sap transfer pumps [Archive]

ctjim

01-24-2010, 06:39 AM

looking for a sap transfer pump so i can pump my pick up tank to the sap tank at the house and also pump my collection tanks into my truck tank. been looking at the small 2cycle pumps they have like the tanaka but thats a bit more than i want to spend. also was looking at the harbor freight pump and the one at northern tool are these any good? they seem like a better deal but not too sure about the quality as i have got some harbor freight junk b4. thanks for any help,jim

brookledge

01-24-2010, 08:24 AM

I have a tanaka 2 cycle and a honda 4 stroke. Look into a WX10 or a WX15
I now only use my tanaka as a back up. The honda uses a fraction of the fuel the tanaka uses and it doesn't stink from the 2 cycle gas.
Stick with a good brand. it is not fun to be trying to start an engine or repair a cheap model so make sure you can get good feedback from what ever you buy
Good luck
Keith

dfairbairn

01-24-2010, 08:24 AM

I have been using the small 1" pump from Northern Tool for the past three years and it works like a charm. Uses the same oil mixture as my chainsaw and will easily move 300gal in about 8-10 minutes.

ejmaple

01-24-2010, 09:49 AM

i too use the 1 incher from northern tool. it works mint for me, and its light.

Bucket Head

01-24-2010, 12:05 PM

We used a Homelite, 1" discharge, 2-stroke for years and were very happy with it. We still have it for backup. Our main pumps now are a Honda 4-stroke, 1" and a Robin/Subaru 4-stroke with the 1" discharge. The latter came from Harbor Freight, but I don't think they carry those anymore.

Theres nothing wrong with the 2-strokes, but I do like the fact now that all I have to do it put straight gas in and go. No more fumbling around with the oil and mixing when I'm in a hurry. Also, the exhaust tone from the 4-strokes are a little easier on the ears than the 2-strokes.

These style pumps are easy to move and the hoses are a lot easier to work with than the 2" and 3" hoses of the bigger pumps. We have quick disconnect fittings on all our hoses and pumps for ease of use too.

Steve

Haynes Forest Products

01-24-2010, 02:06 PM

I got one of those gas engines for a gocart from Harbor fright a Honda Knockoff. It will last about a year before the side case bolts come out and the carb starts falling apart. Do you really want to be out side working on it some night in the dark cold. All your guests are in side eating the hot Pizza that the wife brought out and there isnt a drop of sap in sight because its all running on the ground becouse the pump wont run. Your all greasy dirty from fixing the recoil rope for the 10th time from your buddy who is 6'5" keeps pulling the thing to the end and POP. It cold in the sap shack becaues the fire is out and you can get sap. WHAT ARE YOU THINKING:emb: DO THE RIGHT THING SPEND THE MONEY

WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER

01-24-2010, 02:06 PM

One a side note on the 2 stroke pumps, I handled 4500 gallon of sap with twice last year with 2 Tanaka pumps and didn't use much over a gallon of fuel mix.

heus

01-24-2010, 03:38 PM

I just purchased the 2-stroke pump from Tractor Supply with the Mitsubishi engine. Tested it for the first time yesterday and it sprays like a fire hose!

markct

01-24-2010, 05:40 PM

i have a 1 inch techumseh pump, 2 cycle, and works great probably not any higher quality than most but i love that parts are easy to get from my local saw and mower shop, he stocks most stuff cause its the same motor as the ice augers use. and pumps my 300 gal tank uphill 20 ft in about 10 min

maplemat1

01-24-2010, 05:48 PM

Haynes Forest Products

01-24-2010, 06:11 PM

I have the 4 strole briggs 2" and all I ever do is run it dry at the end of the sap season and put it away till next season:)

markct

01-24-2010, 08:36 PM

would you guys quit messing around with the 1 inch pumps if you want to move sap move sap with a 2 inch pump much quicker and no mixing gas.i got mine at tsc for about the same money as the little ones. wtih about a 1/3 of the time.

yea i would love to have something that pumps a bit faster too, but one of my tanks is about 60 ft down in a valley from where i can park the truck, and about 20 ft elevation rise so to pump out this tank i carry the pump down to the tank and connect it to the pump line i have laid up the hill and then pump that way. i can easily carry a 1 inch pump and short hose with me, but i would have a struggle carrying a 2 inch pump that far alone so the small pumps do have there applications. and i wouldnt want to try and prime a pump sucking sap up that far if i left the pump on the truck as some guys do with the larger
pumps

WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER

01-24-2010, 08:52 PM

Same reason I use a 1" pump, it is a lot lighter and easier to transport as I have to carry it to tanks to pump to the tractor up to 50 yards away and easier to transport on the tractor too.

Bucket Head

01-24-2010, 10:09 PM

If you can drive right up to a bulk tank(s) with your collection vehicle and you have hundreds or even a thousand gallons of sap to move, then yes, the larger pumps would be more practical.

On the other side of it, if your a smaller producer, with smaller collection vessels, in hard to reach areas, possibly a bad back, with a smaller maple budget, with children who like to help with collecting, etc., etc., then the 1" pumps are ideal.

I have the opportunity to purchase, from a friend, a fire truck with a 500gpm pump. That set-up would make all you guys out there with 2 and 3" pumps look like they came with some Barbie & Ken dolls.

Am I going to buy the truck for sap? Probably not. (But it would be neat!) Just trying to say that everybody's situation is different. Theres no need to try to brow beat someone into a large engine and pump if they don't need it.

Steve

Amber Gold

01-25-2010, 03:56 PM

I have the same 1" 2-stroke pump from TSC. It worked great last year without any issues...even when my wife left it outside full of sap and it froze solid. All it did was leak a bit and it finished out the season like that...a little RTV sealant and good to go. It is a bit loud, but it weighs nothing, pumps great, simple, easy to fix, and cheap. I like 2-strokes because they're simple. If something goes wrong, it's usually the rings. Put in a new set of rings and you're all set. As far as fuel effiency, I pumped about 6000 gallons into the truck then moving it around the SH and I don't think I went through more than a gallon of gas. Unless you're moving 10's of thousands of gallons of sap, I don't think fuel efficiency is much of a concern. If they're properly tuned and wide open, they don't stink. Did I mention it didn't weigh anything. I think it's rated for 9 lbs and I haven't found one close to that.

WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER

01-25-2010, 05:15 PM

Happened to be in Tractor supply picking up a couple of things today and noticed the pump Josh referred to had been reduced to $ 219 from $ 239 and it looked like a very nice pump.

Brent

01-25-2010, 08:02 PM

I've got a Wajax fire pump that you've got to lean into the when it's pumping.
It's high compression so I don't think the wife has been able to start it for 10 years.

I've used a Honda mower for 25 years. Starts 1st pull every time. With all the extra taps we getting this year, the wife will be doing a lot of the collecting so easy starting is #1. And then we only fill a pair of 35 gallon tanks on the Gator so a 1" will do fine. The hose weight will be easier for her too. Honda here we come.

Amber Gold

01-26-2010, 07:00 AM

Brandon, I think when I bought it last year it was $269. That's cheap money for a pump. Aren't the honda's in the $400 range?

Another thing. You don't want a pump that's too big. They're heavy and you don't need to be able to pump 100 gpm unless you're emptying a 1000 gal tank every day. The TSC pump pumps 37 gpm which fills/empties my truck tank in about 6 minutes. It gives you time to check the tanks over, releaser, some taps, and etc. The 1" pumps are a good all-purpose pump.

WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER

01-26-2010, 08:07 AM

Josh,

I think it had a Mitsubishi engine on it and was a nice looking pump.

Amber Gold

01-26-2010, 08:21 AM

That is correct. It runs and pumps great.

wcproctor

01-26-2010, 08:45 AM

Honda !!!!

maple marc

01-27-2010, 11:12 PM

Jim,

I bought a new sump pump at the Big Box for $60. It empties a 55 gallon drum in about 12 minutes. Works just fine for my operation. Be sure to buy a kinkless drinking water hose at the RV store. An el cheapo hose does not work well in cold weather.

Good luck,
Marc

Brian Ledoux

02-05-2010, 02:18 PM

Tweegs

02-05-2010, 02:34 PM

Also in the market for a pump.

Just read through the thread, did a little research, and found that Northern tool sells a 1” 2-stroke for $145. It is rated to run about 26 GPM with a 23 foot head.

Compare that to the offering from Harbor Freight…a 1.5” 4 stroke for $170. 52 GPM, 23 foot suction height and 72 foot head lift.

For the extra $25, I think I’d go with the bigger 4-stroke. I can’t make out what brand engine is on it though, that kind of gives me the willies.

Tractor supply didn’t have one listed on their site for under $250, but I have to stop in tonight to pick up some chicken feed, I’ll have a look then.

In the meantime…anyone have this fella here:
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=95123

If so, what do you think of it?

Tweegs

02-05-2010, 02:44 PM

Hi folks,
I have been trying to figure out what type of pump I would need to pump sap from sap haluer tank to the 55 gallon drum in the sugar shack and having trouble because when I spoke to the plumbing supply place they said that none of them would be safe on the "potable" side. Are their any pumps that don't contaminate the sap in any way? If so, what kind? Thanks!

Brian,
Last year I used a fountain pump ( submersible electric) that I got from home depot. It did OK but was slow, took about 20 minutes to empty a 65 gallon collection tank.

Because I was running much the same as you, it didn’t bother me much. The arch and holding tank were close to a power source. I think I spent $50~60 on that pump.

Going to tube and doubling my tap count made that pump obsolete, it resides in mama’s pond now. :lol:

Thompson's Tree Farm

02-05-2010, 06:26 PM

Tweegs,
Not 100% sure but I think that harbor freight motor is a "jingdong" (or something like that) from China. If so it is a honda knock off. I have several of the motors. some on pumps, one on a wood splitter. They are ok...certainly not a honda but they are serviceable and cheap.

red maples

02-05-2010, 07:58 PM

So where can you get an electirc water transfer pump for potable water???

that won't break the bank!!!

bascom's cheapest is like $800:o
I got one during the summer has a stainless casing took it apart well its plastic on the inside don't know if its good for sap?

Please help

farmall h

02-05-2010, 08:05 PM

Reminds me of pumping sap with a Tanaka pump back in the late 80's. We also used it to feed the water bowls when the barn water froze for 90 head of cows. Pumped the water from the river! Yikes...probably a no no.:emb:

WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER

02-05-2010, 09:13 PM

Harbor Freight had a 2 stroke gas 1" pump on sale for $ 99 in the February flier that came out a few days ago. It is the month long flier.

markcasper

02-06-2010, 06:18 AM

Father & Son

02-06-2010, 08:55 AM

Tractor Supply has a 2" pump that I'm going to try this year. Here's the link -

http://www.tractorsupply.com/agriculture-farming-ranching/transfer-pumps-tanks-parts/transfer-pumps/3-5-hp-2-in-pacer-reg-self-priming-transfer-pump-2135958?ddkey=http%3AClickInfo&evtype=CpgnClick&intv_id=15001&mpe_id=12075&cm_cr=No%20Campaign-_-Web%20Activity-_-Cross%20Sell%20Up%20Sell-_-ProductDetail_Espot1-_-3.5%20HP*%202%20in.%20Pacer®%20Self-priming%20Transfer%20Pump

Also, their 1" pump is very similar to the 1" Tanaka for alot less money. I'll find out how well they last.

Jim

Tweegs

02-06-2010, 11:59 AM

My lucky day!

The original owners of this house died several years ago. Their kids sold it to me and mama back in ’08. They left a bunch of stuff behind, including an older pump.

Got to thinking about it while I was in tractor supply last night checking their pumps, noticed they had replacement pump heads. If the engine ran, I thought, I could just replace the head and save about a hundred bucks. Worst case I would be out a little oil, a splash of gas, and maybe the price of a plug for the effort.

Brought that old pump down this morning, the pump head was seized, but it came off with little trouble. It had good spark with the plug that was in it and the compression felt good. Changed the oil, added gas and it fired right up. Gotta love a Briggs.

Inch and a half inlet and outlet on it, figure the 4 stroke engine is in the neighborhood of 4 HP. Now if I can get a head to match up, I should be golden.

