Tap hole cleanout

[Brent]

I`d like to give this a new whirl,

Given the comments in anitmicrobial spouts about stuff to sell as opposed to stuff thats good to use. I was brouseing a leading company`s catalog on the weekend and saw alcohol being offered as a tap hole cleaner / sterilizer.

What's the latest thinking on tap hole cleaning before you stick the spout in.
- air blast ?
- alcohol ?
- wash the drill bit after every hole
- plain water
- kiss of death ie blow in it
- nothing and hope for the best

[DrTimPerkins]

What's the latest thinking on tap hole cleaning before you stick the spout in.

A couple of research studies (UVM, Centre Acer) have shown the tap hole sanitizers are not effective in terms of increasing sap yield. This is likely due to the fact that they do not have any residual action. The sanitizer gets quickly flushed out of the taphole by sap flow and back-flow innoculates the taphole with microorganisms soon after that. End result...no effect.

We are currently looking into whether using taphole sanitizers with CV spouts might be more effective. The idea is that...if you sanitize the taphole, and then put in a CV, you created a nice clean taphole, and it should stay that way for a long time. The study will look at tapping date (mid Jan vs the more typical late-Feb/early-Mar timeframe), sanitizer (Ethanol) or no sanitizer, and CV vs normal spouts. Measured the first sap yield from this project just today. Should know more by the end of the season.

[Brent]

Yes Tim that is exactly why I was asking. If the CV spouts keep crud from ( non-scientific ) from getting back into the hole, then the cleanliness of the hole when the spout is inserted, should, I would think, play a much more import role than in the past.

[DrTimPerkins]

Yes Tim that is exactly why I was asking. If the CV spouts keep crud from ( non-scientific ) from getting back into the hole, then the cleanliness of the hole when the spout is inserted, should, I would think, play a much more import role than in the past.

That is the hypothesis we are testing. We'll know how it turns out in a couple of months.

[Haynes Forest Products]

Next we are going to be gloving up to tap:lol: I dont know if I missed the answer but how do you test for bacteria swabs or microscope?

[KenWP]

A gizmo that actually can tell how much bacteria is present.

[Brent]

the Gizmo is a fancy gauge that is Flow / No Flow

[DrTimPerkins]

Next we are going to be gloving up to tap:lol: I dont know if I missed the answer but how do you test for bacteria swabs or microscope?

There are several ways. One way we use that is quick and easy is to use an ATP luminometer. A sample of liquid is pulled into a sample tube, or an area is swabbed. Then the sample is mixed into a couple of chemicals (all built into the sample swab). If ATP (a chemical used in cells for energy transfer....if it's alive...it has ATP) is present in the sample, the chemical mixture glows. The luminometer reads the amount of light given off, which is related to the degree of contamination (which has been shown to be related to final syrup grade). Very simple and quick. Takes about 2 min.

The gizmo (luminometer) isn't cheap though, and the swabs are also not cheap, so not something the average sugarmaker would want to use.

[Snow Hill Farm]

So as far as simply cleaning any small wood chips, etc. out after tapping and before setting the Cv what's the best way? I was thinking of getting a couple cans of compressed air like you use to blow off dust when working on a computer? They are small enough to fit in my tool pouch...

[Brent]

I suspect at least one of the limitations on Dr Tim's activities ( on this and other subjects ) is being resolved as we speak and the royalties start to flow from the CV's.

[mark bolton]

The problem is, even if the inside of the tree is sterile, we are grinding bacteria from the drill bit and the bark into the wood fibres as we drill. On a microscopic level you could invision these fibres almost like a sponge with bacteria hiding in all the holes and small compartments. There is no way a special spout or sanitizer will find and kill all these bacteria. I suspect blowing into the hole from your mouth is irrelevent wrt duration of tap hole remaining patent (open) and overall sap contamination but if there is a study on this it would be interesting to see.

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

The best way to clean out wood chips is use a good bit and it takes care of about all of the shavings/chips. The $ 20 Canadian bit Bascoms sells takes about 2 to 3 seconds to tap a tree, in and out and the hole is usually nice and clean as it brings shavings/chips with it.

It is funny, we actually get someone on here that from a scientific standpoint knows more about syrup that about everyone on here put together and seems some are intent on running him off. Why don't we show some gratitude for what he does and quit throwing darts at him.

[mountainvan]

There was a study done on aseptic tapping, using alcohol to help kill bacteria while tapping. Not sure if they got more sap, but they made lighter syrup later in the year. It's in an issue of maple digest. From my own experience, I bring a spray bottle of alcohol and give a squirt into the taphole and on the spile. The year I did not do it my taps did dry out sooner. Granted this is not scientific, just real world/sugaring experience. Please feel free to cut and paste this post to suit your needs.

[backyardsugarer]

I use Vodka. I spray for the hole, one for the tap and one in my mouth

[Frank Ivy]

It's interesting stuff.

I'm still curious.

What's the issue with bacteria? Is it an off-flavor issue caused by the bacteria growth?

Or is it a health issue?

Are there any testing standards in place?

[gator330]

Frank,
Bacteria is the causing factor of reduced flow and is what shuts down tap holes for the season. The idea is to keep them running as long as you can so for the need to keep bacteria under control.

[Brent]

I suspect at least one of the limitations on Dr Tim's activities ( on this and other subjects ) is being resolved as we speak and the royalties start to flow from the CV's.

My post above seems to have been less than clear.. Let me try to clarify that with the following which was sent to Tim a few minutes ago.

"From your response and one on the forum it sounds like I didn't say what I meant very clearly. There was a comment you wrote about time and funding limitations. Time we can't do much about. Short season and you can only do so much testing in a year.

But I'm assuming you are going to be getting some royalties on the check valve and that should ease some of the funding contraints ... at least I hope so because we're all benefiting from the work you do."

[DrTimPerkins]

There was a study done on aseptic tapping, using alcohol to help kill bacteria while tapping. Not sure if they got more sap, but they made lighter syrup later in the year. It's in an issue of maple digest. From my own experience, I bring a spray bottle of alcohol and give a squirt into the taphole and on the spile. The year I did not do it my taps did dry out sooner. Granted this is not scientific, just real world/sugaring experience. Please feel free to cut and paste this post to suit your needs.

You probably are referring to a paper in the Maple Digest by Morselli and Whalen in 1992. They were mainly looking at sap quality/syrup color. The way they achieved aseptic tapping is not something you want to do. They flushed the back with alcohol. Flushed an axe with alcohol and chopped off a chunk of bark, reflushed the wood, the sterilized a bit with alcohol and flame, drilled a taphole, then flushed it with alcohol. You can still see the scars on some of those trees today...the work was done from 1977-1981. I don't believe they assessed sap yield.

Can't put my hands on this stuff at the moment (got other things to do), but unless I'm mistaken, previously published work (beginning in the 1950s) as well as more recent studies done by Centre Acer and the UVM PMRC have shown that ethanol in tapholes is ineffective in extending the season or increasing sap yields. This is most likely due to the lack of residual action. Once the sap starts flowing, or you get backflow happening, the alcohol is washed away and microbes get in the taphole. Just because it was there before doesn't mean the taphole will stay sanitized.