building a 2x4 pan

[dano2840]

hey ive got a 2x4 that i got out of my nieghbors sugar house (whats left of the sugar house any way) it had a flat tin pan but it got crushed when the roof came down on it, i just started metals 2 in school this semester, and i just about shot through the roof when i learned the school owned a TIG welder, YAY!, that was the first thing i thought of when my teacher said that,
but i have a few questions (as always)
what gauge of ss should i use?, when i weld it up should i weld the corners from the inside of the pan or the outside? How many sections do you guys recomend i put in? i was thinking of using a 1/2" valve on it (1 on each side) i thought 3/4 was over kill for the small amount of syrup coming off it, do you agree? when i weld the partitions, should i make several 2-3" welds down the length of it or weld the bottom of the partition all the way down the seam? do i need to weld both sides? thanks
Dan

[Specklefield Farm]

hell, build a 4x6 drop flue, get the whole class involved!

[ericjeeper]

Ask your shop teacher. What gauge the schools brake will handle.

[dano2840]

it is a big break, it should do just fine for using to build a pan, but what size do i need?

[ericjeeper]

Most commercial pans are either 18 or 20 gauge.

[mapleman3]

Danno I am going to move this post to the Homemade section, we want to keep with the subject, I think it will be more suited for that .
Thanks

[mapletbdf]

Dano you mite want to consider soldering your pan welding
ss can be tough

[tessiersfarm]

We have a $75,000.00 brake at work that will only do 20 guage stainless so I would check before you buy the sheet. I am a fair to good welder and I tried to weld the stainless with no luck. I ended up hireing a welder to do mine and they use a mig welder, he said the tig is obsolete for this application. Our welders do mostly gutters and roof penetration curbs so they may also have a portability preference. 20 guage should weld quite easily and it was surprisingly stiff. I hemed the top edge to keep it straight. It took they guy less than an hour to weld all 4 corners of my flat pan. He welded mine on the inside. I used stainless half couplings ( thats what they were called by the sale house) to weld on the pan. I had 1/2" fittings on my 27"x40" and never had any problems. I did go to 3/4" fittings on my 2x6. I only tacked my partitions in enough so the stainless would hold tight.

Good luck with the project!

[Gary R]

I'm a bad welder, and don't know much about it. Most pans are 20 gauge. Mine are 18 gauge because that's what I had for free. I have mig welded mine with no problems (other that looks:) ). My latest pan I had a sheetmetal/welder fabricator from my wifes shop weld. He used a tig on the outside of the corners with no filler rod. The inside of the pan corners are as clean as butting 2 pieces of sheared metal together. Easy to clean. Something I learned about mig welders a few weeks ago. My father was trying to weld some sheet metal with a larger (250amp?) mig. He kept on burning through no matter how low he set it. He mentioned this to a friend of mine back home that has a welding business and can weld anything. He said the bigger migs have a high startup voltage even when set low. He needed to use his small 110volt mig that I had. No problems welding the sheet metal. I'm wondering if this is what's happening with a lot of the guy's that are burning through the thin stuff.

[WF MASON]

"tig would be obsolete for this application" ? I'd say it depends on how clean and unwarped you'd want your stainless for it to be obsolete.
Walk through Leader, D+G, ect. and you'll see ten tig welders and one mig to weld the steel arches.

[tessiersfarm]

As I said that was the comment from one of our welders. It may have more to do with portability and or their type of welding, they do not make sap pans as a rule.

[dano2840]

well ive got a year before i plan on playing on the thing (its a 2x4, its just for fun along the big rig) so i have plenty of time to learn how to be a very good tig welder, as of right now i have no idea how to run one, ive heard a tig is alot different from a mig or stick, both of which im pretty good at, but we will see, im gunna go with 18 or 20g and probably 1/2 valves and a 3 section pan, and from what ive read only welding short beads along the partition should be fine
so i will pop the plans tomarrow and see what the damage is gunna be on the ol' back pocket...........

[dano2840]

"tig would be obsolete for this application" ? I'd say it depends on how clean and unwarped you'd want your stainless for it to be obsolete.
Walk through Leader, D+G, ect. and you'll see ten tig welders and one mig to weld the steel arches.

on the cover of leader's catalog you see a guy welding a flue pan w/ a tig

[xulgiy]

I welded mine out 18 and wouldn't go any thinner. Heat transfer is fine and tig is the way to go. Fold the sides so that the inside edges meet. Keep your amperage down and use 308 rod....as long as you keep moving and stay in the trough you should be fine. I just put 1x7 inch drops in the bottom for this year. The welding is going pretty slow because we need to skip weld so that the bottom doesn't warp. Kind of wishing I didn't tackle it this late!

[dano2840]

will i have to skip weld when im doing the corners?

[xulgiy]

It certainly would help to keep any warpage away. Also, If your going to section the pans I would flange the edges 90 degrees and tack them in. Everyone says how important it is to have a tight seal on the dividers......I tacked mine every two inches and have had no problems with gradient.

[dano2840]

ok you mean bend the edges on the bottom 90 so there is about 1/2"-1" that is flat on the bottom that i can weld in place right?

[xulgiy]

1/4 inch would be better....

[Haynes Forest Products]

Any time you weld up something as intrecite as pans, arch ,trailer ,table always tack everything first. Cross bracing helps and then skip welding and tacking helps keep it stright.
Understanding why things shrink will help avoiding it. Injecting to much welding wire will cause warpage faster than to much heat. As large amounts of welding meterial cool they shrink and the larger the weld the harder that weld will pull. A long continuous weld will over heat the area causing it to expand then to much weld will cause pulling and warping and shrinkage. Stich weld let cool. Practice practice practice.