installing booster

[jrthe3]

i am puting a vac system up for the first time was wondering how to plum booster have wet line in and wet line out dry line out where dose the dry line hook to the vac pump or the releaser

[halfast tapper]

You will want to hook it to the releaser , just in case your wet line is froze so the sap will flow down the dry line.

[jrthe3]

another ? can i run a dry line from booster to booster or dose each booster line need to runback to the releaser

[chipa]

Yes you can run booster to booster.

[brookledge]

With my set up I have the first booster is about 1,000 feet up and then every 500 feet after. I have 1" wet and 1" dry. My booster is made of 4" pvc pipe about 2 feet high. I have a very good slope on the entire system but a few times when I started the vacuum in the morning I had sap coming in on the dry line. I have valves on the top so I can isolate the dry line and wet line for cleaning. And also the top of the 4" pvc has a 4" plug so I can open and clean it.
So like chipa said you can run dry lines anywhere tieing into wet lines.
Keith

[OGDENS SUGAR BUSH]

brookledge

my guess is your wet line is froze up in the morning so sap is coming in yourdry line
my 2 cents
RICH

[Russell Lampron]

Or another scenario is that the sap is running so hard that the wet line is coming in full pipe and the excess is coming in in the dry line.

[brookledge]

I know it was from freeze up. Some of the nights when the temps dropped fast and the trees where still running it would cause that. The thing about the dry line is that it will allow the sap to run early in the morning even if the wet line is frozen. And with only a wet line if you have a little bit frozen you never will know it. Most of the time I'd leave the vacuum pump on until it was into the 20s and there would be slush coming into my vacuum tank before I would shut it down. That is one good thing about vacuum tanks, slush and ice can't affect them like it can with a releaser.
Keith

[jrthe3]

ok thanks for all help so far have a few more ? i started to run vac lines this weekend plan on useing same mainline and putting up new dry line i have a 1 inch main line that runs about 500 feet up a hill side not taps on the 1 inch then it splits into 3 1/2 inch main lines all 3 have about 50 taps on them one is 100 feet long the other 2 are 200 feet long should i put a booster were the 1inch and the 1/2 inchs come togather

[PATheron]

You want to put a booster anywhere a lateral main line connects to your trunk wet/dry line. You want to avoid having 5/16 laterals connected right to your trunk main line. On my system my biggest problem was couplings freezing up on my main wet line. I dont know how it happens really becouse I just let my pump run around the clock and all my maines have slope so youd think they would always be clean. It wasnt the case though, if my lines werent running really steep up the hill the darn couplings would freeze up and take a long time the next day to thaw. I would still get the sap though by having the dry lines. This year Im going to correct that by extending my dry lines further into the bush. If my mainlines arent running straight up and down they are getting dry lines so that a frozen coupling cant shut the whole bush down. Another thing that I found that surprised me was I wanted to pick up about 50 really nice taps and all I had was a bunch of 1/2". Im not a proponent of running 1/2" for main but that is what I had. I ran it out really quick temporarally and it was a real long run with tons of sags. I figured it was better than nothing. Ill tell you what it seemed to work great. Id check a tap at the end and it always had hard vac. I think my pump kind of looks at it like a big lateral line. I think the pump is so powerfull it wont let it hold a full pipe and shut the vac down. This year its coming out though and Im running the proper tube on wire. I think when I do my next bush im going to run the maines straight up and down the hill with big tube and no drys. Then where they run into the main trunk line that will always be wet/dry. I know that contadicts the book becouse they always advocate going across the slope but it seems like doing it my way would avoid all freeze up problems. Just some food for thought. Theron

[maplwrks]

Hey Theron,
Looking at your pictures, I see that the mainline couplings that you are using are stainless.I think your freeze-ups are happening because of the exposed metal at each coupling or Y. I've never used these stainless couplings before, but, is there any way to get the tubing to slide further up the fitting? I think if you were able to get the mainline slid onto thse fittings another 1" or so on each side you might eliminate your problem. The pipe would act as insulation over the stainless. I know it takes a mainline tool to put these fittings in, maybe it's not possible. Just my thoughts...... Mike

[PATheron]

Mike- I never thought of that with the stainless fittings but it does make sense. They arent the ones that are giving me problems though. The ones messing up are couplings in the 1" line that are past the wet dry line and dont have a steep pitch. There seems to be enough restriction there to freeze up for some reason. Im going to just dry line past them this year till it gets steeper so if they do mess up Ill still get the main parts of the bush. I only have two of the stainless Y's the rest are plastic. The mainline goes over them very hard though even with the tool. Once the season progresses it isnt a problem but im trying to not miss any tricks. You take a lot of those early season days if the lines are clear you get half day runs. That adds up to a lot of sap at a gallon per tap. Thats still maybe 800 gallons even with the taps I have. That adds up to a barrell every two days. Just like a wise old sugar maker told me once(Parker) YOU GOTTA WANNNNNNNNNT IT!!!!!!!

