building an auto-drawoff

[syrupkid]

i was wondering has anyone tried to build an auto-drawoff it seems it would be fairly easy all one would need is a little bit of stainless tubing a high temp liquid thermostat and a power on silinoid valve and a little bit of know how. thanks for any imput

Joel

[Dennis H.]

It does look very easy to build.
The digital controller is an off-the-shelf item that you can get at Granger, MSC or McMaster Carr. They also carry the probes that you would use.

The only thing that I have had trouble myself finding is what type of valve that most manufactures use in there auto drawoffs. Are they fast acting or slow acting? And also getting one that will handle the temps that syrup is when you draw off.

I also will be keeping an eye on this thread to see if anyone knows about the valve.

[Grade "A"]

I made one works great, I have less than $200 into mine. I use a low pressure solenoid valve, max temp is 180 degree but it worked fine for me. I do have a gate valve in front of it to control the flow of syrup.

I used a Auber SYL-2362 1/16 temperature controller from ebay. I made sure my controller had a on/off output option not just a pid output. Setting a pid for sugaring is tricky to do, with a on/off output you can set the temp and that is what it opens and closes at (or you can set the open at one temp and close at a different temp). I also have an alarm set up to the controller so if the syrup temp is too high the alarm goes off, I can also hook the other alarm up to my oil burner to shut it down if the temp is to high.

I use a Pt100 RTD sensors for the syrup temp, it is accurate to the 10th of a degree. So I draw off at 7.2 degrees above boiling point of water and close the valve at 7.0 degrees.

I still keep an eye on the rig but you can talk to people or go outside for a sec feeling alittle safer.

[Grade "A"]

Here's a link to the controller I have
http://cgi.ebay.com/1-16-DIN-UNIVERSAL-PID-TEMPERATURE-CONTROLLER_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trkparmsZ65Q3a12Q7c6 6Q3a2Q7c39Q3a1Q7c72Q3a1205Q7c240Q3a1318Q7c301Q3a0Q 7c293Q3a1Q7c294Q3a50QQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQha shZitem2ea60da16dQQitemZ200354406765QQptZLHQ5fDefa ultDomainQ5f0QQsalenotsupported

Here's the valve
http://cgi.ebay.com/Electric-Solenoid-Valve-1-110VAC-Water-Diesel-B21N_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trkparmsZ65Q3a12Q7c66Q3a2Q 7c39Q3a1Q7c72Q3a1205Q7c240Q3a1318Q7c301Q3a1Q7c293Q 3a1Q7c294Q3a50QQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZite m45ec67f2b8QQitemZ300318978744QQptZLHQ5fDefaultDom ainQ5f0QQsalenotsupported

[Haynes Forest Products]

I have a couple of Watlow programable controllers that I got out of scrap equipment. I set one up just to moniter the sap and it only showed 1 degree increments and was told for drawing off you want 10ths of a degree increments.

[Grade "A"]

The controller I have will show to the 10th of a degree, but only if you use a pt100 thermocouple. I have it set so it opens and closes the valve within 2/10 of a degree.

[NH Maplemaker]

I didn't build my own draw off, But I did buy one for this last season and loved it ! As Grade "A" said there is a lot less stress while boiling with people talking and getting in the way while trying to draw off syrup. The solenoid on mine is a 1" valve slow acting.
On a another note. The small solenoids on e-bay are what I have been looking for to build a electric draw off on my syrup canner! But the foot controls switch are 12 volt, but no 110 volt ! Does anyone know of a 110 volt foot control switch ? Back to the draw off, diffitnetly a plus ! Jim L.

[Haynes Forest Products]

Granger has them They are nice cast iron units. You say all you can find is 12 volt that doesnt sound right all the foot pedal does is a NOS (normally open switch) that can handle any voltage. I use them for blacksmithing air hammers. Stepping on the switch closes the contacts and energize what ever you hook too. They even do 220 all that is is the same pedal with 2 switches in it.

[3rdgen.maple]

How do you guys order from granger? The only way I can get parts from them was I had to setup an account with my business tax id number? Have they changed something?

[Haynes Forest Products]

I showed that I owned a buisness No tax id just a checking and buisness card. Looks like alot of us are using Granger.

[twobears1224]

my local tractor supply store also handles grainger.you just go to the service desk and tell them you wanta order from grainger.

delbert

[NH Maplemaker]

Here in New Hampshire if you are a NH. Farm Bureau member you get a Grainger card and a discount ! Maybe other Farm Bureau's have that as well .Jim L.

[syrupkid]

thanks for the help

[Dan W]

Grade A, Am I right in thinking that there are really only 3 major components to your draw-off? The controller, the temperature probe, and the solonoid valve? Do you need a relay to energize the valve or does it come right from the controller? If that is all there is then a housing of some sort, some wiring, and piping should make it happen right or am I over simplifying it? Sounds like the way to go over the thermometer and hydrometer way. Dan

[Grade "A"]

Dan, With the controller I have You don't need an extra relay. You can set up the controller so it will use one of the alarm relay outputs to run the valve, then you will have one alarm output left if you need it. I used a solid state relay (ssr) to run my valve only because I wanted 2 alarm outputs, one for a alarm and the other to shut down my oil burner if things got crazy. So to answer your question what you listed is realy all there is. I still use a hydrometer to test the syrup once in a while, the draw-off temp. can change as the day goes on.

[Dan W]

Thamks Matt, Looks like I know what I am asking Santa to bring!!

[Dan W]

Well I worked a little overtime the past few weeks and put together an auto draw-off. Once the new sugar house gets here (early September) I will figure out how to post pics of the progress. Right now the whole syrup operation is scattered throughout the garage, the basement, and a shed. I really can't wait to get all of it set up and organized.