Whats the difference?

[labman]

Can anyone tell me the difference in an Intens-O-Fire an Inferno and the Hurricane force 5 arches ?

[brookledge]

For one they are trade names each one is made by a different company. The intensofire is made by CDL (i think), the inferno is made by leader and the force 5 by Lapierre. The force 5 is the newest one on the block and sounds like it offers the best efficiency but it cost more to buy. Otherwise they all have air over fire injection to increase the combustion.
Keith

[labman]

yeah I knew they were different brands I was wondering if anyone knew if there was really any difference in the force 5 besides the higher price and I think a force 5 for my 3x12 goes for about 16000 anyone know how much the other 2 cost just looking for an estimate I'm not sure if I can afford it or not Thanks

[dschultz]

There's a video on this thread about the force 5. I don't know what size it is but it only does 2.5 to 3 gallons a minute.It looks like a 4 by 14 I have a Intens-o-fire that size and get 5 gallons plus per minute

[maplekid]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qrhomMbyixs
they use gassification in the force 5. makes the fire swirl

[red maples]

I watched those clips very scientific approach, but they have been using that in wood stoves (I think they called it an afterburner for one of the brands) for years for better emitions less carbon and creasote.
and uses less wood etc. wonder why it took this long for it to transfer to the maple industry. I guess it is more of a demand for green technology and the separation from the oil and gass fired rigs. and less of a carbon foot print.

[802maple]

The 3 differences are as follows.

The Leader Inferno is the least efficient but not necessarilly any slower in the evaporation process. It does have over the fire air but it is at a minimal rate as it only comes in throught the door and front frame. It depends mostly on the bottom thru the grates air.

The intens-o-fire which mostly as I invented it, does have more over the top air and it is more efficient than the Inferno.

The Force 5 has the most air over the fire with a higher pressure blower which atleast in the early stages is proving to be more efficeint teh both of the others.

[Rhino]

802 maple, is there just one row of "air holes" on each side of these high output arches? I read somewhere that you space them about 6 inches apart and have them at a 10 degree angle. also, what diameter pipe are these air holes. do all these models have air blowing from the doors also or just the bottom and over the fire. thinking about hot rodding my wood arch. thanks

[802maple]

There are 3 rows on a intens-o-fire at the back pointed forward, Top row down at 10 degrees or there abouts middle row at 5 degrees down and bottom row straight forward at 3 inches apart and I make them out of 3/8ths black iron pipe protected by blanket insulation. The front has air in the door and around the door frame.

[Rhino]

802maple, could you describe what i would see if i was to open the fire doors on a intense o fire arch? the 3 pipes that point forward, where do they exactly run? also along the sides what would i see, Im redoing my firebrick this summer so i know i will have to drill holes in the brick for the air pipes to stick through, but what tier of brick should i drill? very top?, 2nd from top? thanks for any advice.

[Amber Gold]

Rhino, look at Breezy lanes photos. Pretty sure his arch is an intenso-fire as designed by Jerry (802Maple). His photos show you how to lay out the pipes.

[dschultz]

Rhino,I have an intens-o-fire 4x14 and I'm not that far from you about 1 and a half hrs.If you'd like to see it your more than welcome to come take a look Danny

[Rhino]

looked at breezy lanes photos, i see on his there are no over the fire pipes running along the sides of his arch. is that something the hurricane 5 has that the intense o fire arch dos'nt? Also one little glitch i see i have. these arches with the behind the fire air pipes are for raised flues, i have drop flues. guess i will make mine just in front and lower then my flue pan. Dan, thanks for the offer, what town are you in? also what kind of performance do you see with your arch. do you go through less wood? fire up less? use bigger chunks of wood? also what kind of air pump/fan do you use? thanks

[dschultz]

Rhino, I live in Neillsville 25 miles north of Black River.It does 300 gph plus. I can fill a 55 gallon drum in 5 to 6 hrs when things are going good.As far as wood I go through a stove cord every hr and I fire every 5 minutes about a wheelborrow full.It does take bigger wood but it performs better if you split it.I split anything bigger than 6 inches in diameter.As for air there's a squirrel cage fan and there's also 3 dampers on it you control with levers for each one

[802maple]

Rhino. you need to have the firebox back at 2/3rds the length of your pans raised or drop flue.

Yes the Force 5 is the only one with side air, to do that you need serious pressure. That is a idea that I have been considering but I sat on my butt to long and they beat me to it.

[802maple]

What size arch do you have and also go take a look at dshultzs arch before you do a thing. To many people on here try to put air in their arch and don't do it right or try to cut corners. especially along the lines of restricting air flow so all they end up with is lazy air and that will do nothing, believe me. Take alot of notes as to how the air transfer is done and take measurements. If you copy what you see you will be happy otherwise you might have a long season.

[lpakiz]

Danny, I would love to see your arch and the air holes. I am a bit west of Greenwood. I found you in the phone book-are you near the green-house on Panther Creek Road??
Larry

[dschultz]

Larry, your welcome to come see my setup just give me a call.I live west of the greenhouse on Panther Creek 1 mile off 73.
Danny

[Rhino]

802maple, I have a 5'X18' stainless steel arch. i have forced air under the grates and instead of a smoke stack we use a industrial sized induction blower. going to a bigger one next year to try to get a little more draw. figured as long as im doing arch work, might as well experiment with more forced air. If I get some free time I will try to go by Dan and see how the intense o fire is set up. I do plan on running air pipes across both sides also. should be a interesting project.thanks for your input.

