Overload Protection on CDL RO

[ennismaple]

My CDL 600 GPH RO keeps tripping on Overload Protection - like 10-20 times a day! It's a royal pain to open the front cover and re-set the bottom right breaker that many times when you're trying to do a million other things. Anyone know what could be causing this? I was thinking that the breaker may have gotten weak and needs to be replaced. Anyone got some advice for me?

[firetech]

Yes as these devices are "exercized" more the weaker they become. You should look at replaceing the overload unit and also looking for the cause of the problem. Loose contacts in the contoller or in the feed lines , check for voltage drop as many of you are running some distances to the sugar house. These are the easy problems to look for. But first get an amp reading while in operation and see if it is with in 10% of name plate and get voltage readings when not operating and while in full operation. If this is not fixed the problem will only get worse and fail at the most unopertune time. Heat and time are electrical equipments worst problem.

[wglenmapler]

I have the same problem with mine. The power company came in this year because I kept tripping the breaker up on the transformer and they figured out that the 30+ year old 60 amp service wire wasn't going to cut it on a 200amp service. The voltage was only 104/leg.

Now I have a bit less trouble-but I'm tripping that load unit everyday at least once.

[ennismaple]

UPDATE - Got a call from my brother at 3:00 p.m. this afternoon. The overload protection breaker had tripped again and wouldn't reset. Tanks were full everywhere but we couldn't concentrate!!! Got on the horn to CDL in Quebec and they said either the turbine (high pressure) pump was overloading the breaker or the breaker was done. Got an electrician there by 3:30 and they confirmed the turbine pump was only drawing 23 amps (overload trips at 25) so the pump is fine. The tech from CDL talked my electricians through how to by-pass the overload protection. It took them a while but they figured it out. I'm a bit concerned about by-passing the internal breaker but the guy from CDL said it's a redundant breaker and if the pump is OK it'll be fine. I should get a replacement by courier tomorrow or Saturday. In the meantime we need to keep the steam flying or we'll never see the bottom of the tanks again!

[Jerome]

what size wire do you have going to the RO and how long is the run?

[firetech]

Great that you have bypassed the overloads but you really need to diagnose the problem. Hopefully the quailifed electrican is coming back out to replace the overload unit. Is the unit tripping on motor start-up or a period of time running and did the elctrician take the amp reading under full load or just running? Did you discuss maybe a voltage drop problem? Loose concetion in the service? Is the controller a varible drive unit or standard motor contoller?

[firetech]

Dang buttons I don't think your out of the woods yet on this issue and it may get worse. Keep looking for the overload problem.

[ennismaple]

My cousin`s house feeds power to the sugar camp. It`s a 60 amp service that runs maybe 50 yards. Dad was an electrician and ran his own business for 25 years so I`m confident the conductors are properly sized. The RO is maybe 20 feet from the breaker panel.

The unit is tripping once it runs for a while

I`ll defintely get someone to diagnose and fix the problem ASAP.

[maplecrest]

low voltage is your problem need at least 100 amps at the r/o room

[Brian]

I had some power problems with the RO, the over load tripping ect then one night the lights went out on a 200 amp entrance. The main fuse on the pole went so the power co came out and fixed the fuse and checked the load of the motors and pumps that were running and decided the 5k transformer was not big enough and came back the next morning with a 25k transformer things work much better, the lights don't dim any more!!

[sapman]

I've also been having an issue with my power feed. The RO works fine, but with everything combined I think I'm pushing 57-58 amps or so. I've only got #6 copper (40'~) feeding the sugarhouse, on a 60 amp breaker, and the breaker heats up after hours of use. The wire never heats up anywhere, just the breaker. I'm assuming #6 carries 70~ amps? Any electricians on here?

I plan to run 100 amp after the season from my pedestal, but am considering just putting in a bigger breaker for now.

Tim

[802maple]

Hi Tim

I am not an electrician and I am sure if there is one on here they will set me straight. I think depending on how far your line is running you could be loosing as much as 20 percent of your amp's. I was always under the belief that if say you had a 200 amp service that you had 200 available amps to use. We had just that in our sugarhouse and we were using 190 amps and everything was always tripping when we were fully operational. We had the power company come and test and they told us that in reality we only could use around 160 amps at a given time on that entrance and we needed a bigger entrance. We went to 400 and everything ran cool and we didn't have anymore problems

[firetech]

When reading the NEC 70 there are several ways of doing things kinda. If you refer to 310.16 it gives you ampacity of wire per size and make. If you refer to artical 230 if gives you the requirements for a service. service sizing is done on the demand of the loads at the location of use. I bet ten years ago no one was thinking RO when they ran power to the sugar house. When setting demand you have to round up to the next availbe breaker size artical 250. Looking in the Leader cataloge there is an amp draw chart for their ROs and all of they put some serious load on the service because they run more than 3 hours at atime so they must be calcutaled at 100% in the service load. Some other rules of thumb when doing voltage drop the first 100 ft are from 310.16 then after the 100 hundred up go up one wire size. Watt is a watt if it is 120 or 240 the only diference is in the wire size. Aluiminum wire is good be requires some attention, the connection must have anti oxidizing paste on them and do not over tighten the conections use a torque measering device to get it right. If your soil is rocky run conduit or buy some sand to set your service conductors in. If it is over head only splice at the start and finnish no extra joints. Giving advice over the internet sucks because no two prblems are the same no two installations are the same and you never no how much "help" has allready been done. Sometime its good money spent to get a qualified electrican to come out and help you set up a service pay the man for a service call. It will save you tons of cash and flustration in the long run. Thanks for listening I'm a master electrican/contractors license, past IBEW memeber and NICET certifed in fire alarm systems

[maplecrest]

right after i wrote that you need 100 amps to your r/o room. i heard my r/o stop. have a baby monitor in r/o room so i can hear what it is doing.when i got there the yellow light was on. first time this year. called my electrician he can said i had 125 amps to machine. called nick a maple pro. he told me i was not running enough pressure should be no lower than 425 for the pumps will heat up.was runnig at 375. after running 425 machine run 13 hours straight no problems. when i was setting in a maple pro open house r/o presentation told nick they need more in the operation manual. how was i to now that you needed to pound that machine that hard. not in the booklet. i think that if those guys took notes from every phone call they get and condensed it they would help us and them selves by writing a better trouble shooting and correct operation manual.

[sapman]

Maybe I'll overwire the shack this summer with 200 amp cable just in case, so I'll have the option to just change the panel if my needs keep growing. I'm sure 100 amp would be enough, but like you guys said, should probably figure for some loss to be on the safe side.

Thanks,
Tim

[sapman]

Well it finally dawned on me today that I've been leaving the water heater on while doing everything else in the sugarhouse. Last year I turned it off when using the RO. So adding that in probably put me somewhere around 70 amps. No wonder the 60 amp breaker has been complaining! Still going to change things for next year, though.

Tim