KenWP

02-06-2010, 01:09 PM

And you can't un seize it or rebuild it.

KenWP

02-06-2010, 01:15 PM

Where is Harbor Freight? Is it an eastern thing? I have never heard of it. I am looking for a pump like this or a bit bigger. The cheapest 2'' pump at a local farm supply place is like $450. Now it says 11/2" x 2". Whats up with that? Don't they have to be the same?

Here is link to stores in Wis. Could even do better but where the hell is Knapp.

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/retail_stores.taf#W

Tweegs

02-07-2010, 07:19 AM

And you can't un seize it or rebuild it.

Nah, the head itself looks like it had a bit of a hard life. Metal, rusted, had been welded to stop a leak, I assume, was packed full of sand, and the impeller was cracked…probably a result of water (ice) still in it, along with the sand. Though I have to admit, I gave it a think. Couldn’t resist pulling it apart. :lol:

I shudder at the notion of what may have gone through it, water wise, and then use it to transfer sap?...Bleh.

No, methinks it would be cheaper, and fewer headaches, to just replace it.

red maples

02-07-2010, 08:00 AM

KenWP

02-07-2010, 08:08 AM

I had a 3 inch Honda trash pump that we used a lot when sewer lines plugged up and I got it from the last people that borrowed it and it started fine but would not suck no matter how much a primed it. Took it apart and there was a 9/16 wrench in it that had taken out the impellers period. Cost me $750 bucks for a new one and I had to take the pump part to a guy with a large vice and a torch and a huge impact wrench to get it off. Then turned out he burnt up the back seal heating it and had to order one ofthose too.
People who had borrowed it didn't say much when I gave them the wrench back and told them I charged it to their account at NAPA.

Tweegs

02-07-2010, 09:01 AM

so as far as an electric sap pump goes, A shallow well jet pump should be fine right? It is cast iron housing and has stainless shafts. and you can get then at lowes starting at 167 for 1/2 hp and 9 gpm. from what I read you have to disconnect the pressure switch to use it as a transfer pump.

I don’t know Brad…
For $167, I think I would go with a gas engine and pull the 52 odd GPM. I would think the cast iron will rust , not that we all can’t use a little iron in our diet, but an off flavor perhaps? Just speculating here.

I haven’t looked, but doesn’t Lowes carry an all plastic submersible sump pump? Thought being to remove the float, wire the float contact high, and add an on/off switch to the power line. I don’t know what the GPM is on such a thing, or the price, but it seems to me some were under $100.

Dill

02-07-2010, 09:14 AM

TSC has a submerisble for 70.
http://www.tractorsupply.com/home-improvement/water-pumps/utility-pumps/shur-dri-reg-utility-submersible-1-6-hp-1-260-gph-3123051
No float.

But I'm thinking about going with this.
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=9576
12v transfer pump for 40.
I have a gas pump for tanks, but this might be good for going between storage and the head tank.

Father & Son

02-07-2010, 10:26 AM

Dill,
If you're going 12v look at Rule bilge pumps.

Jim

Stickey

02-07-2010, 10:57 AM

I just picked up a 500 gph bilge from Irwin marine for $25. Can't vouch for how well it works but it's cheap enough for me to play around with.

red maples

02-07-2010, 11:02 AM

I have a transfer pump...(don't want a submersive pump because I don't know if it is allowed don't know what's in the plastic that could leach out!!!)
the one I have is from lowes and was $140 stainless housing inside is plastic...the thing is I don't know if the plastic is food grade!!!! So am I allowed to use it??? nowhere in the packaging does it say anything about about NSF or ok for potable water. it won't rust or leach lead because there is no brass. just worried about the plastic.

thing is I don't want to use the gas pump beacuse I don't want that noise at those last night boiling parties. and I would have to start it up every 1-1/2 hours.

I do have a lead free brass foot valve.

Farmboy

02-07-2010, 12:01 PM

What does everyone think about this pump. I want a small pump for in the sugar shack for transfering sap from a 55 gallon collecting tank to a storage tank or from a storage tank into the feed tank.
http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ1xnk/R-100661340/h_d2/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053

red maples

02-07-2010, 01:20 PM

has brass fittings make sure they are made with lead free brass.

KenWP

02-07-2010, 02:06 PM

Would have to be a incredibly slow pump to contaminate water if it was possible. The lead leaching would come from useing brass fitting where heat hit it if it happened anywheres. As to a pump your talking about sap rushing through it at speed. With plastic not many things like impellers and houseings would be made with recycled plastic as it"s not dependable enough for that kind of purpose. If the submersible is made for water transfer it would be okay.

WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER

02-07-2010, 03:51 PM

Better make sure the submersible pump is oil free and it should be ok.

Farmboy

02-09-2010, 08:42 PM

I ordered that pump that I posted earlier. It should be here the end of the week or the begining of next week.

Brian Ledoux

02-09-2010, 10:05 PM

farmboy,
have you verified that the pump does not have grease inside it that would contaminate the syrup? I went to home depot tonight and picked one up. When I stuck a Q-tip inside the housing (both intake and outflow sides) there was grease. I had bought one made of plastic, the kind that you attach a drill to. I would love to know if the one you got is grease free. I called a plumbing supply store (FW Webb) and they told me they didn't have any that did not contaminate potable water.

Dill

02-10-2010, 08:07 AM

Those drill pumps are worthless. I bought 2 to transfer 10 gallons of bad diesel out of a tank. Figuring they'd be disposable after the job was done. I moved 3 gallons before both died.

Brian Ledoux

02-10-2010, 10:23 AM

So can someone tell me what they are doing to clean out the grease in these pumps so that there is no affect to syrup from grease, etc leaching into the sap? I searched prior threads and don't see any concrete info on this. Or does someone have a specific model that one could get at home depot/Lowes that they know is ok for transferring sap?

