make for great sap storage for a small producer such as myself. Hmmmm...

[danno]

I made a finisher similar to the maple dealers, but probably costs less than an urn or coffee pot. Got a rectangular buffet pan from the local resteraunt supply. Went to their scatch and dent section and bought 24x18" pan/lid for $15. Drilled in a valve. Added 4 SS steel bolts that support SS mesh that supports the flat filters.

I used to use the urn - the big flat filters filter quicker. I can filter about 3 gallons at a time in the finisher.

[SeanD]

Danno, that is a seriously good idea. I made one of those as a drip-type preheater and it NEVER occurred to me to use it as a bottler. Awesome.

Do you have 6" bolts that stand on the bottom or are they on the top lip of the pan? I'd love a pic if you have one.

Thanks!
Sean

[danno]

Hi Sean -

Just 3/4" bolts through the side of the pan about 2" lower than the top of the pan.

I also have a big 4 cone filter (thank you Parker). Syrup goes through the 4 cone filter as it comes off the evaporator and through the flat pan filter before I bottle. I like clear syrup:).

Cause the syrup has already been filtered once, it goes through the flat filter fast.

[SeanD]

Danno,

Sorry not to respond right away. I forgot about this thread. Thanks for the bolt info. That's such a great idea.

I'm looking ahead to using mine as a bottler and it occurred to me I might have trouble controlling the fill rate esp. with half pints. Did you use a ball valve or did you find something better?

My old urn couldn't hold the temp at 180, but one thing I really liked about it was that I could hold the container in one hand and press the fill lever with the other and just let go to get it to stop.

Sean

[Haynes Forest Products]

Looking for a cheap bottler with area for cone filter check out Item no. 280483343559 Ebay 2 gallon with site glass:)

[valleyman]

Danno,
I agree with SeanD. Your filter pan idea sounds perfect for me. Thanks!

I just told my wife that "I'm all set. I built everything last year and I'll be around more to help out this year" Uh oh, sounds like I've got my 1st improvement project for the off season.

I'm sure she'll understand:rolleyes:

[Gravel]

Danno,

A pic would be great if you could do that, sounds like a great way to build a canner!

[SeanD]

Okay, here's the preheater/bottler in action. Thanks again, Danno for the idea. I'm so psyched for this set up because I thought I was going to mess with an urn again. Instead, I just added some half-inch copper to get past the edge of the counter and threaded a hose bib on.

This set up holds about 4 gallons, lets me control the temperature perfectly, and only cost about $8 in materials. I think if I find a little shelf at a yard sale to put underneath the spigot, I could have a real bottling station that I could sit at comfortably.

Thanks again!
Sean

[Gravel]

Looking for a cheap bottler with area for cone filter check out Item no. 280483343559 Ebay 2 gallon with site glass:)

Thank you Haynes, I purchased this for $19.99, I think it will work great!

[Haynes Forest Products]

Gravel good job! I think you will be happy. I have a friend that bottles 300 gallons with a smaller version and he has a press but likes his elec coffee pot. He moved up to the bigger one like yours this year. Put it up on a wider base so bottles fit under it and a cookie sheet to catch your missteps and your good to go. I used to hang my first bottler over the edge of the table but it gets dangerous with the legs on the edge.

[Gravel]

Just wish I would have got it in time to use this year, but I guess it will be one less thing to scrub!!

[wnybassman]

Just wish I would have got it in time to use this year, but I guess it will be one less thing to scrub!!

LOL I had it on my watch list but forgot about it. Glad someone here got it though. I am still thinking a SS stock pot with a spigot might be better for my needs anyway. I already have visions of a bracket that sits on the stove and holds the pot at an angle so it all drains out better too. ;)

[Haynes Forest Products]

Two commercial water jacketed coffee makers going cheap on ebay 140370242597 and 110513853811

[KenWP]

Haynes are you not supposed to be running a vacuum system someplace or playing with red balls instead of on Ebay all night.

[TF Maple]

Stop complaining when Haynes is helping us out. LOL. I didn't think about searching for this stuff.

[Haynes Forest Products]

Dang Google Earth they caught me playing with my little red balls again. I wont be happy till every sugar maker has a cool bottler like mine.

[Haynes Forest Products]

I just snaged a nice water jacketed Curtis RU 300 coffee maker for my NEW bottler. Buyit now for $299.00 plus shipping:) I sold my Holly Grail to FFA for their 4th July dairy breakfast for 5 times what I paid for it.

There are a few nice units on there right now. A nice Gas unit that would work great for the remote sap shacks:) :)

[bearair]

Check out the SAF-T-COOKER® at Menards. It's a turkey fryer but with a spigot on it. I bought one and am looking forward to trying it out this year.

http://www.menards.com/main/outdoor/outdoor-living/grills-smokers/saf-t-cooker/p-1484889.htm?cid=1307

[maple connection]

Can you buy just the spigot like on a coffee pot? I have a turkey cooker wondering if I could drill a hole and add a spigot. Thanks.

[SeanD]

I just came across them in the Grainger catalog when I was looking for something else. I was thinking of swapping mine out for this because it's the one thing I really liked about using the coffee urn.

http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/IGLOO-REPLACMENT-SPIGOT-9J047?Pid=search

I don't know how it's fitted, but I'm guessing it has threads on the back that work with brass or copper fittings.

Sean

[SeanD]

Here's a picture of a different one from the back side I pulled off of Google. They are probably universally fitted. There are more options if you Google "replacement spigot".

Sean

[Haynes Forest Products]

Some of the threads are a stright so they dont fit NPT type

[maple connection]

Thanks, I am checking out grainger. They are only a few miles away.

[Haynes Forest Products]

Check with Jim Shumacker he uses them on his bottlers

[sugarstone]

I just snaged a nice water jacketed Curtis RU 300 coffee maker for my NEW bottler. Buyit now for $299.00 plus shipping:) I sold my Holly Grail to FFA for their 4th July dairy breakfast for 5 times what I paid for it.

There are a few nice units on there right now. A nice Gas unit that would work great for the remote sap shacks:) :)

you mean 2099.00?

Did a google and I'am seeing one pushing $3000..for a Curtis RU 300

[Haynes Forest Products]

Its all about patiance patiance patiance I found a big Grindmaster for $100.00 at a junk yard was like new. I also passed on a few over the last year that were nice. I did pay $299.00 for the RU300 Heck it was a BuyItNow:)

[Haynes Forest Products]

I just checked on Ebay and there is a nice unit that is a buyitnow Heck it even has 4 pour valves so you van be bottling 4 at once with hot water to wash..........GET ER DONE That unit has been on there for 3 months. Look under commercial coffee makers