[brookledge]

Even with good slopes under the right condition you are going to get freeze ups. Many times the temps drop quick and the sap is still running cause it is still warm in the tree but as soon as the sap comes out it freezes and then as more sap continues it just keeps building up until it closes the pipe line.
That is why having a dry line helps increase your yield cause it will take the flow until thing thaw out.
Keith

[jrthe3]

hey PA you say you are extending your dry line in to your bush more dose that mean you will be putting in more booster if so how far apart do you plan on putting the i have a main line that is about 700 feet long with very little slope and it like to freeze as a gravity line i lost alot of runs because it was pluged now that i am going to vac i was thinking of putting a booster every 100 feet is this over kill or will it help i built booster out of 3 inch pvc 16 inchs long cap on one end and a screw cap on the other end the pipe runs side to side not up and down i ran the out wet line out the bottom and all other wet and dry lines in the side dose this sound like it will work

[jrthe3]

another ? for ya all if i over size my main line will this hirt me i want to go big so i can add more taps latter and not have to change main lines

[PATheron]

Bigger is definitely better with mainline I believe. Im not sure on the spacing of the boosters. 802 or the Governor would know better than I do. I dont have to go too far to come to where it runs real steep up the hill. That is where Im going to run mine too and then put a booster there. Almost all of my taps are above that point so I think that will work for me. Ask those guys or Royal maple about the spacing, they have run a lot more tube than I have. Theron

[Maple Hill Sugarhouse]

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[jrthe3]

here is what i am doing i have 4 seperate mainline with about 400 taps total the first one is about 250 feet from sugar house next one is about 500 feet from sugar house the next one is 1000 feet and the next one is about 1700 feet from sugar house when i install the 2 sap ladders i will have 2 to 5 % slope on the wet dry line i want to vac all them to the sugar house but i want to use big wet and dry line cause there is more taps that can be hooked to the wet dry line but i can ony aford to do a little each year put the vac system this year and add more taps next year but when i add the more taps wich when i am all said and done could be over 1000 more tap i don't want to have to change the size of my wet and dry line so if i run big lines know witch i was thinking 1 1/4 wet and 1 1/2 dry will this be to much line for my 400 taps

[Maple Hill Sugarhouse]

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[jrthe3]

one sap ladder is about 100 feet from sugar house the other one will be at the end 1700 feet from the sugar house i will run the big line only want to do this once the other problem is the mainline at the end of the 1700 feet is 700 feet long so the end of it is 2400 feet away from my releaser shuld i put booster after the last sap ladder in that 700 foot long mainline this whole vacuum thing has me all lost i don't know if i am coming or going i want to do it right the first time can't aford to do it twice dose anyone make a book on how to do it if not will some one write one


hey Govner are any where around North West PA could use a pro to come tell me what i doing wrong tried to pay someone from leader to come down no one would even talk me

[PATheron]

Jr- I was kind of in the same situation. I think what you need to do is either draw everything out in very good detail including tap concentrations, slope, distances, etc. Then have one of these computer gurus on here help you figure out how to put it on here so we can all look at it. Or if you are buying all your stuff from a local dealer that is knowledgable ask him if he can come look at it for you. I do all my Business with Richard Patterson and he had his men come out to my place and look it over and then they went back and drew out exactly how to do it. It made it possable for me to do it right the first time like your saying. I think if you could draw it out very clearly and figure out how to put it on here so we all could look at it that would probly work pretty good for you if you dont have a local person to look at it. Theron

[jrthe3]

the nerest dealer is like an hour away get most my stuff at home depute and tractor supply the rest i order on line

i will draw up a very detailed drawing this week end and try to pust it sunday night

[Jim Brown]

jrthe3; Our dealer came out to our place and helped us set up the first set of main lines and laterals.Brian Ianson and his wife Donna in Coudersport are super folks and have a wealth of knowledge(4th gen sugar makers). Give him a call and see if he can help. He has been agreat help to us .

Jim

[Maple Hill Sugarhouse]

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[jrthe3]

thanks for all the help after contacting some people that others on here told me about i have made plans to have a guy come and look at my bush and tell my i am doing wrong once again thanks for all the help from all of you i am sure i will forget to ask him all i will need to know so i will be back again asking more so looking forward to talking with all you again