Brent

02-10-2010, 10:32 AM

The drill pumps run in the category of "made only to be sold, not used"

The only thing they move is money out of your pocket into the manufacturers's pocket.

morningstarfarm

02-10-2010, 11:35 AM

Bought one of these on e-bay and LOVE it...stainless pump came with no grease in it.worth every penny so far..check it out ebay # 160396019654

red maples

02-10-2010, 05:25 PM

problem is you need a pump that is sealed for potable water.

most pumps you see in the big box stores are for water transfer but are not sealed so the grease you talk about is there and you can't get rid of it and it is not food grade and will contaminate your sap.

well Jet pumps are sealed and made for potable water but most are made of cast iorn which is not bad for you but can and will rust.

So anyone looking into buying a pump check online and send emails to companys that deal with pumps and ask for a sealed potable water pump that is lead free or food safe plastic that will move 5-10 gpm. and tell them you are a maple syrup producer so they know what it is for. even if the price is high see what you can find. and post it here.

I am still looking into few companies that deal with pumps and have yet to find one. but I will keep you posted.

beacuse I really don't want to pay $800 for a 1/2 hp pump from bacom's. that is just too high.

KenWP

02-10-2010, 05:34 PM

Do these pumps have grease in them for transportation untill they are used. if so they would just have to be washed with hot water and soap and be good to go. Even one of those pumps used for a camper or trailer would work for some things. Wish I had of kept all mine isntead of throwing them all in the trailer when i sold it.

Brent

02-10-2010, 10:08 PM

Check out
http://www.walrusamerica.com/
The have many models that are stainless and rated for potable water ... but all are electric drive.

And they are well priced

red maples

02-11-2010, 07:31 PM

so I sent an email to walrus and I am trying to get pricing.

I asked US. plastics for info as well but they have not answered me yet they have a bunch of pumps.

KenWP

02-11-2010, 08:24 PM

Check out
http://www.walrusamerica.com/
The have many models that are stainless and rated for potable water ... but all are electric drive.

And they are well priced

How pray tell are you getting prices from that web site. I went all through it and just found specs but no prices. Went through the other link to there main web site also.

monktonmaple

02-12-2010, 09:13 AM

http://www.plumbingsupply.com/boosterpumps.html

The above site is one that you can get the price and order online the walrus pumps.

Bill

red maples

02-12-2010, 09:14 AM

I emailed them. and working with a sales guy.

red maples

02-12-2010, 09:28 AM

the TQ200 is the pump and it is $303 through the link from monktonmaple.

And $305 through the walrus america link. that includes shipping.

it is 1/4 hp motor stainless parts for potable water. and will move about 15gpm, on a 10 ft lift.

markcasper

02-12-2010, 06:53 PM

I am looking at 2" pump at the Fleet Farm. There are 5-6 different brands, Wayne, Red Lion, can't remeber the rest. The one has a Brigs engine.

But now am hearing things like grease, etc inside. I know of other syrupmakers that have these kinds of pumps. Either they didn't know about the grease, or didn't care. But they are being used to this day.

One of them is $40 off til Sunday. Whats a guy to do?

red maples

02-13-2010, 07:18 AM

here are my thoughts...If you read the sterilite thread, Dr perkins said something that really hit home.

If there is something that you're questioning as far as maple syrup goes, After you processed that sap into syrup, would you feed it to your kids. and sell it to people that will feed it to their families, would I eat it probably but thats me, but certainly don't want to feed it to the rest of the population.

using something containing lead, non-food grade plastic, lubricants whatever you have to remember that people are eating this stuff. So I am spending the $300 on the good pump that is good for potable water that is sealed from the motor and any contaminants.

...anyone want to buy slightly used water transfer pump used only for clean water???

markcasper

02-13-2010, 03:47 PM

Littlesap

02-13-2010, 06:46 PM

OK, so after reading this thread I really regret buying a brand new (ebay) powermate clean water pump that does not say "for potable water". I'm heading to Bascom's on Monday for something else so I will ask them to double check but guessing this will go back on ebay Monday evening.

Anyone have a recommendation for a gas powered pump that is suitable for potable water?

KenWP

02-13-2010, 07:46 PM

I can't see how a pump can hurt anything. The liquid passes through so fast it can't do much. Most of those pumps have grease in them to stop rust with shipping and for start up. The water lubes it after it is running. Just wash them out with soap and hot water and your good to go.

heus

02-13-2010, 09:06 PM

Bascoms has a Homelite "Farm Pump" in their catalog. Doesn't say its for sap or potable water. But its still for sale in their catalog. I'm sure its no different than the Pacer pump or a multitude of others that can be purchased at TSC, Northern Tool, etc.

markcasper

02-14-2010, 06:35 AM

I bought the pump yesterday afternoon.......its a Monarch, odd name, I never heard of it.
It was manufactured in Winipeg, MB. It was $40 off until closing yesterday. I can return it if need be.

As someone prior was mentioning, I was at Andersons early last week and on their showroom floor sat a similar pump and had Northern Tool stickers all over it. I did not ask about it, but am sure it was not for sap either, yet I assume it was for sale. Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

So, what about all that plastic? Is it really safe cuz FDA says? Or do they know something we don't?

wcproctor

02-14-2010, 07:26 AM

OK . Pumps, all pumps have a wet end and a dry end. The wet is were the water flows and the dry is the motor and NO water gets to the motor unless the seals are bad. The seals separate the two. As long as the pump you buying is plastic or aluminum you don't have to worry. I deal with pump all the time and if you are looking for a pump to move a lot of material buy a 1/2 hp pool pump (very clean) and you need Elc.or just to pump small tanks in the field go get a aluminum housing gas job. You don't have to worry about grasse!

KenWP

02-14-2010, 09:03 AM

That and cast iron impellers and houseings. All this food safe and plastic stuff is being put out by people who want you to buy expensive stuff to fill there pockets. The maple suppliers even sell brass pumps for the filter presses and I haven't heard peep on those yet on here. Probbably since they are worth so much they just have to be good. Of course the SS one is only $1200 bucks.
As long as people are reasonably carefull and use their heads there will be no problems. But people who come up with all these other ideas to fill other peoples pockets with cash do not help the problem. Seems like people either can't read for themselves or only read what they want to hear.

waysidemaple

02-14-2010, 12:16 PM

I saw this pump on ebay. So would this be okay for sap transfer? Any thoughts?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=390154450164&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER

02-14-2010, 01:24 PM

It should work just fine. Seems like a really good price if it is a good pump.

