questions about getting set up, pans, etc

[KevintheHobbit]

I'm looking to lay the foundation for a small operation (large enough to feed 4 growing boys and enough left over to send relatives out of state). I've got the potential to put in 40 to 135 taps, though I'll probably not reach capacity this year.

I was looking around at pans and evaps, but ran into a problem: the family budget just can't fit a whole new set up. I wanted to start by getting a good pan, throw it on a concrete block arch and then slowly work my way up to full evaporator. I was able to talk my wife into freeing up about $350 (I told her that's about how much we'd spend buying syrup plus a little extra).

I noticed 03Weim found a Patrick Phaneuf built pan on ebay for $325. It looks like a good pan to me, but then I don't really know what I'm looking for. Here's the link http://cgi.ebay.com/Maple-Syrup-Pan-Preheater-pan_W0QQitemZ230319289959QQihZ013QQcategoryZ36346Q QcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp1742.m153.l1262

Does anyone have any info about Phaneuf pans, or any advice as to what to look for in a pan? Should I make sure I get a flue pan and a flat pan? And how exactly does a flue pan work?

Thanks from a greenhorn,
Kevin

[brookledge]

Do a search on this site with his name. He has been a big topic in the past.
I have never dealt with him so I will let you read the post and make your own conclusion
Keith

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

Either way, I think his pans are very good quality. Send him a message thru ebay and ask him how long before he ships. That is a very good deal on a good quality pan and shipping is cheap. Don't think you could go wrong with this pan.

[Haynes Forest Products]

That is a great starter kit that will be alot of fun. I would jump on it. I know we had alot of fun standing around the stainless washing machine tub in the gravel driveway in the rain batch cooking and loved it. Hurry up she could change her mind

[KevintheHobbit]

Keith,

Thanks for the idea to search the site. For some reason my tired brain didn't think of that. I keep telling myself that potty training my 2 year old to stay dry through the night it great training for an all night boil, but it sure does make thinking hard.

I'll poke around and see what I can find.

Kevin

[KevintheHobbit]

...about the money. Rather, I sure hope she doesn't change her mind. I've got it sitting in a glass jar on the dresser...maybe I should count it.

Brandon -- Thanks for the input. My first instinct was to jump on it, too, but I heard the voice of my mother in the back of my head saying (are you sure this is what you want?)

Kevin

[Gary R]

If money is going to be a constraint, I'd look for a homemade flat pan with partitions. You could put it on a block arch for now and build an arch later. With 40 taps you should be making 10-15 gal. a year with good sugar content. This hobby is not cheap if you want all the bell's and whistles. Work up your tap count and if after a few year's the boils get long, sell the pan and look for a 2X6 with flues.

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

Kevin,

Check with Bascoms if you are not too far away from them. They had tons of crossflow stainless syrup pans that would make a good starter for what you want. Doubt you will find a used pan that nice as the one Patrick has on ebay for much less if any.

[KevintheHobbit]

Brandon & GaryR,

Thanks for the input. A quick question about the difference between flat pans with partitions and cross flow pans (I'm showing my ignorance and laziness here because I could probably search the forum for this). I think I understand the principle of flue pans (more surface heated and in contact with the sap = faster heating and quicker boils = better use of fuel).

I dropped a line to Patrick to find out about timelines. I haven't heard back yet, but it's only been two days. I live about 2 1/2 hours from Bascoms. I checked out their online inventory. Maybe I'll make the trip. Of course, I only live about 45 minutes from Leader and I still haven't made the trip up there yet. Pesky day job in getting in the way...

I'll definitely start on the small side of the potential of my sugarbush. I would love to put in 50 taps this year, but realistically I'm probably only looking at 25-30. My wife, ever the entrepreneur, is already thinking about marketing our syrup, but I think that's a few years down the road.

I appreciate all the advice and ideas. This is great.

Kevin

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

If you can get one of the new 2009 catalogs from Bascoms, they have tons of crossflow pans in them used in the back of the catalog. If you could get like a 2' x 6' crossflow pan, it would boil off the sap a lot faster than a 2x3 pan and a preheater pan is not that big of a need on a small setup.

[tessiersfarm]

I bent my first pans out of some stainless sheets. I got the sheets at the local transfer station. They were the sides of a discarded stainless refridgerator which I cut off. They charged me $10.00 to drop the fridge back off but it was worth it.

[KevintheHobbit]

Thanks for all the input. This has been great. Of course it's got me thinking too much, but that's okay, my brain could use the exercise.

If I buy a 2x3 flat pan with partitions, could I add a 2x3 flue pan later and use the flat pan for finishing and then throw the whole thing on a 2x6 arch? Would that make more sense than buying a 2x6 cross flow now? I think the biggest arch I could manage with the number of potential taps I have would be 2x6 and I'm worried if I get a bigger cross flow pan it will give me no room to expand other than replacing the whole pan.

I'd tinker something up, but I'm a hellva lot better with wood and stone than with metal. I can sew up a pretty mean halloween costume, too, but let's not tell anyone about that...

Kevin

[RileySugarbush]

I have a 2x3 syrup and a 2x3 flue pan on my 2x6 arch. It works great, but I think I could get a little more out of it with a shorter syrup pan and longer flue pan. That said, it works pretty well right as is, exceeding 40 gph. I'd say you have a good plan.

[Haynes Forest Products]

Dont worry about what you call your pans if they have fire under them then your ahead of the game. Now if your flue pan has flues then yes more flue area would help. There are flat pans that are called flue pans because of the position on the arch.

[KevintheHobbit]

The advice has been awesome. Thanks for all the insight.

I've got an order in for a syrup pan with Patrick Phaneuf. With any luck it'll come in before March. (I've got a back up plan just in case, but at least I'll have it for next season, right?) Hopefully I'll be able to add a flue pan in the back in a few years. John's 40 gph encouraged me.

I talked to Leader about a pan from them, but the price tag was a little too hard to swallow (double what Phaneuf is asking). Being a Vermonter, I wanted to support a local company, but the old family budget just couldn't take it and I won't be in the position to start making it back by selling syrup for a while.

Thanks again to everyone who took the time to read and respond.

Kevin