Gas Tanks

[caseyssugarshack93]

Hello, Im wondering what you Gas guys out there use for a gas tank to run you pumps, Last year i used the stock gas tank for a wile then switched to a 5 gallon pail but it seemed to leak with the fitting and rubber gasket, Maybe i just got a bad gasket, but what do you guys use? im thinking about getting like a 10-15 gallon plastic barrell and making that a gas tank, but dont want it to leak, so what do you guys use for fittings? I also looked at northern tool and they have 10 gallons tanks but for 100 DOLLORS so i was like well i think im better off making my own, hope you guys can help me out

Thanks

NATE

[farmall h]

Nate, do you have an old snowmachine tank kicking about? They have the nipples built into the tank where you can plug on gas line. Or better yet, yank the plastic gas tank out of a riding lawn tractor. I think they are 3 gallon capacity.

Looking forward to the pics.

[smitty76]

Nate, do not use rubber gaskets, they will leak. Your local auto parts store will have cork gasket material and that will work. A 15 gal plastic farm supply container would work good to, but any plastic should work.;)

[Bucket Head]

Neoprene is what you want for oil or gasoline. It is resistant to both of them. Cork gaskets are used in fuel sediment bowls, which leads me to this idea. Someone near you must have an old tractor gas tank kicking around. Or they have an old tractor laying around and the only thing worth anything on it is the tank. If your looking for "extended run" capabilities, look for a tank like that. They are metal, they are repairable, and they have metal fittings already welded/brazed/soldered on. Maybe some teflon tape and new fuel line and your good to go.

Steve

[3rdgen.maple]

Nate go to your local auto parts store and pick up a gas tank for a boat. I think they hold like 7 gallons. Grab one of the gas lines also with the priming bulb on them that plugs right into it. They are cheap and will work good I am thinking. I have seen them in Walmart also.

Got to thinking I am not sure if this tank would work unless your motor has a fuel pump on it. I am guessing they are gravity fed. Maybe if you set them up higher than the engine it will feed it fine. If they do have a pump on them I think it will work good. Just a thought for you anyways.

[jdj]

Nate,
I am in the same boat as you. I just got and Airablo pump with a 11hp honda on it. The current gas tank only hold 7qts, too small in my opinion. I got a 15 gal barrel, the kind the dairy farmers get there cleaning products in. On the top there is a big cap(for refueling) and a small cap which is 3/4 NPT. I put a 3/4 nipple in, 3/4 inch ball balve and then rduced it down to 1/4 inch. I got some epoxy type stuff at the auto parts that is suppose to be gas and oil resistant that I used while putting all fitting together.

I have not tried this tank yet but think it should work, but do have one concern: The carburetor on the honda engine is gravity fed. I plan on laying the tank I made on its side just a bit higher than the carburetor (so it will feed by gravity), but with 15 gal capacity it is going to have alot more head pressure than the 7qt tank that is currently on the engine. My concern is that i don't think the float in the carburetor will be able to hold back the pressure and I don't want to fill the base of the engine with gas. This is why I put the 3/4 inch ball valve in, so I can somewhat control the head pressure. Can anyone chime in on this and try to help me out??

Someone on the trader had mentioned an old snowsled tank,I had thought of this but sleds had diaphram carburetors whick would suck the fuel to the carburetor. Most, if not all small engines that I have seen are gravity fed to the carburetor.

[Haynes Forest Products]

Do a siphon set up. Get the primer type gas line and run a tube just off the bottom of the tank. most barrels have 2 bungs so use one for the fill and the other for your gas line once you prime the line it will flow till empty and you wont over pressure the float and you wont worry about leaky fittings. Dont use a big 1/2 line it can lose prime so use gas line and weight the end to keep it down. Just like in a chain saw. put in a fuel filter your set.

[Thompson's Tree Farm]

Nate and others. Been dealing with this issue for a couple of years and there are some good ideas here. I built 1 tank out of a 15 gallon jug as jdj suggests but I put a nipple in the side about 2" above the bottom of the tank. I drilled a hole smaller than the end of the fitting, heated the plastic with a propane torch, and screwed the nipple in. No leak! I can suspend this tank from a tree or set it on a stool like platform above the motor. I tried the same trick on another one and can't stop a slow drip so this method is not fool proof. I have a purchased tank that normally is on my sawmill edger that I just use on another pump during sugaring. Don't seem to get much time to run the mill that time of year anyway. I did have some problem last year with one set up where the engine would run fine for 8 or 10 hours and then quit. Would be air in the line. Purge it and start up. It might run 10 minutes or 10 hours. Never did get it figured out. Might try a smaller line as Haynes suggests. Was also told to make sure the line is as straight as possible with no sags. I know problems like this make me wish that my bush wasn't miles from an electrical source.

[maple flats]

I used to use an old tractor tank for my irrigation pump. I made a plumbing strap cradel in the open top of a 55 gal drum which I put rocks in the bottom of for stability. Then I had to punch a hole in the side of the bbl for the fuel line to go to the pump. It worked good. To do this you should be sure you have a good engine with little or no oil use and check the oil with every refueling. Extended run can get you in trouble if you aren't careful enough on oil (don't ask me how I know). The pump did run good that way for about 14 hrs for my 11 HP pump to run all night irrigating my strawberry fields for frost control.