I think this food grade stuff is getting ran into the ground. We should all be very conscience of using food grade stuff, but this has gotten to the point that some of these newer guys are freaking out. Lets worry about making syrup and do the best we can. Would you feed it to all your family and if you answer yes, then you are probably in great shape.

heus

02-14-2010, 04:31 PM

Ken and Brandon, AMEN!!

red maples

02-14-2010, 04:35 PM

Flip-side.....So its not ok to eat syrup that contains any lead, any lubricants, or anything foreign. But it must be ok to eat all of the processed foods and meats with preservatives, all of the genetically modified food, bovine growth hormone in milk, hormones in the meat, and those that live on city water, drink that which contains fluoride, (alot of countries ban this, not USA) because it is FDA approved.? Not to mention all of the vegetables with herbicides and pesticides.
Anything you eat out of a can gets contaminated with harmful things, (I know, I manufacture food cans.) Also, cell phones, electromagnetic field will cause a big increase in brain cancer in the years ahead.

Not to start a rant, I am only putting this in perspective!! By the way, has anyone ever questiones the safety of all of this plastic, uhhhhhh, it must be ok because its fda approved.

I agree with you 100%. I know whats good and whats bad. Even food processing plants allow a certain percentage of rodent ...whatever in the food "WHAT!!!"

buying certified organic is very expensive alot of families have no choice but to buy products from large processing plants loaded with fillers, by-products and perservatives.

Bottom line is we are all out to save a buck right. not to say we are all cheap...maybe frugal is a better word and we all know anything for maple is expensive as hell. but I want to try to control as much as can of what I am doing to the food. It may just be a "code of ethics" or a "buyer be wear" or "truth in product. what ever the case maybe, I want it to be as safe as I can make it.

red maples

02-14-2010, 04:39 PM

I am sorry I created such an up roar. and I am sorry for being the new guy that is just being cautious!!!

WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER

02-14-2010, 04:41 PM

I don't think you created an uproar, just some of these guys are taking this food grade stuff a little too far. It's all good discussion, but sometimes it goes a little too far and I am sure you could probably find something in everyone's operation that someone would think is not food grade.

Far as I am concerned a brass pump isn't food grade in some peoples opinions but we have them on all our filter presses along with other things like that.

Brent

02-14-2010, 05:23 PM

how apetizing, a trash pump for my childrens syrup ?

Brent

02-14-2010, 05:25 PM

Brandon

I don't like brass pumps either but the stainless price !!!!!!

I got an Italian made expresso coffee maker. Out of the box it was sending shredded brass into the coffee. Got rid of that one instantly.

vtjeeper

02-14-2010, 05:43 PM

speaking of price, the cheapo harbor freight 1" clear water pump went on sale this afternoon. I ordered one. with shipping it's $42

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=1479

:o

KenWP

02-14-2010, 06:16 PM

Now that would solve a lot of my short she who must be obeyed problems. I could use that to fill the head tank. We had stores like harbour freight back west but Quebec dosn't have such stores that I have found so far.

kinalfarm

02-14-2010, 06:49 PM

its only called a trash pump because its designed to be able to pump water with rocks or mud in it without harming the pump. it should be safe for sap. heck if i could aford it i would buy it!

plus think, those of us with wells. my well pump is not stainless and i am willing to bit that not many peoples are and we drink that water every day.

RickinFarmington

02-14-2010, 07:34 PM

LIghten up guys. There are clearly different approaches to this maple syrup making thing. Some of us are doing it as a hobby for family and friends, while others are doing it for profit. The associatated costs for both approaches vary considerably.
I received a $42.00 clear water pump from Harbor Freight last week. Pulled the pump apart and thoroughly cleaned the pump cavity. Works very nicely for pumping sap up to my storage tank. I guess I will take the risk of using a non SS pump in my operation.

Farmboy

02-16-2010, 05:36 PM

I got the pump I talked about earlier. It is steel. ALso there was no grease in it. It works great so far. I would recomend it. The best $140 ive spent so far making syrup.

diehlhollow

02-17-2010, 08:15 AM

I bought one of those pumps from harbor freight and I'm happy with it. But when it says "clear water" they mean clear water you don't want any dirt or debris in it. If it fells grity you don't want to run it through your pump. On pipeline that shouldn't be a problem. Now We have about 205-300 taps on buckets and depending on the help that day there can be some odd debris in the water (you don't want to run that through the pump).

Tweegs

03-01-2010, 06:55 PM

As my story unfolds…
The one pump head replacement I could find sold for more than the pump from Harbor Freight, so I just bought the new pump from them.

Made a mistake buying the hose though, I think. Has a strong urethane smell to it. Being the dummy I can sometimes be, I gave it the tongue test, a little lick on the inside of the hose, to, you know…see. :lol:

Fortunately, I can type better than I can talk at the moment…vile, simply vile.

I need to find a good 1.5” hose, and quick…what are you all using?

WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER

03-01-2010, 09:17 PM

Brent

03-04-2010, 05:48 PM

Today was the first day to try out the new little Honda 1"
pump.

We have the 275 gallon totes in the bush under the releasers and a Gator with two 35 gallon tanks.

That little pump fills the 35 gallon tank in a bit over a minute. It weighs only 22 lbs soaking wet. That's real important because once the RO and evap get going the wife takes on collection duty.

Tweegs

03-05-2010, 07:22 AM

This stuff is awesome for both ends of the pump and order whatever size you need. I have been using some for 7 or 8 years and still about like new. Very durable and flexible and should last for probably 20 years or more with proper care and storage during off season:

http://www.usplastic.com/catalog/item.aspx?itemid=23579&catid=736

PS They are an awesome company and ship same day.

Thanks!
Ordered the stuff on Tuesday, it showed up Wed...UPS ground, gotta love that. Near got the UPS truck stuck in the drive, but that's another story.

It looks good and like it will last.

Still need to flush the pump out before I use it, tonights agenda.

