Sterlite Plastic Totes

[heus]

I was reading some old posts and saw that some of you (Sugarmaker for example) were planning on using this brand instead of the rubbermaid. In my area the sterlites are much cheaper and more readily available than the rubbermaid roughneck totes. I am looking at the 31 or 37 gallon ones. How have the sterlites held up over the past few seasons compared to rubbermaids?

[KenWP]

Don't boot one when its cold. They are really durable if looked after. I am amazed what you can do with them over the years.

[Woody]

Yup - I was thinking about using these too. What was the final thought on whether the plastic in these and the rubbermade totes is food grade or if it even needs to be. Maybe today I'll call the company and see what they tell me.

thanks

[heus]

sugarmaker any comments?

[heus]

Well my wife surprised me today and bought 6 rubbermaid roughneck totes. She was angry that she paid $17 each for them. When I went out to get them they were 50 gallontotes with lids not 31. I guess this is just a bonus. Still need to get a few more. I now have 6 50 gal totes and 8 18 gallon ones.

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

Rubbermaids are more flexible and more durable than the others.

[Sugarmaker]

Heus,
I have some tubing on the other side of Albion. If your over that way check Knapp road south of 6N.

Chris

[heus]

Thank Chris.
When do you think you will start tapping?

[Woody]

For whatever it's worth I just got this answer from Sterlite . Rubbermade told me their tote products are not tested for food. Who knows, probably doesn't matter anyway. I'm using both.

Thank you for contacting Sterilite. Our products are made of polypropylene plastic, which is a food safe material. The polypropylene used in our containers meets FDA requirements in the Code of Federal Regulations for all food contact excluding actual cooking applications. No Latex, BPAs (bisphenol A), PVCs, Teflon, or other stain resistant chemicals are used in our manufacturing process. Sterilite does not use any harmful materials in the production of our products

[heus]

Thanks Woody great to know that info.

[Sugarmaker]

Wow thats interesting. Hummmmmmmm Never thought of asking:)
WOODY thanks for the report.

Heus,
tapping: Looks like JUNE right now:)

Hopefully by FEB 27-28. We need to make some syrup for open house Taste and tour March 13 and 14.

Chris

[DrTimPerkins]

Rubbermade told me their tote products are not tested for food. Who knows, probably doesn't matter anyway. I'm using both.

Try this and then make your decision on which to use.

1. Get two brand-new containers, one Sterile (food-grade) and one Rubbermaid (not food-grade).

2. Wash out both containers with plenty of good hot water. Use detergent or chlorox if you like, but rinse them very thoroughly afterward.

3. Put a gallon of sap in the bottom of each type (Sterlite and Rubbermaid) and let it sit for a couple of hours with the lid on.

4. Open the lid, stick your head in, and take a big sniff of the air inside the container.

5. If after the sniff test you are still considering using the Rubbermaid (non-food grade) container, taste a little of the sap and see what you think. Look at it first (the sap may have a slight green or brown tinge to it...depending upon the color of the container).

6. Ask yourself....would I let my kids drink this?

7. When/if the inspector comes around, which would you rather tell him/her?
A. I'm using food-grade containers to collect my sap
B. I got a real good price on those non food-grade containers.

My advice...spend the money and get the food-grade or water-potable containers. Trash belongs in those Rubbermaid containers....NOT sap.

[Woody]

Good point. Thanks for the input.

[Woody]

Some may find this useful: http://www.virtualweberbullet.com/plastics.html#avoid

[red maples]

excellent link everyone with a question to use or not to use should read this link!!!

[heus]

What exactly is "brining?"

[heus]

Maybe I'll just go buy some old lead-laced galvanized sap buckets instead.

[KenWP]

Brining as in makeing pickles or ham or bacon or pastrami. Stuff like that. You use a strong salt solution to dry things out.

[DrTimPerkins]

Maybe I'll just go buy some old lead-laced galvanized sap buckets instead.

You say that jokingly (I assume), but in actuality you might be better off. There is no way to know what is in the regrind material they make non-food grade containers with....but it is almost certain that it was something you don't want in sap. At least with lead there is a way to manage the usage to avoid a problem (collect buckets frequently, don't use a lot of other lead-containing materials to process sap). With non-food grade containers, you just don't know what the problem might be.

