Bender Milk Releaser...Help Please [Archive]

mcmp

11-14-2009, 09:53 PM

While most of you want to go from smaller to larger operations, I want to go from Large to Tiny. Sold all my large equipment, now fabricating my 2x4 evaporator. I took down most of my sap lines, keeping the star performer. All I ever want in the future is 100 taps. From here out, its strictly a hobby operation. I have been in Maple for 60 years, thats enough LOL !

Still wanting to retain vacuum on my lines, a releaser is needed. I have read here that the Bender Milk Receivers will work for a small bush. Well, today in my travels, I stopped at a farm supply and he has a used Bender Milk Receiver. The guy I talked with had no knowledge how it worked, but for $20.00 I grabbed it.

It does not appear to be complete, please refer to the picture. The rubber bottom contains the flapper valve with counter weight outside. The float just goes up and down, nothing is there to be controlled by the float. There is a place for one line to attach to the top of the unit. Also there is a rubber stopper like piece seen in the picture....where does it go.

Any of you Bender users please tell me if something is missing, can you send me a picture of what is missing that the float activates.

How is this Bender Milk Receiver used on a Maple Vacuum system to release the sap and hold vacuum in the lines during release.

Thanks in advance

Paul

KenWP

11-15-2009, 08:01 AM

Man you like old don't you. Dose the rubber gizmo not go for the bottom of the rod on the float. It's a fairly simple operation.

caseyssugarshack93

11-15-2009, 09:02 AM

Go to my youtube site, and check out my milk releaser, mine are the bigger ones but they hook up the same way, You just need two check valves on the inlet and oulet and when it dumps the inlet one closes to keep vac on the system http://www.youtube.com/user/Caseyssugarshack

Dennis H.

11-15-2009, 11:21 AM

Here is pic of the Bender that I will using this year.

I have tha vac coming in at the top. Now Mine has a side port on the bottom that has a flapper style check valve that is where the sap comes in from the bush. And I made a flapper valve for the bottom port.

I wasn't sure how the whole thing would work because when I put a small amount of vac on it, it just seemed like it was leaking everywhere. But once I put 15" of vac on it it works great.

mcmp

11-15-2009, 12:25 PM

Thanks Guys;

Something is different with my Bender. I only have 1 inlet at the top and a straight dump with a flapper valve on the bottom. There is nothing inside for the float to move. The float just rides up and down.
The top inlet open to the inside of the chamber. I cant look at the U Tube as I am on a 24.4K dial up. I would guess that the top inlet is for liquid, where does the vacuum attach, no other ports on the bender ?

Paul

caseyssugarshack93

11-15-2009, 12:37 PM

the top port is for the vac that the bracket has on is a peace if thread pipe that the vac hooks to and you should have a inlet pipe on the top to for sap if should be like a 1/2 nipple. on the side of the top

Dennis H.

11-15-2009, 05:09 PM

The float rides up freely until it hits the cotter pin thing then it lifts the entire rod assembly just enough to dump the vac from the Bender.

The treaded thing on the top should be where the vac comes into the Bender, it should be hollow.

Can up post another pic of the bottom. Does it just have a 1" port out or what, ca'n't tell from the pic.

My other Bender which is older doesn't have the bottom side port so both the incoming sap and out going sap must come in the same port. See the attached pic. ignore the note on the top where it says sap in. I now have it all coming and going from the bottom 1" port.

brookledge

11-15-2009, 06:19 PM

Paul
Go to a site where you can get broadband and look at all the pics that those who use them have put up on the site. Once you see them you will totally understand.
As for yours it looks like it has been modified and you are missing componants that you will need. Yours seems to only have the vac conection on the top
Keith

mcmp

11-15-2009, 07:36 PM

Thanks for the help, Mystery is solved ! Casseyssugarshack and Dennis H provided the key to the puzzle. The Vacuum attaches tot he top of the threaded rod on top of the bracket.

Referring to the picture;

The loose rubber bushing that I questioned is shaped to fit on the top of the Bender. The main rod comes thru the top of the bender, thru the rubber grommet and little spring. Near the top of the main rod is a small hole that is normally blocked until the float is fully lifted by liquid. When the float is fully lifted, it pushes the rod against the spring and just lifts enough to expose the small hole in the rod. This in turn breaks the vacuum. Then the weight of the liquid makes the bottom flapper swing open, dumping the liquid. The counter balance assists in the flapper closing, the rod has dropped and the relief hole is closed now allowing vacuum to again cycle the process. Very primitive, but no question it will work.