Brent

03-05-2010, 08:11 AM

My short experience with this clear wire re-enforced plastic is that it will go
white / opaque over time when left out in the sun. Hoses stored indoors still look great. Hoses I left outside on tanks have change enough that it is hard to see fluids in them now.

marky the mapler

03-06-2010, 09:34 AM

Here is a video of my transfer in action using the northern tool mitsubishi engine. It takes a little to load.

http://gallery.me.com/mhp#100040/IMG_1253&bgcolor=black

johnallin

03-06-2010, 06:49 PM

Bought one of the Harbor Fright clear water pumps for $40and used it for the first time Friday. Ran about 50 gallons of house water with some bleach through it to clean it all out and it worked great and emptying my 35 gal tanks in less than 4 min. each. It is rated to pull for 10' and push 115', that's a lot and I'm only pulling about 4' and pushing 8 so it's just dandy for me.

Per a suggestion here on Trader I put a foot valve at the pickup end so it stays primed until I unhook everything and bring in for the night. The downstream hose runs up through the shack wall at 9' and from there it's pitched downward to the top of the tank. Thought was to have it drain fully once the pump is unhookd, so far it's working.

Have no idea how long it will last, but my 2 cents says it's a pretty good start. Sure was easier with the half pint though - just go collect 30 gallons from 35 taps and you were set to boil for the next 5 hours...This new 2X6 is a thirsty little beast!

sapman

03-06-2010, 10:19 PM

The 2" pump I used from work last year is out of commision this year. And once it's fixed, it's being used on some big jobs. So I broke down yesterday and bought the same Mustang pump with Honda engine from TSC. Pricey, but I love the way the thing works. Put oil and gas in out of the box, and she started on the first pull. Great machines!

Tim

WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER

03-07-2010, 01:03 PM

Thanks!
Ordered the stuff on Tuesday, it showed up Wed...UPS ground, gotta love that. Near got the UPS truck stuck in the drive, but that's another story.

It looks good and like it will last.

Still need to flush the pump out before I use it, tonights agenda.

Don't think you will regret buying that stuff, it is awesome. I do rinse mine at the end of each season and hang it up to dry so it completely drains and no mold can get inside. I have 10'+ ceilings and I hang it over the trusses and and pull each end of the hose out tight on a slope so it dries good. They are a really good company and ship super fast.

Goggleeye

12-09-2010, 10:11 PM

I have to buy a pump this year to handle the sap. Primarily for pumping from barrels on the tractor carry-all to my elevated storage tank. May also need to use it to pump out barrels in the woods into barrels on the tractor.

Anybody ever used one of the PTO pumps like this to transfer sap? Thoughts as to the pros and cons of these?
http://www.tractorsupply.com/agriculture-farming-ranching/agricultural-sprayers-spraying/sprayer-pumps/roller-pumps/6-roller-pump-kit-2112023

I looked into the 4-stroke Honda 1", and at $500, that's out of my budget.

Also considering this. According to the specs, I could empty a barrel in a minute, and I could use the exercise. Think this would have enough draw, though?
http://www.handpumps.com/crankez.htm

Any thoughts on the off-brand 2-stroke in Northern? Some of you mentioned having those.
Any input appreciated. Thanks, Mark

red maples

12-10-2010, 06:19 AM

I like that hand pump!!!! thats pretty cool.

xyz5150

12-10-2010, 07:30 AM

128 rpm's by hand now that's cranking ! Get a stop watch try to spin your arm around 128 times in one minute.:lol: I'm going to use a 12v bilge pump to transfer from my 55 gal barrels in the woods to my barrels on my utv. I bought a 110v shurflo 4.4gpm pump to transfer for my storage tank to my head tank. Both pumps combined are less than $130.00.

Goggleeye

12-10-2010, 08:21 AM

OK, xyz, give me the specifics on those. Where did you pick those up? I like that price range. Just seems like the 4.4gpm is a little slow, though, but I'd like to check it out.

I might be a bit tired & sweaty after a couple barrels, but I'd like to think I could get 128 rpm's out of these guns:lol:
I just wonder if I could get the head pressure to lift up to my storage tank with that hand pump.

gmcooper

12-10-2010, 09:21 AM

Goggleeye,
One these from Tractor Supply should do what you need at a reasonable price. $189
http://www.tractorsupply.com/agriculture-farming-ranching/transfer-pumps-tanks-parts/transfer-pumps/red-lion-2-4-hp-engine-driven-water-pump-1023069

I have several similar I have used lots over the past 20 years and most have worked well. That brand I'm not familar with looks very similar to the Robin brand I use now.
The 12 volt pumps tend to be very slow and don't really like and slush or ice particals either.

firetech

12-10-2010, 02:08 PM

Will this style TSC pump work if I'm collecting 55gal barrels laid on their side with the pump mounted on the truck bed (4ft). A hose (14ft) mounted on a boom to keep it off the ground and a PVC wand with a valve to stop sap flow between barrels (hoping to hold the prime) as I walk down the road to the next barrel 100-200ft and then move the sap up to the tote on the truck? 8ft of lift. How will this work if I leave the motor running between barrels? I hope to use this pump to off load the sap also but thats in switching hoses around.

xyz5150

12-10-2010, 02:12 PM

The bilge pump is rated for 500 gph you can buy it from cabelas for $21.00. I will have 80 taps on 4 55 gallon barrels. If they are all full (i hope) it should take less than a half hour to pump. My shurflow i bought on ebay for about $100.00 I have a 2x4 drop flue i can boil about 18-20gph so a 4 gallon a minute pump can keep up to my rig. I think a trash pump would be a bit of a overkill pumping from a 55 gallon drum to another 55 gallon drum.

SeanD

12-10-2010, 05:15 PM

I'm sorry I have to be the dumb *** on this thread. How do the electric pumps work when you are our collecting? Do they run off the tractor/atv battery? If it's best for the pump to be near the sap, do you carry the pump to the collection tank and push the sap up to the hauler? How is it powered then?