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

This has been a very informative topic and good to know about the Sterlite containers. I have used rubbermaid containers for a few years and no, they do not impart any off flavor to the sap or off color. I have left sap in them for days and the sap quality has been the same as a stainless or galvanized tank.

[Woody]

This is the second question I asked the company, answer in blue. I know that plastics can breakdown quickly fron UV light and I was curious about any chemical byproducts that might be generated from that. Any chemical engineers out there??

Thanks for your prompt reply. From your response I've learned that all your containers including the larger totes meet FDA requirements for food contact excluding actual cooking applications. My other question that I hope you can answer is if there would be an issue with chemical byproducts generated by the plastic when exposed to ultra violet light from the sun or if there are UV inhibitors added in the manufacturing process that retard degradation. The tote containers will be located outside when in use.

Hi woody,

Our products are designed for household use and are not UVA treated or recommended for outdoor use.

Regards,

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

My response to this would be that these containers should only be outside for aproximately 6 weeks @ year. During this 6 weeks, the sun is not that powerful, so I wouldn't be concerned about breakdown of containers. The way these are designed, buy the same size and stack them inside each other and the lids stack on top of the stack and on top of each other.

Another thing to prevent breakdown is that the container should be positioned in the coolest or most shaded area possible to keep the sap as cool as possible. I go as far as sometimes shading my tanks with a tap to keep the direct sunlight off of my steel tanks so keep the sap cooler.

[3rdgen.maple]

There is a Dr. on here that once said if it is not made for sap it should not be used for sap. I agree 100% and I think this is not stressed enough. I think we should not be taking shortcuts to produce a product because of money constraints. Strong words I know but think about it. If you found out your local food store was taking shortcuts to cut cost and some of the items they put your food in was not safe or was not certain wether it was or not would you still buy food there for the same price when you can go down the road and get food from another store that was using all food safe materials. Skipping corners is what will get us more attention and result in stronger regulations. One thing I did notice on that attachment Woody posted and something that has been said on here many times is that HDPE# 2 plastic is food safe. If you notice it says that not all HDPE#2 plastic is not food safe. When a company relies to a question by saying, Our products are designed for household use and are not UVA treated or recommended for outdoor use is pretty straight forward. Why take the chance of putting toxins in our bodies, our customers and worse yet our kids. Someone please take that link Woody gave us and post it as a sticky for future reference for alll of us. http://www.virtualweberbullet.com/plastics.html#avoid
Woody thank you for your research on this topic.

[heus]

Ok I understand to a degree. But what about water pumps that are not specifically for sap? Are we not to use those as well? What about new galvanized stock tanks? Do I have to spend $450 to buy a Tanaka pump from the maple catalogs instead of the $245 model from TSC? Brandon, Chris, and others have all said that their sap is not colored or off-flavored. Dr. Tim are you sure the contamination and coloring that you speak of are from the rubbermaid roughneck and sterilite varieties? I mean, if several experienced sugarmakers swear that they get excellent quality sap from using these totes, am I not to believe them? Have there ever been any scientific tests done to confirm this contamination? I'm just a little frustrated because this is my first season, thought I was ready to roll with my tubing setups, and now this.

[DrTimPerkins]

Ok I understand to a degree. But what about water pumps that are not specifically for sap? Are we not to use those as well? What about new galvanized stock tanks? Do I have to spend $450 to buy a Tanaka pump from the maple catalogs instead of the $245 model from TSC? Brandon, Chris, and others have all said that their sap is not colored or off-flavored. Dr. Tim are you sure the contamination and coloring that you speak of are from the rubbermaid roughneck and sterilite varieties? I mean, if several experienced sugarmakers swear that they get excellent quality sap from using these totes, am I not to believe them? Have there ever been any scientific tests done to confirm this contamination? I'm just a little frustrated because this is my first season, thought I was ready to roll with my tubing setups, and now this.

Pumps made for potable water are fine.

Any containers not specifically made for potable water or food-grade are not suitable.

There is no need for a scientific test. Stick you head in the thing and smell. Probably what you're smelling is phenol....not something you want in your sap.

Galvanized stock tanks are for watering animals. Galvanized has NEVER been approved for food-use, despite it being common.

With all the public concern about food safety, PBA, lead, and other things....why would you risk it.