However, I cant see it working well at all for my use. The one mainline I am keeping is 1.0" x 850 feet long with 5/16" laterals. The vacuum port on the Bender is .125". I will be old and gray before it will ever pump down 850 feet of 1" plus laterals, with vacuum running thru a .125" port. Wait a minute, I am old and gray ha ha ha. However, this very simple design gives me ideas how to now make a larger version that will handle the vacuum CFM I desire. A nice 1.0" check valve on the main line at the releaser and i am good to go. So all is not lost.

Many thanks to all who answered my question. I have been here for many years, I just dont post much.

Paul

caseyssugarshack93

11-15-2009, 07:42 PM

you have a nice bender, Yours has a big flapper on the bottom,= will dump alot faster which means more taps

Dennis H.

11-15-2009, 08:52 PM

Thanks for posting another pic.

I see there is no way to attach anything to the bottom, but boy will that thing dump fast.

With yours I would hook vac only to the top fitting and hook up the sap line to the small metal side port on the side of the top. It should work the same as that was the way I was orginally going to do mine.

You don't want sap coming in from the top fitting though.

So I would have a small manifold thingy right before the Bender so the sap can be seperated from the mainline so the sap has it's own lne to the Bender.

mcmp

11-15-2009, 08:59 PM

Thanks Dennis;
Good idea. Yes, whoosh and she is dumped. I am going to copy the Bender and fab one with 6" Schedule 60 Plastic pipe. Building is half the fun.

Paul

lpakiz

11-15-2009, 09:10 PM

Dennis H.

Where did you get the red end-pieces you used in contructing your manifold?? I would like to addd something like that to the sap side of the releaser to store vacuum while the Bender dumps
THANKS!

NH Maplemaker

11-16-2009, 08:18 AM

Haynes Forest Products

11-16-2009, 08:28 AM

Home Depot They are on the top rack 1/2 way down the plumbing isle in the ABS section on your left.........Will there be anything else I can help you with:o

mcmp

11-16-2009, 07:23 PM

MCMP, If you could would you take some picture as you build your releaser? I need to build one for a small bush I have and there isn't much on building a small releaser any were on here! I think it would be a great addition to the vacuum section here.! Jim L.

Jim;
Sure I can do pictures. My system will be ready for 2011 sugar season.
I have to finish a truck I am building this winter. Then I concentrate full time on my maple project. I have my evaporator pan complete, this summer to build the arch and releaser. Then I am good to go.

Paul

Dennis H.

11-16-2009, 08:07 PM

Paul I got the those red end caps at either Home Depot or Lowes.
They are called Test Plugs. They are used to close off the plumbing system in your home or whatever when it is being built so it can be pressurized to find any leaks.

They make them for just about any size PVC pipe. There is a metal version with a flip type lever but I didn't want to worry about rust so I got the plastic one. If I remember it cost around $5 per cap.

mcmp

11-16-2009, 08:52 PM

NH Maplemaker

11-17-2009, 06:29 AM

Thanks Paul, That would be grate. I located a large bender yesterday. Now all I got to do is get there before some else gets it! Jim L.

Dennis H.

11-22-2009, 03:40 PM

Here is a pic of the Bender that I am going to use. This one I had to get an external check valve for the sap coming into the releaser, it is down there on the left.
It doesn't have any trouble getting the sap up into the jar and float.

In this pic I do not have the dump flapper valve on, I am going to run a length of 1" pipe over to the opening in my tank and 90 it down into the tank and there I will put the flapper dump valve.

caseyssugarshack93

11-22-2009, 04:36 PM

How does it work? are you going to have the sap come in from the top too, or just the bottom

Dennis H.

11-23-2009, 08:47 AM

It seems to work good. I used the idea of the booster thing with wet/dry lines where a mainline goes out, 2" sweep T with reducers.
So the sap comes in the center of the T and "Falls" down the check valve.
I needed vac over there for the Bender so I figured that it wouldn't hurt hooking it up like a Wet/Dry setup.
The small clear tube is just for Vac to the Bender.

It is kind of cool watching the sap come in the bottom filling the jar.

NH Maplemaker

11-23-2009, 10:48 AM

Dennis, I guess I don't under stand why on a good sap day, when your releaser is dumping and sap is still comming into your elbow and down to the closed check valve why vacuum isn't pulling sap back to the vacuum pump? JimL.

caseyssugarshack93

11-23-2009, 04:39 PM

If i where you depending on how many taps ur going o have on that releaser i would of just had in come in the top, would of been easiers but if you have tested it already and made sure i works he way you have i hooked up then i guess that works too,

Dennis H.

11-23-2009, 05:01 PM

Hey everything is open for improvements right.:lol:

Since it will be my 1st year on vac I am not sure what a "good" day will be like.