[jdj]

Thompson is the tank you are having issues with vented? It could be vapor locking. My 15 gal detergent drum was thick enough to drill and tap to put a vent in, with that said you should be able to drill it and tap it to screw a gas line fitting in instead of heating with a torch. Also Thompson, with the 15 gal tank you have did you have any problems with the carburetor flooding(too much head pressure)? Did you use this tank on your hydrovac? Thanks

[Thompson's Tree Farm]

Jason,
The tank was vented. In fact it happened with the commercial tank and then I tried switching it to the home made one and had the same results. I had thought of the vapor lock problem and, since it was in a building, I just left the fuel cap off...no difference. I actually had this problem on an 11 horse honda that was on my liquid ring. My Hydrovac has a 9 horse honda and the homemade 15 gallon tank and I have not had an issue with that. I did have the float stick once with that the first year when it was shut down overnight. Noticed it immediately when I checked the oil the next AM. Drained it out and refilled and away I went. Was time for an oil change anyway. I think the fuel line I bought for the hydrovac may be slightly smaller than the one on the liquid ring so I will try that.
Doug

[3rdgen.maple]

Thompson check the route of your gas line. A motor can heat it up and boil the gas in it causing vapor lock as well.

[Bucket Head]

How much higher than the motor is the tank going to be? How high do you want to hike cans in the air to refuel?

If the outlet on the bottom of the tank is within a couple of feet of the carb. head pressure won't be a problem. Think of all the old cars, trucks and tractors out there with gravity fuel delivery. Their carbs. don't leak gas. If your not certain, you can always fill the tank and see if the carb leaks before the season starts. Even if it did leak, change the inlet needle and seat first. Don't just assume the tank is too high.

Editors Note: The p.s.i. rating for the gravity fuel feed of a Model T Ford, which has a 9 gal. tank over the carb., is only a small fraction of one p.s.i.!

Steve

[maple flats]

back when I used the tank for irrigation, my tank was about 14-18" above the carb. I used the shut off on the tank when shut down and had no problems.

[3rdgen.maple]

Bucket Head all the old engines that I know of had a big old float bowl on them to shut the flow off. The throw away world we live in nowadays things just are not the same. The engines I have basically have a cheap needle valve setup and rely on the vacuum created from the engine to suck the gas in. Crank the engine over, valve gets sucked open up to the point the throttle was set at. Pretty generic and I would think too much head pressure would push gas by the needle since there is no floats to seal them off.

[Haynes Forest Products]

Once again its about the head pressure. Im not saying its the head pressure BUT when you take a tank that is 30" high and set the bottom of it level with the carb then fill it the head pressure is measured from the top of the liquid not the bottom of the drum.

[Bucket Head]

3rdGen,

I agree that things are'nt made like they used to be. Does the engine in question have a fuel pump like device for sucking the fuel? I guess we need to know more about the style of carb. on this engine. Is this thing like the Briggs & Stratton engines with the carb attached to the tank, with no float bowl or float? What are we working with here exactly?

Haynes,

I know how head pressure is measured. Even if the "full" level was a few feet higher than the engine, there still would'nt be much measurable p.s.i. Hang a gas tank with some fuel in it six feet off the ground and open the valve. Put your finger over the line and feel the "pressure". Were not talking about trying to put your thumb over a garden hose and trying to shut the water off. There just is'nt that much pressure with a system like what he's trying to hook up here.

Like I said, suspend the tank over the engine and hook up the line. Try it before hand. Maybe it will leak, but the chances of it doing so are slim.

Steve

[Homestead Maple]

I looked on Ebay for lawn tractor gas tanks and usually there are pictures of what the person is selling. I found a low profile, long, rectangular tank that held 7 gallons. I was concerned that a high profile tank would flood the carb on my 8hp Honda. Here's an example or two;
http://cgi.ebay.com/John-Deere-400-Lawn-Garden-Tractor-Gas-Fuel-Tank_W0QQitemZ230423978964QQcmdZ
http://cgi.ebay.com/John-Deere-318-Tractor-Gas-Fuel-Tank_W0QQitemZ200434977604QQcmdZViewItemQQp

[3rdgen.maple]

Nate has not even responded or answered any of our questions so I am begining to think we are we will never find out what kind of carb setup he has buckethead:). I think we are spitting in the wind at this point.

[caseyssugarshack93]

i think im going with the 15 gallon milk detergent barrels and doing what jbj said drill and tap a hole on the bottom of the barrel, If not for 50 bucks i can get a Spayer tank from nothern tool that is 16 gallons and im pretty sure it had a drain built right in, if not i looked at a other site last night that has the same kind of tank and deffinly has a drain on the bottom

[caseyssugarshack93]

i have 5hp honda pumps

[3rdgen.maple]

Nate be sure to let us know how it works out for future reference.

[jdj]

I plan on trying the tank I made this weekend. I will post whether it was a success or just a waste of time!