Anyone know how the lead issue came about? It was because people stored cider in a maple canning unit and it leached the lead out of the solder. They shouldn't have used the MAPLE canning unit for apple cider (which is quite acidic)....but that didn't stop their kid from getting lead poisoning and didn't stop them from suing the maple equipment manufacturer and distributor.

Ever hear about the company that made tubing that decided to try selling to sugarmakers? Real good price on tubing. Turns out it was made with regrind....loads of phenolics...sap smelled like crap, syrup tastes like crap. Took some time to track down the people who bought that tubing and to get the stuff out of the woods and lots more time for them to get their money back (they didn't get their time or syrup back though).

Do you sell syrup? If so....do it the right way.

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

I am glad to know about the Sterlite containers as for the future, I will use them vs the Rubbermaid. I was not saying the rubbermaid containers are food grade, just staying I don't see any affect on sap taste or quality. Dr. Perkins is probably right about the rubbermaid containers and not to use them.

As far as galvanized, I am not recommending them as food grade but they are probably more food grade than all the galvanized sap buckets in use. I have 7 galvanized tanks and as far as I am concerned they are sap tanks, not stock tanks. "Stock" is a slang or generic term given to them like a lot of other things that get a generic or stereotype term. I see know problem with using them for sap.

You can probably by Stainless "stock" tanks that are not "food grade".

[KenWP]

I was just on the US plastics web site and they have some good prices on things like plastic pails and such which are good for food. They say there plastic pails will take from 180 to 190 degrees hot food products. Now if one of you guys would try and store some syrup in one and find out just how much heat they do take.
I have enough storage for this year I hope but will probbably have to search a bit more for more food grade plastic storage in the future.

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

This is really good quality suction and delivery hose. Ordered it from them a couple of times.

http://www.usplastic.com/catalog/item.aspx?itemid=23579&catid=736

[heus]

I bought a good quality suction hose, supposed to be for potable water. It smells like plastic/!!

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

Everything like that smells like plastic, especially when it is new. Don't worry about it, it won't hurt sap quality any.

[DrTimPerkins]

Everything like that smells like plastic, especially when it is new. Don't worry about it, it won't hurt sap quality any.

Difference is that with food grade stuff that smell will go away fairly quickly. With the non-food grade it lingers for the lifetime of the material as "stuff" continues to leach or vaporize out of it.

[RileySugarbush]

We have always used trash cans, both rubbermaid and others. Not the Toughneck ones, those are more flexible and seem to have more plasticizers or something in them. Like Brandon, we have never noticed any smell or taste from them in the sap, even when opening after some time. The ones we use I believe are HDPE, more plastic like then rubbery. This discussion has me thinking we should consider a change in our ways though.

How about these:

http://minneapolis.craigslist.org/wsh/grd/1565865259.html

Appropriate? That is HDPE as well.

[Toblerone]

The Rubbermaid Brute line of waste cans in gray, white, or yellow are stamped NSF#2 safe for food contact. We use two of those 32 gal trash cans and have them marked SAP ONLY to be sure they are not used for anything else. We also found some off-brand white trash cans that were also marked NSF#2. (NSF#21 is not good enough, that's for waste storage only.)

That craigslist ad is for an HDPE IBC (intermediate bulk container) tote. If they have only ever stored food products I would think it would be fine. The problem, though, is how can you be sure the person selling it knows for sure and is telling the truth. I have seen several of those for sale with agricultural supplies in them.. stuff like enzymes and other livestock chemicals/products. If they are safe for animals does that mean it's safe for humans? I don't know.

I recently bought one of these 275gal totes that a guy told me was used to store a sand and water mixture used by a dental facility to make dentures. I guess I thought, if it goes in people's mouths, it must be safe if I were to wash it out really well. I'm now having second thoughts. I can't be sure that's where he got it, nor be sure the mixture didn't have some other chemicals (surfactants, etc) in it. I don't think I'm going to use it. I guess I wasted $50.

The only way to be sure is to get a brand new IBC tote. I found a company in Cleveland (Chesser Container (http://www.chessercontainer.com/)) that sells reconditioned totes, some with cleaned bottles, and some with brand new bottles. They also sell just the replacement bottles so you can save $50 if you don't need the cage (I'm planning on just swapping out the bottle). They quoted me $145 for a brand new bottle, but I have to drive to Cleveland to get it. I figure $145 + $30 in gas is not bad for 275 gallons of absolutely food-safe storage. They also have them on ebay: 380203965901 (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=380203965901)

[PerryW]

I have used the plastic trash barrels for years (for a small percentage of my taps) and have never noticed and smell, discoloration or off-flavors; but I would probably never buy any new ones to store sap. I may have just gotten lucky. There is no telling what the newer plastic formulations would do to sap; and sap is far too valuable to risk contamination.