If you all think that that T will be a problem for me I may just remove it, I could cap the bottom and side and use it as a mini vac booster for this Bender.

caseyssugarshack93

11-23-2009, 05:48 PM

id try out the system first and make sure the the sap/water woudnt get sucked up into the vac line and to see if the system works good, If not then maybe improve the system with whats wrong if anything or just run it in the top port,

NH Maplemaker

11-23-2009, 06:42 PM

Dennis, I like the elbow set up ! A place to hold a little extra sap and build a little vacuum. But I think you may haft to put a plug on top side of elbow and just have the vac come in to the top of the bender. I may be wrong, But vac will want to pull sap back to the pump! Do you have a moisture trap at the pump? If not, not bad idea! You can make one very easy. JimL.

Dennis H.

11-23-2009, 07:59 PM

The vac pump has a huge moisture/dirt trap. It is about 5-6 gal tank that has a flapper style drain in the bottom, very sweet! So once the vac shuts down it auto dumps any liquid.

You guys made me a little paranoid so I might make a few changes to the setup of my Bender.

Sorry Paul for sort of taking over your posting.

mcmp

11-23-2009, 08:09 PM

lpakiz

11-23-2009, 09:54 PM

Gentlemen,
The reason the sap doesn't get to the vacuum pump is that when the Bender dumps, the float-rod is sucked up and HELD to the underside of the vacuum fitting, thus shutting off the vacuum until the float drops to reset the whole process. When the sap level falls far enough that the float itself is pulling the rod down, the float and rod pull away from the vacuum fitting, re-introducing vacuum to the jar.

NH Maplemaker

11-23-2009, 10:23 PM

Larry, I understand that and you are right! But if you look at Dennis last picture of the bender releaser. When the vac is shut off to the bender releaser ,vacuum is still pulling on his pvc elbow which sap is still coming into. At that point there is no place for the sap to go but back to his Vacuum pump! That is why I said he needs to seperate the sap line and the vacuum and just have the vac hooked to the bender releaser.Jim L.

lpakiz

11-24-2009, 09:06 PM

Yes, Jim, I think he needs to disconnect that "jumper line" (??) and have vacuum running only to the releaser jar via it's top fitting. The releaser will, in turn, supply the vac for the tubing system.

Dennis H.

11-25-2009, 06:12 PM

I did as you all mentioned I seperated the vac from the sap line. I basically took out the "T" and just ran the black sap line down to the clear check valve and at the top for the vac I put in a 90 and a threaded bushing for the hose that supplies vac to the top of the Bender.

I will try and get an updated pic to post.

Like I said I am open to all new ideas.

NH Maplemaker

11-25-2009, 08:17 PM

Sounds good Dennis! Can't wait to see the pictures.Jim L.

Dennis H.

11-28-2009, 01:43 PM

Here is 2 pics of the new setup without the "T"
The second also shows the pipe going into the milk tank, that is where the flapper valve is located. I used an aluminum cake pan as a cover for the opening in the tank.

NH Maplemaker

11-28-2009, 06:08 PM

Dennis, Nice job! I can't see any reason why that shouldn't work perfectly. I like the cake pan idea! Jim L.

lpakiz

11-28-2009, 09:32 PM

Yep, now it looks like it will work. Neat installation too!!

farmall h

01-16-2010, 05:51 PM

Dennis, keep me in mind if you ever need another jar. I have a spare. The glass nipple on the bottom is a little chipped but still functional.

500592

01-22-2012, 06:00 PM

I know this is an old thread but I have a few questions 1st I have this same bender how many taps is it good for 2nd I have another releaser that needed a bracket and I found one it has the same vac thing as this one does but I think it is made for it but I don't have the rubber thing can I make one buy one or what can I do thanks

500592

01-23-2012, 02:29 PM

Just a bump

500592

01-23-2012, 06:31 PM

okay all i am missing is the rubber bushing does anyone have info on the rubber bushing thanks

Shepp

02-08-2012, 10:17 PM

Hello Dennis: I just purchased one of these Bender milk releasers on the internet. I was just looking at mine and where the threaded plastic bushing for the vac hose clamps down on the top of the Bender there is just a black plastic cap. Doesn't seem to me it would make a good seal with out some sort of rubber gasket or bushing here?
JIm

Dennis H.

02-09-2012, 04:30 AM

That is the way it is supposed to be.
When the Benders are working there will always be a very slight vac leak at the top.
It needs this vac leak so as that when the releaser is dumping the weight of the float and stuff on the rod can overcome the vacuum grab strength of the top of the float rod.

This is where problems may creep up when it is running. I have found that on wet cold days the releaser can ice up. Even if the outside temps are above freezing, like 34-35, the velocity of the air being sucked in thur the top cap can cause it to ice up and eventually cause the float rod to hang up when it dumps.
The solution that I have found is have a cover over the releaser, like a roof. If you can keep it out of the weather it would be alot better.