lead soldered pans

[nas]

Hi All

I have a 3x12 arch in my sugar shack with lead soldered tin pans. I am wondering if it is possible to re-solder the pans to make them lead free, in an economical way or if I would be better off to get new pans made. If I were to get new pans made, what size should the finishing pan be if I have a single reversible flow pan made.

Thanks
Nick

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

I would think it would be close to impossible to resolder the entire pans and not worth the cost involved. As far as size, I would go with at least an 8 foot flue pan unless you can get someone to make you a 9' flue pan.

[PerryW]

I would get your syrup tested for lead to see if you have a problem. WHen they offered the free lead testing in NH several years ago, I think I remember many producers with very low lead levels even with soldered english tin pans. I think one theory was that the nitre builds up on the solder and essentially reduces any lead transfer to the sap.

[brookledge]

I agree that I have the syrup tested first. Also don't do any acid washes or major scrubing to the solder. That will help you keep the lead down.
Another big contributer is contact time. when you leave the sap sitting in the pans between boils or if there was a few days with out any sap the chances are the sap in the pan will have a higher lead content than some that was only in the pans for a few hours
Keith

[argohauler]

I see you're in Milton. Don't let OMAFRA or the CFIA in to check you out. I had a 3 x 12 Small Bros. evaporator with lead soldered stainless pans. Ontario's lead limit is .5 PPM. I failed 3 years in a row and had a lot of syrup put in detention and eventually dumped out. I tried not cleaning the pans with vinegar/rotten sap, didn't work. I got a new syrup pan, didn't work.

In Ontario the CFIA wants you to have nothing but stainless for boiling. No copper, brass, tin, galvanized, or lead solder.

I got a 3x3 finishing pan with 4 dividers, going length ways with the evaporator, made by D & G. It was $900 in 04.

I got a 3 x 9 boiling pan with 7" flues and 2 sections, made by Darveau in 06 for $4400.

A 3 foot finisher is all you need. And the evaporator is reversible. I'm getting 80 Imperial GPH with it right now.

The Ontario Farmer newspaper is good for used syrup equipment, usually in the winter months.

[nas]

Thanks for the replies guys. I think I will have to have new pans made. I have a friend that can weld some for me, and I think I will just go with flat bottomed pans for now. The budget will not allow for $5000 flue pans right now. I would like to do about 300 taps next season. I will start saving my pennies.:) Any suggestions for how to divide the pans?

Nick

[Haynes Forest Products]

I have (2) 36X18 divided finish pans SS only set on fire once I will be selling. They look great from the outside and you can bead blast clean and not hurt them. If little round rubber mallet marks in the bottoms dont bother you give me a jingle. They are LaPierre Waterloo Small and getting smaller.

[KenWP]

Mail me one Haynes I would use one as a flue pan. Has to be better then what I don't have now.

[nas]

Argohauler
How is CFIA for old Galv. sap storage tanks? I have 6 old 200gal stock tanks in the sugar shack and am wondering if I can use them, or if I need new tanks.
Haynes, I may be interested but I am going to price new ones first.

Nick

[argohauler]

Weeeellll....I had a nice 300 gal. galv. upright round tank, but it was lead soldered together. Sap stored in it kept better than the stainless bulk tanks. I also lost use of a 400 gal. galv. stock tank that was darn near a 100 years old.

If your stock tanks are soldered, chances are they're leaded.

When your friendly neighbourhood CFIA came out, they wanted see my sap shanty. I didn't like the idea of that at all. So I made them walk back to the shanty, about 600 yards from the road. Well it was after the season, so it wasn't all setup the way I have it. They saw my galvanized roof and didn't like it one bit. They didn't like the fact that the steam would hit it and condensate and drip back into the pans.

I guess you can take your chances.

Any of you Ontario guys hear if OMAFRA are still doing syrup testing? I was told it was going to be done every year, even if you pass. They haven't been here in 2 years.

[wally]

I think one theory was that the nitre builds up on the solder and essentially reduces any lead transfer to the sap.

i think the theory is that the niter helps precipitate the lead out of the syrup, and it is then caught by the filters with the niter (the lead). however, some lead remains dissolved and passes through the filters. testing at various stages, such as short and long duration in the pans/tanks/etc, would seem to be the "best" way to determine lead levels.

[Robear]

How about old buckets with soldered seams? I got ours off ebay a few years ago and have wondered about that. Some metallic paint chips come off with the sap but get mostly filtered out before boiling. A few cotton filters later, there is nothing but some sediment in the bottom of the jars. Still, makes you wonder....