Ironically, the only problem I have ever had with plastic barrels, is buying some blue food-grade barrels that formerly held cherry syrup. They were (supposedly) steam cleaned, but I still detected an odor. So I filled then with a water-bleach solution and soaked them for a day and rinsed w/ hot water. When they filled with sap, the sap tasted just like cherry juice. Had to dump 100 gallons of nice first run sap.

[heus]

Is there a food safe plastic liner or plastic sheeting that I can line my totes with?

[DrTimPerkins]

Is there a food safe plastic liner or plastic sheeting that I can line my totes with?

Try US Plastics Corp. http://www.usplastic.com/catalog/item.aspx?itemid=23606&catid=455&clickid=searchresults

[heus]

Dr. Tim,
Thanks for the link. The bags however are LPDE, the same as my totes???

[DrTimPerkins]

The bags however are LPDE, the same as my totes???

With one KEY difference. They are food-grade.

[KenWP]

US plastics also make a great looking vacuum valve that does almost the same thing as the CV adapters. They cost a wee bit more thou. They have great drumm liners also but how to get them in a reasonable amount is the key guestion.

[heus]

Not to beat a dead horse, but for what its worth....
Iwas checking out my 50 gallon rubbermaid roughneck totes today and they are #2 HDPE. I know, not food grade, but I was surprised it was made out of this and not #4LDPE or #2 PP

[3rdgen.maple]

Hues if you refer back to a prior post where the was a link attached to the NSF numbers and their meaning you will notice that it say not all HDPE#2 is food grade. With that said it makes thing very confusing. I am wondering how does one know for sure if they are stamped#2 if they are or not food grade. So the horse is still alive and kicking atleast for now.

[heus]

That's why I said "I know, not food grade..."

[3rdgen.maple]

Missed that part hues sorry bout that. I am still curious though is there some kind of marking other than the #2 that determines if somthing is food grade or not?

[red maples]

@$%^$&%^ food grade I give up!!!!

[Sugarmaker]

red,
Dont give up, accept the fact and try to do all possible to get to that point in processing your syrup.
First sytep is sites like this that make us aware. Second is actions by each of us as producers to do as much as possible to provide the public with quality, safe maple product.

We are here for you:)

Chris

[Littlesap]

I got cold feet and returned my sterilite totes. Found these food grade containers at a local restaurant supply store, about twice the price of the sterilite but I don't need that many. I couldn't get their link to work so here is another one that does: http://www.broussardpaper.com/webcatalog/prodgroup.asp?line=B0279&item=RMRB

[The Dude]

Thanks to this thread, I followed the great advice provided by different people and bought a 32 gallon Brute trash can from Home Depot. It was $30. I don't care how cheap other totes can be, I wouldn't use them if they were free if it means possibly feeding carcinogenic chemicals to my two year old daughter and my wife.

That brings me to a question for you guys. Dr. Tim, I'd be particularly inclined to follow your advice, as I see you do not compromise when it comes to plastic health risks. I bought 5 gallon buckets from Home Depot for sap transport from my milk jugs in the trees to my Brute can. My thinking was that a half hour of cold sap in them would be okay. I had also read a post on here with that mentality. The orange buckets are HDPE #2, with no mention of food. Should I stay away from these even for transport purposes? Thanks!

[BryanEx]

Dude... there is likely a manufacturer listed on the bottom of the bucket. Canadian Home Depot buckets are made by CIL who conveniently has a web site... about their buckets. Canadian HD buckets are food safe. Not sure who makes them State side but easy enough to check out.

[The Dude]

Bryan,

Thanks for the advice. It turns out that my USA Home Depot buckets are NOT food grade.