[Haynes Forest Products]

Bucket Head Im talking to everyone in general as a open forum. Im not trying to chastise you:emb: Just a friendly point to others as we CHAT.

[caseyssugarshack93]

alright guys ill let you know how it makes out when i get the stuff, still have alot of things to do, and still buy a other gas engine lol and alot of other things,

[Bucket Head]

Haynes,

No, no, I did'nt take it as chastising. I'm sorry if my response sounded like I was bent out of shape. It was'nt supposed to sound like that!

I get on here and read a post and then I respond to it by typing whats on my mind. Sometimes quickly with no thought as to how it might sound to you guys reading it.

If in the future my responses get a little too "short and sweet", feel free to send me a "Settle down Bucket Head!" message and I'll get the hint, lol!

Steve

[lpakiz]

On the subject of GAS TANKS!! does anyone have an estimate of how much gas a 3 1/2 HP Briggs would use per hour under light load (SP-11)?
THANKS

[sapman]

The 5.5 Honda I had last year used about 1/3gph under pretty decent load.

Tim

[Breezy Lane Sugarworks]

The 5.5hp honda i used the last 2 years on my vacuum would run a little over 6 hrs. on the stock gas tank like clockwork. it was not quite full throttle, maybe about 3/4.

[lpakiz]

Ryan, Brezzy Lane,
How big was the tank then??

[Breezy Lane Sugarworks]

Had to be a gallon or 1.25 gallon??? it is what ever the stock tank size is. I can't exactly remember. just that every 6ish hours i would go and fill it as long as it was above 28-30 degrees.

[caseyssugarshack93]

what kind of hondas are you guys running i found a black one like this i think its aluminum http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200327077_200327077 and then i found the Redones
http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_299_299 Im guessing the redones are better and more releable? what do you guys thinks, I was thinking of getting the black one since the price isnt so high,but if the engine junk ill go with the red

[Breezy Lane Sugarworks]

Mine is a 5.5 hp red one and have had no trouble what so ever. this year I'll be running a 13 hp honda and next year I will hopefully be running both of them.

[Homestead Maple]

what kind of hondas are you guys running i found a black one like this i think its aluminum http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200327077_200327077 and then i found the Redones
http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_299_299 Im guessing the redones are better and more releable? what do you guys thinks, I was thinking of getting the black one since the price isnt so high,but if the engine junk ill go with the red

I have the red one, 8hp, but only because that is what was available to me at the time. It has the oil alert but I suppose if you check the oil regularly it's not needed.

[farmall h]

Nate, the red one may be alittle more expensive but it is extremely smooth and quiet. Unlike a B & S. We have one on the round bale wrapper and it handles all the hydraulics ie: spin turn table, rotate bale and table dump. Starts on 1st pull after sitting all winter!!
Exactly like the one you show in Northern Tool. The black one I assume will be just as good. Afterall, it is a Honda.

[caseyssugarshack93]

Whats the differnce in the black honda and the red honda just ones aluminum and ones nore or the black ones are louder? i dont know i was just thinking its a honda and cheaper than the red ones, but if its no good ill just spend the 350 and get the red one, but id like to know whats the real big difference in the two
I think its just the red ones just have a cast iron piston sleeve

thanks guys

[KenWP]

The red engine is rated as commercial and the black one is rated as residential. Basicly it means if you bought the black one and used it for a commercial application they would not warrranty like they would the red one. Theres a chance they are almost the same but if you pay extra you get better service. They say the red one has a cast cylinder but do not say what the black one has. There is 3 pounds difference in the weight on the same size motors so probbably pot metal to cast iron.

http://www.honda-engines.com/engines/gx160.htm

[caseyssugarshack93]

Thanks Ken We will see what one i end up with, I bought a black one last year and it worked fine, i just wanted to know what one i should get this year for a other pump

Thanks

[caseyssugarshack93]

I just want to make sure, So with the milk detergent barrels theres enough plastic on the bottom of them so i can drill and tap it ? i don't want to drill a hole then find out theres not enough plastic to even get threads,



Thanks

[Haynes Forest Products]

Cassy I cut one of the barrels in 1/2 and the thickness varries alot. Its the way they are made so the best thing to do is get a good strong light and shine it on the bottom and look thru the hole and mark the dark areas they will be the thickest. Dont drill thru the very bottom do the threads on the edge I think its thicker.

[caseyssugarshack93]

Thanks Haynes, i will do that ,

[Homestead Maple]

Hello, Im wondering what you Gas guys out there use for a gas tank to run you pumps, Last year i used the stock gas tank for a wile then switched to a 5 gallon pail but it seemed to leak with the fitting and rubber gasket, Maybe i just got a bad gasket, but what do you guys use? im thinking about getting like a 10-15 gallon plastic barrell and making that a gas tank, but dont want it to leak, so what do you guys use for fittings? I also looked at northern tool and they have 10 gallons tanks but for 100 DOLLORS so i was like well i think im better off making my own, hope you guys can help me out

Thanks

NATE

Here's a tank you might be interested in.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Molded-5-Gallon-Plastic-Fuel-Tank_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQhashZitem19b9f2dad7QQitemZ1 10493883095QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAcc essories