Sean

Sugarmaker

12-10-2010, 05:35 PM

We are using the RULE brand 12 volt bilge pumps, running off the gathering vehicle battery. Dollar range depends on how fast you want to pump. I think the largest we have pumps 1 gallon/sec. (3700 GPH). It was $150 ish?? been several years. Yes they don't like slush, so we just put a slush screen prior to the pump. Generally very dependable marine grade units. If your boat was sinking you would want this thing to work:) And for gathering sap we have had good success. They are quiet too!
Regards,
Chris

gmcooper

12-10-2010, 08:43 PM

Chris
Where do you get the Rule brand pumps? I have one landowner that gathers sap with his 4-wheeler and he wants an electric 12v pump. All he and I could find was around 4 gpm max. Some of those were $130
Mark

Brent

12-10-2010, 09:07 PM

My wife collects in our Gator while I boil. She can't lift much over her shoulders so filling the tanks in the back of the Gator was a real problem. I got a Rule 2000 pump and rigged it to sit in a pail on the floor in front of the passenger seat. She collects 2 of the 5 gallon pails about 2/3 full and takes them back to the Gator, starts the pump and pours. By the time she picks up the second pail the pump has uploaded to the tank in the back of the Gator and she dumps in the second one. Five or 10 seconds later, the pump has emptied the transfer pail, she shuts off the pump and goes out to fill the gather pails again.

You can get the pumps from West Marine or lots of other places like that. Their primary use is as bilge pumps and they come in lots of sizes. Getting the 2000 size was a luck guess. It's about perfect for pumping up the 4 feet lift to the tanks on the back of the Gator fast enough that it doesn't slow you down.

Bucket Head

12-10-2010, 11:40 PM

Last season I took Chris' advice and got a Rule pump. 3700 model, and I'm very happy with it. I had a 12v recirculation pump, which was quiet and reliable, but not as fast as I would have liked. The Rule gets in done pretty quickly. Just do a search for Rule pumps- one hundred marine supply outfits will come up. Check everyone's prices and go from there. I ended upordering one from a supply in Mass. They were the cheapest at the time.

Steve

Haynes Forest Products

12-10-2010, 11:44 PM

SeanD When I was using a bilge pump We stuck the pump in the tank with the elec cord taped to the hose. The next year we mounted the pump on a stick to get it flat on the bottom. Then we mounted it on a piece of PVC with a switch so you could control it from the tank. Next we put in a check valve so we didnt take showers putting it in the truck bed. Also look at a pump that will fit in the tank holes. If your going to be using it alot I would both a positive and ground wires from the battery and use the welding type plug ins For fast hookups. I HATE OPENING THE LID.

SeanD

12-11-2010, 07:12 AM

Thanks for the answers. It's something for me to think about. If I use collection tanks, it will open a lot of new taps for me in the years ahead.

Sean

Sugarmaker

12-11-2010, 06:52 PM

GM,
I googled Rule bildge pumps and found the model 3700 for $199.
Chris

Chris
Where do you get the Rule brand pumps? I have one landowner that gathers sap with his 4-wheeler and he wants an electric 12v pump. All he and I could find was around 4 gpm max. Some of those were $130
Mark

gmcooper

12-11-2010, 08:55 PM

Thanks Chris

Goggleeye

12-11-2010, 10:33 PM

I found the Rule model 3700 on amazon for just under $160.

Decisions, decisions. I hate to do this, but I'm going to use that four letter word that just may get some feathers ruffled.

Has anyone found a FOOD GRADE :o (sorry, guys) 12V pump that will move more than 5 gallons per minute? I know it's probably not possible to go 100% FG, but I want to make every feasible attempt to get close. You know, if one of these companies would make a food grade 12V high volume pump, they'd make a mint on us.

Mark

Brent

12-11-2010, 11:39 PM

Of course they're food grade.

I've used them in bait boxes and they ate dozens of shrimp and they never got sick.

Sugarmaker

12-12-2010, 02:18 PM

Get a good food grade frosting bucket, maybe two!
Regards,
Chris

Father & Son

12-12-2010, 08:35 PM

I got my Rule pumps on ebay. If you're patient you can get one for a very good price.

Jim

Sugarmaker

12-20-2010, 07:11 PM

I found some pictures of our gathering system that probably are on here some where else too.
These are of the remote RULE 2000 series pump. We have 20 foot hose to pump from road side trees. There is a switch at the pump. Plus a check valve to keep most of the sap in the hose between pumping locations. Under the "screen" area is the RULE 3700 which pumps up into the truck. These pictures are older I replaced the hose with a heavier duty version.

Regards,
Chris

Sugarmaker

01-07-2011, 07:51 PM

Happened to have the camera in the sugar house. Some more up to date shots of the homemade gathering system.
Regards,
Chris

carlsonr

01-10-2011, 09:11 PM

I am looking for a pump to transfer sap up to 150 ft horizontally and 10-15 feet vertically. Any recommendations?

My set up is as follows:
I have two sugar maple groves which I will place a storage container at the downhill side of each. My sugarshack must be uphill (but barely) where a third storage container will be elevated 4 ft. I want to pump sap from grove #1 to grove #2 and ultimately to sugarshack.

And to complicate matters, I am on a student budget! This sugarbush is at a college.

shane hickey

01-10-2011, 09:26 PM

I would think about using a diaphram pump It has some, very little vacume and they can be ran dry they will pump well over a 1/4 mile up hill, no promblem. I use these pumps when the woods is a large downward hill. I hook it to my mainline and put the tank next to the road and let it run all day. The pump that I have is called a number 5 hypo pump hooked to a honda engine

Sugarmaker

01-11-2011, 08:08 PM

College students hungry for some syrup could be the answer to your problem!

I am looking for a pump to transfer sap up to 150 ft horizontally and 10-15 feet vertically. Any recommendations?

My set up is as follows:
I have two sugar maple groves which I will place a storage container at the downhill side of each. My sugarshack must be uphill (but barely) where a third storage container will be elevated 4 ft. I want to pump sap from grove #1 to grove #2 and ultimately to sugarshack.

And to complicate matters, I am on a student budget! This sugarbush is at a college.

Goggleeye

01-27-2011, 10:55 AM

I like that hand pump!!!! thats pretty cool.

Well, I ordered the hand pump. It performs about like it says, and it takes just a couple minutes to empty a barrel. It does take some serious effort, though, as the muscles are burning pretty good after about 10 gallons and I have to switch hands and take a break or two on each drum, but it does the job. I'll post pics of my set-up as I get time.