I contacted LEAKTITE, the manufacturer of the Home Depot 5 gallon buckets I got here in central PA. The buckets are listed as HDPE #2, which is sometimes food grade, sometimes not. The person from manufacturing replied to my email: "Sorry, Leaktite pails NOT FDA approve"

If anyone can offer any input on my question two posts above, it would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

[KenWP]

There is one thing everybody forgets. The pails can be food safe and not be FDA approved. It costs big bucks to get that rateing so if you have a market with out it that is good enough for your production why waste the money. A product I used to use was able to be used for something else but wasn't on the container because it cost 8 million dollars to get those extra few words on it. If a costumer asked they could be told what it could also be used for as that was legal but it couldn't be wrote on the container with out going thru the hoops.

[The Dude]

Ken, thanks for the great tip. I did not think about that. I asked a follow up question in that regard, and here is what I got:

(In reference to my Home Depot 5 gallon buckets)

"Leaktite's position is we do not endorse the use of our products in conjunction with food."

[Frank Ivy]

For whatever it's worth I just got this answer from Sterlite . Rubbermade told me their tote products are not tested for food. Who knows, probably doesn't matter anyway. I'm using both.

Thank you for contacting Sterilite. Our products are made of polypropylene plastic, which is a food safe material. The polypropylene used in our containers meets FDA requirements in the Code of Federal Regulations for all food contact excluding actual cooking applications. No Latex, BPAs (bisphenol A), PVCs, Teflon, or other stain resistant chemicals are used in our manufacturing process. Sterilite does not use any harmful materials in the production of our products

Rubbermade gave you the smart and correct answer. Sterilite gave you a BS answer that I'm sure the legal department would scream about if they knew about it.

The products are "made of" PP, which, ITSELF, is a food-safe material.
The PP used, ITSELF, meets FDA requirements.


But, with very few exceptions, nothing is made of pure resin. Minimally, the containers have dye added. Usually, there are plasticizers, residual reactants, anti-static additives, and so on added. This would almost certainly be the case with a tote that is not marketed for use with food.

When somebody asks, "is this food safe?" and the answer that comes back is a paragraph long and doesn't use the word "yes," the clear implication is that it's not food safe. That's why Rubbermade correctly said - "not tested, so we can't comment."

So I guess we all have to make our own calls about what we collect our say in.

You want to use an orange-dyed Homer bucket? Knock yourself out. I would not. I use only food-grade materials, because, shockingly, they're specifically tested for food storage, and most of the potentially carcinogenic crap is not added to the resin.

Finally, I do hope you all are telling anybody to whom you sell or give syrup that you're collecting the sap in non-food grade plastic totes.

Ironically, I'm sure that, eventually, the FDA will force you to stop using non-food grade plastic at some point if you sell.

FWIW, I think the potential for mutagens in sap derived from tote plastic is probably small, and gets smaller the more you use them. But it's an unknown, as neither the Rubbermaid or the Sterilite are approved for food use.

Final note - think about it - it would be simple for the totes to get food grade rating - IF they were food grade. It would only be a plus to put "Food Grade) on the tote. The fact that they don't should tell you something.

Yeah yeah flame on.

[Frank Ivy]

Hues if you refer back to a prior post where the was a link attached to the NSF numbers and their meaning you will notice that it say not all HDPE#2 is food grade. With that said it makes thing very confusing. I am wondering how does one know for sure if they are stamped#2 if they are or not food grade. So the horse is still alive and kicking atleast for now.
See my previous post.

HDPE is an indication of the base polymer. It says nothing about what is added to the polymer during production of the product.

Good rule of thumb to go by:
If something is food grade, it will be marketed as food grade.
If something is not food grade, it will not.

[BryanEx]

As scary as it is... I tend to agree with Ken. :) I wouldn't store sap in them as I do but for simply transporting from tree to storage I would be okay with it. As an alternative why not look for some of the Chinese made stainless steel buckets? They can be purchased relatively inexpensively through big box like TSC or your local dollar store or farm supply. I'm assuming you only need two to carry back to your main storage tank?

[The Dude]

Bryan,

If I choose to scrap the Home Depot buckets altogether, I will take the advice I read on here about asking local bakeries and Dunkin' Donuts if they have any frosting buckets. Then if that didn't work I'd consider buying replacements.

Frank, I'm sure you were speaking against many people's comments on here in your long post above, but please keep in mind that some of us on here actually have the right intentions. This is my first time sugaring and it's for my own family and friends. Over the past month I dropped all of my other hobbies and spare time internet usage to learn all I could about how to do this the right way. As my posts in this thread indicate, I am still trying to learn.