[3rdgen.maple]

Wouldn't that induction blower suck the heat out of the arch faster instead of the pans getting the full potential out of the heat. You got me curious as how that setup works.

[lpakiz]

Danny,
You can bet I will be calling one of these days...
THANKS!!
Larry

[dschultz]

Larry
Your welcome
Danny

[Bucket Head]

Hi Guys,

I was very interested in the air-over-fire idea when I first heard of it. I asked many questions about it a few months back. Jerry, and others, had a lot to say about it.

Since then, I've seen some pictures, heard opinions, and tonight watched the video on You-Tube of the "swirling" effect that was posted. It looks impressive.

Now here's the question I, and probably others here too are wondering. Which tube set-up should we shoot for? The air in the back only? Air in the back and in the front? Air only on the sides? Or air around the whole fire box? One, two, or three rows of injectors? I've seen photos or diagrams of various styles of all the ones I just listed.

If a guy was going to attack his arch tommorow with torches or a plasm-cutter and his welder, which style would give the most bang for the buck?

I have modified my arch many times over the years, and have been pleased with my efforts. I am willing to cut it up again for this injection system. However, I would love to be able to say that this will be the last "major" retro-fit. I want to do this sort of modification only once. I just need some advice on what style of injection I should start "modifying" for.

What do you guys think? Which one is the better set-up?

And just so I'm clear on it, the one in the Lappierre video has all the air coming in from the back, nowhere else?

Steve

[802maple]

I at onetime thought my intens-o-fire was the best thing out there, but after watching the Force 5, I must say i need to go to the drawing board. My evaporation rate is as good or better but that thing is on a diet as far as wood consumption goes. It has air all around the fire, but the secret is the amount of pressure it is producing with equalized dispersile. I wanted to kick the tires and get under the hood to see what makes it tick, but they wern't to receptive to that. I wouldn't mind a invite to one of the sugarmakers that has bought one to look it over though. I can bet that the air transfer is not restricted in any way, the way it developes pressure. It is not volume, it is pressure that is creating the swirling effect, were it volume they would not have been able to film it with the door open as it would have blown the fire out the front.

[Rhino]

3rdgen.maple, I think there would be a point where you could suck to much air through the arch with these blowers. With our long arch and the blower we have right now we just cant seem to stretch the flame/heat all the way back. I'm sure you put our induction fan on a 12' arch or smaller you probably would have issues. If you want to see pictures, click on members list and go to Russ.(thats my brother). theres a couple of pictures of it. I know of one guy who uses a large blower to handle both his 6X16's. He has them T'd in together.

[Rhino]

802maple, would you then think that the hurricane arch maybe has smaller diameter air pipes inside the arch? maybe smaller but more of them???? Might have to wait on my project until someone goes undercover and unlocks the secret.

[Mark]

802maple, I have a 5'X18' stainless steel arch. i have forced air under the grates and instead of a smoke stack we use a industrial sized induction blower. going to a bigger one next year to try to get a little more draw. figured as long as im doing arch work, might as well experiment with more forced air. If I get some free time I will try to go by Dan and see how the intense o fire is set up. I do plan on running air pipes across both sides also. should be a interesting project.thanks for your input.

Could you tell me what induction blower that you are using?
I am using a Wing Draft Inducer now and am thinking of going to a Quickdraft.

[Rhino]

Mark, the blower we are running is a porter, dont know the model number but it has about 12 fins/paddles. we run a 1.5 horse on it. thought we could increase the output last spring with pulley modifacations but we kept blowing out the reset on it. could of went with a 2 horse or bigger motor but a buddy found us a bigger one so we will just swap it out this year. The blower sits on top of our building, from our base stack we have two, 50 gal. metal drums to get out of the building, then it has a 90 degree 16 inch elbow pipe that goes into the blower. When we start up the blower you can take dry leaves and hold them by the door and it will suck them right out of your hand.

[3rdgen.maple]

Thanks Rhino I have never seen a setup like that, Im heading over to the pictures next.

[802maple]

I don't think there are anymore and they are smaller. They looked to be made out of 1/4 inch pipe. With a full fire I couldn't stick my head in there to count or measure. haha

802maple, would you then think that the hurricane arch maybe has smaller diameter air pipes inside the arch? maybe smaller but more of them???? Might have to wait on my project until someone goes undercover and unlocks the secret.

[Rhino]

802maple, you must of seen one of these at a demo, what did they use as a blower to get pressurized air through the pipes? To bad you could'nt of seen more inside the arch that day. a 5 gal. bucket of water would of cooled it down a bit. they probably would of gave you a dirty look though. ha ha ha

[802maple]

I didn't get to see it, it was under armed guard haha

[220 maple]

Tuesday I dropped in on my trusty old equipment dealer. He told me that they (Being Leader) was testing the improvements on their wood fired arch that very day, he didn't go but they wanted him there. He also told me that someone in the Somerset County area has already ordered a Force 5, $16000 dollars worth, leader told him theirs would probably come in at $11000 dollars. He feels Leader will sell more units because of the price difference

Mark220 Maple

[dschultz]

What size is the Force 5 for $16,000?