Mark

Goggleeye

01-27-2011, 11:00 AM

Any thoughts on using a shallow well jet pump to empty the transport totes at the sugar shack? I found this one (http://www.tractorsupply.com/home-improvement/water-pumps/well-pumps/shur-dri-reg-shallow-well-jet-pump-1-2-hp--3123132) at TSC and this one (http://www.lowes.com/pd_43467-15649-PPSWJ50_4294820778+4294821107_4294937087_?productI d=3223661&Ns=p_product_prd_lis_ord_nbr|0||p_product_quantity _sold|1&pl=1&currentURL=%2Fpl_Well%2Bpumps_4294820778%2B4294821 107_4294937087_%3FNs%3Dp_product_prd_lis_ord_nbr|0 ||p_product_quantity_sold|1%26page%3D2&facetInfo=Well%20pumps#) at Lowes. Need to buy a transfer pump today, as I have probably 500 gallons of sap or more to collect and start cooking tonight!

Dill

01-27-2011, 11:10 AM

Just an FYI the cheaper northerntool pump is on sale for 139 http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200380049_200380049
I'm up in the air between that and the TSC 4 stroke for 200.

Goggleeye

01-27-2011, 11:24 AM

Or what about this 12V pump (http://www.tractorsupply.com/home-improvement/water-pumps/utility-pumps/shur-dri-reg-electric-sponge-trade-multi-purpose-pump-12-v-dc-3124900) from TSC? Any thoughts?

MartinP

01-27-2011, 07:55 PM

Here is the one I bought. http://www.waterpumpsdirect.com/quick_search.php

Dill

01-28-2011, 09:52 AM

That site looks pretty good. Same pumps lower prices. Thanks.

Dill

02-09-2011, 10:32 AM

Just wanted to thank you for posting that site again. I did order the mustang/mitsu pump. And it showed up in less than 2 weeks not bad for free shipping. And it was the in original box. I don't know if I would have trusted the site if I just stumbled on it myself.

lastwoodsman

02-09-2011, 10:51 AM

another pump 12 volt-- cheaper than TSC and most likely made in the same plant in China.

http://www.harborfreight.com/12-volt-marine-utility-water-pump-94639.html

Woodsman

MartinP

02-09-2011, 07:27 PM

Last year I used the harbor freight pump that lastwoodsman posted, cut the clamp ends off and crimped and an exension cord plug end to the wires. Wired the other end of the extension cord to the quad battery. Worked ok but you will want to put a shutoff valve on the intake side to keep it primed. Takes a long time to empty 55gal barrels or fill head tank. The little mustang pump even at idle will prime and empty 55 gals in 8 minutes.

lastwoodsman

02-09-2011, 07:31 PM

MartinP
Good to hear how it did or did not work. There are so many options out there.
Thanks for the update
Woodsman

briansickler

02-10-2011, 06:57 AM

My new NorthStar pump from Northern Tool arrives today. It's a 1" pump with the 2 stroke engine. Looks a lot like the Tanaka pump in Bascom's catalog but for 1/2 the price. I see on here that others have purchased these pumps and love them. Thanks for the pointer. What would we do without this site....I know...A lot more trial and error and wasting time and money. It's great learn from others and their experiences.

Brian

michiganfarmer2

02-16-2011, 02:08 PM

Brent

02-16-2011, 02:30 PM

to put a shutoff valve on the intake side to keep it primed. Takes a long time to empty 55gal barrels or fill head tank. The little mustang pump even at idle will prime and empty 55 gals in 8 minutes.

The little Honda pump will fill a 70 gallon tank on our Gator
in 90 seconds. Starts first pull every time ! And in 10 years when you need a part, it will be available.

GramaCindy

10-10-2011, 04:20 PM

I have been researching transfer pumps for transferring my sap from behind sugar house to inside sugar house to supply sap to preheater. How does one go about finding a pump that is not full of oil and will pump sap aprox 10'? MAN this is a toughie!!!:mad:

sk8heaven

10-10-2011, 04:53 PM

http://www.homebrewing.com/transfer-pumps.php
Just a thought - beer makers need food grade pumps to transfer their "wort", not sure how fast you need to transfer, but the second one on this link would do about 3 to 4 gpm (180-240 gph) at 10 feet of head. There are probably more on other brew sites. I am probably going to start with something like this that can pump to my elevated tank from my hauling tank as I get a few more taps.

GramaCindy

10-10-2011, 06:35 PM

red maples

10-11-2011, 09:30 AM

beware though as long as your not moving too much sap 1/25 hp is a little small (I would recomment 1/4 HP). so put in a switch fairly high in the head tank. you can pick them up in the hardware store for pretty cheap $30 and rig them upside down to fill. I rigged mine up with a light so when the pump comes on the the light goes on so I know when it is in use. Check out walrus potable water pumps they are pretty solid very insulated. and I think mine was a little cheaper around $305 ($350 I think with shipping).

lastwoodsman

10-11-2011, 10:30 AM

Cindy
I use one similar to this from Northern tool. It is blue 1/8th hp and they evidently do not carry it on line. Although it is in their stores.
I say similar as the one I have been using was about 40.00, 110 volt. No problems with it for my small operation. I keep a spare on hand..
Takes about 7 minutes to pump out a 30 gallon tank
Woodsman
No problems with it and it pump 25 feet with no problem using a rv food safe hose.

http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/NTESearch?storeId=6970&N=107+4294967182&Ntt=sump pump&D=sump pump&Ntk=All&Ntx=mode+matchallpartial&Dx=mode+matchallpartial

Goggleeye

12-28-2011, 10:58 PM

I've narrowed my sap transfer pump choices down to these two, a Tanaka 2-stroke http://www.amazon.com/Tanaka-TCP-210-Commercial-Gas-Powered-2-Stroke/dp/B0015Z3MHM/ref=lh_ni_t or the Honda Powermate 4-stroke http://www.amazon.com/Powermate-PP0100381-Honda-Engine-Water/dp/B003TV8EHS/ref=pd_luc_sbs_01_02_t_lh. We've always used and liked Honda engines for other purposes - does anyone know how these perform? Also, I was wondering if a 2-stroke would be better because it would be hard to keep a 4-stroke level enough while doing this type of work. Any thoughts? Thanks, Mark