[wnybassman]

See my previous post.

Good rule of thumb to go by:
If something is food grade, it will be marketed as food grade.
If something is not food grade, it will not.

On a bucket, what would be the indicators that says it is food grade? My wife got some buckets from her school she works at, from the cafeteria. They contained sliced strawberries according to the sticker, but nothing on the actual bucket about being food safe that I could find.

[The Dude]

Bassman, my guess is that Frank Ivy basically misinformed a bunch of people with his blanket statement about "if it's food grade, it will say it." Sometimes people assume and then present it as fact. Then it gets read as fact, and the whole situation stinks.

[Bemis]

On a bucket, what would be the indicators that says it is food grade? My wife got some buckets from her school she works at, from the cafeteria. They contained sliced strawberries according to the sticker, but nothing on the actual bucket about being food safe that I could find.

I would be looking for a triangle that says "NSF 2" . If you know it held food previously, I'd be inclined to go with it.

[Frank Ivy]

Bassman, my guess is that Frank Ivy basically misinformed a bunch of people with his blanket statement about "if it's food grade, it will say it." Sometimes people assume and then present it as fact. Then it gets read as fact, and the whole situation stinks.

Is this 3rd grade?

Your misquote of me, above, seems to be intentional.

I wrote that, if it's food grade, it will be marketed as such.

I didn't write that it will "say it," which, given plastic's well known disinclination toward speech, means that you misquoted me as explicitly indicating buckets will be marked "food grade."


To answer the previous poster - if strawberries came in it, you're golden. Snap those up. Anything that came from a manufacturer that is in plastic and the food was touching the plastic is almost certainly OK.

As for everything else, I stand by my advice, which is - if you are unsure of its origin, don't use it. If it is being purchased new and it is not being advertised as food grade (or, as Dr. Perkins suggests, suitable for potable water), then don't use it.

This is about health. I don't care what anybody does with their own health (well, until I'm forced to contribute to their health plan!), but I think it's wrong to sell or give syrup to people that has been processed in non-food grade plastic.

Like I said, I know way more about plastic and plastic processing than I ever wanted to. There is a lot of crap in plastic. Err on the side of spending a few more bucks and being CERTAIN you're clean.

To the other above poster - I wasn't attacking you or anybody else. I'm just sharing my knowledge and my opinion. Obviously, people can collect sap in old Mercury-transport buckets if they want. And sell it to strangers. If they want.

[BryanEx]

Is this 3rd grade?

Your misquote of me, above, seems to be intentional.

Just wondering Mr. Frank Ivy... do you actually sell any maple syrup to the general public or is your puritan processing only for your own consumption during world crisis?

[wnybassman]

Is this 3rd grade?

Your misquote of me, above, seems to be intentional.

I wrote that, if it's food grade, it will be marketed as such.

I didn't write that it will "say it," which, given plastic's well known disinclination toward speech, means that you misquoted me as explicitly indicating buckets will be marked "food grade."


I must apologize. I misread it as well.

From some Googling research I have done, it was said somewhere that pharmaceutical grade plastic is even better than food grade. Any truth to that?

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

As scary as it is... I tend to agree with Ken. :) I wouldn't store sap in them as I do but for simply transporting from tree to storage I would be okay with it. As an alternative why not look for some of the Chinese made stainless steel buckets? They can be purchased relatively inexpensively through big box like TSC or your local dollar store or farm supply. I'm assuming you only need two to carry back to your main storage tank?

And if the Chinese have anything to do with making the stainless, it probably has lead in it just like the kids toys.

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

OK! OK! OK!

We all need sap really bad and need to quit worrying about IS IT FOOD GRADE??? Let's be smart but this poor subject has taken a terrible beating and too much mud slinging going on. Would you serve it to your little kids?? If so, then you are probably in good shape. We are scaring a lot of newcomers and little backyarders with all this GARBAGE.

[johnallin]

Food grade. Period. If it doesn't say that, then I won't put sap in it.






Is this 3rd grade?
Your misquote of me, above, seems to be intentional.

I wrote that, if it's food grade, it will be marketed as such.

I didn't write that it will "say it," which, given plastic's well known disinclination toward speech, means that you misquoted me as explicitly indicating buckets will be marked "food grade."

Seems like Mr Ivy did say "if it says plastic" Hmm

[Frank Ivy]

Just wondering Mr. Frank Ivy... do you actually sell any maple syrup to the general public or is your puritan processing only for your own consumption during world crisis?

How could it possibly matter?

[Frank Ivy]

OK! OK! OK!

We all need sap really bad and need to quit worrying about IS IT FOOD GRADE??? Let's be smart but this poor subject has taken a terrible beating and too much mud slinging going on. Would you serve it to your little kids?? If so, then you are probably in good shape. We are scaring a lot of newcomers and little backyarders with all this GARBAGE.

People feed McDonalds to their kids, so "would you feed it to your kids" is not the best test.

How about this test - "would you have any issue telling your customers that you don't use food-grade plastic?"

That's a better question.

[Frank Ivy]

Seems like Mr Ivy did say "if it says plastic" Hmm

Dude, if you're going to quote out-of-context from a different thread, at least get the quote right.

"Food grade" not "plastic." :o

[johnallin]

Dude, if you're going to quote out-of-context from a different thread, at least get the quote right.

"Food grade" not "plastic." :o

Mr. Frank Ivy, First I am not "Dude".
I think you were implying that plastic can't speak.......but that's not the issue.

In the six short weeks that you have been posting on this site, it appears that you have a knack for rubbing folks the wrong way. I am one of them.

This is a wonderful place for information on maple syrup and, in my opinion, is not a place for confrontation.

Please do this forum a favor and keep it to Maple and leave out the verbal attacks and nit picking. There are places for that and this is not one of them.
Keep it simple, keep it maple or keep to your self.

[mapleman3]

Thank you for not letting this escalate out of control.... oh wait, too late. Before this gets any worse I'd like to give some friendly ADMIN advice. Please refrain everyone from the "Flaming" it's in our rules and won't be tolerated. I will have to close the thread and talk with the parties involved. Thanks PLEASE lets be civil here.

Wikipedia describes Flaming Below
Flaming (also known as bashing) is hostile and insulting interaction between Internet users. Flaming usually occurs in the social context of a discussion board, Internet Relay Chat (IRC), Usenet, by e-mail or on Video-sharing websites. It is usually the result of the discussion of heated real-world issues like politics, sports, religion, and philosophy, or of issues that polarise subpopulations (for example, the perennial debating between PlayStation 3 and Xbox 360 owners). Internet trolls frequently set out to incite flamewars for the sole purpose of offending or irritating other posters.

Not blaming any one person(s) here I realize sometimes it just happens.... But Lets not lower ourselves to this Please.

Thank you and get out and make some Maple Syrup

[Dill]

Thank you for the Admin break.
One of the things I like about this site is the lack of BS that most other forums have. I know I'm on 10 of them.

[mapleman3]

Just my Job to get everyone back down on earth ;)

[TF Maple]

Personally I only use plastic containers that say food grade, are FDA approved or that I know were used containers, used only for food ingredients for the entire life cycle of the container. I think it would be bad publicity if people find out that any maple syrup producers were using anything they "feel" is safe but could be questionable. I'm not planning to twist anyone's arm to do as I do, just my 2 cents worth.

[johnallin]

Just my Job to get everyone back down on earth ;)

Thank you Jim we needed that.

[johnallin]

Darn he's back on another thread...

[mnguy]

Frank Ivy,

You mention the homer buckets as not being food safe. Am I reading the bottom of the buckets wrong? The bottom of the homer buckets read HDPE. The above link says that is food safe. Am I wrong?

[3rdgen.maple]

Oh boy here we go again.lol

[70 Buick]

this thread was awesome helped me alot

I had rubbermaid bins to collect my sap, did not know that the were not food safe, just always thought plastic was good
also the wife had bought me 2 large rubbermade garbage cans to dump my sap into


I have returned all the rubbermade stuff
I now have sterlite bins for collecting
and today found 55 gallon food grade bins to store my sap

Thanks for the info guys

[dgp219]

I don't know if anyone has mentioned this, but some totes have air vents in the handles and hold a lot less liquid than the volume of the tote. I have seen it mostly on the larger sizes (40-50 gal.).

[maple flats]

I have a 1.5" aluminum transfer pump and was planning to use the green pump hoses available at TSC. Should I use some other hose?