Getting a new evaporator and need help making a decision

[Bricklayer]

Since we will be increasing our tap count next year to about 1000 I’ve made the decision that it’s time for our old pieced together one to go. It’s the weak point in the operation now.
We will be running 1000 taps next year with a 250 gph RO that can bring our average sap of 2.3 up to around 8 or 9%. Depending on the temp and how much pressure I run it at.

Figured I’d look into 2.5 x 8 evaporators as that seems to be the standard size they start to make the efficient evaporators.

My 3 choices so far in order

1. CDL Venturi
2. Lapierre Vision
- Can not find enough info or videos on the vision to get info on it.
3. Lapierre Force 5
- this would be my ultimate dream but its a ton more expensive then the rest.

[Pdiamond]

Are you going to continue to use wood as your heating source?

[Bruce L]

My suggestion would be to get to the open houses end of April if you are able,check out the evaporators in action. I was going to pull the trigger on one of the units you have listed,but once I saw it in action against the vortex,there was an easy decision. I may fire more often,might burn a little more wood,maybe not,but I can be done boiling and checking lines,bottling etc. hours ahead of what other evaporators are doing. On my 3 x 14 I was boiling 200 plus gallons per hour of raw sap,now with the steam away I am pushing through 300-350 per hour

[Bricklayer]

Yes I will be using wood as a fuel source.
I was wondering how I would see them in action. I guess I’d have to go to each manufacturers open houses to be able to do this.
Would be nice if they could have a big expo or something like that where all the manufacturers come and show off their evaporators.

[SeanD]

I'm curious why you are looking at evaporators with that expansion and not your RO. I think 1000 taps on vac through a 250 is going to be your weak point - though anything called Frankenstein probably has earned the name. You'll get some money back from selling the 250 that could go toward a bigger RO and Frankenstein could live on!

[Bricklayer]

Frankenstein will not live on. I’m done sinking money into it. It was kind of inherited when I took over and has been patched up for fever the years and for a 2.5x 12’ evaporator to get only 35 gph at as hot as I could possibly fire it is pretty bad.
I’d have to replace the whole front to make it airtight and the stack is all rotted out. We had to cut off 3’ of it this year to be able to get by.
So Frankenstein is dead in my books.

RO can be upgraded yes. That will be the next upgrade.

I’ve been looking into the Lapierre Vision. But I don’t think it has the option of adding a blower. That will strike it off my list.

[ecp]

Yes I will be using wood as a fuel source.
I was wondering how I would see them in action. I guess I’d have to go to each manufacturers open houses to be able to do this.
Would be nice if they could have a big expo or something like that where all the manufacturers come and show off their evaporators.

Probably too late in the game to plan, but the Vermont open house weekend has every manufacturer set up withing about a 10-mile drive. That the best one stop shop I know of in this industry.

[ecp]

1. CDL Venturi
2. Lapierre Vision
- Can not find enough info or videos on the vision to get info on it.
3. Lapierre Force 5
- this would be my ultimate dream but its a ton more expensive then the rest.

Budget is important to consider but have you thought about the CDL Master? Or the D&G Tornado?

[Bricklayer]

I have a CDL dealer fairly close as well as a Lapierre dealer.
D & G I have never dealt with other than buying bottles off them one year. But I dealt with them directly and not through a dealer.

[SeanD]

Frankenstein will not live on. I’m done sinking money into it. It was kind of inherited when I took over and has been patched up for fever the years and for a 2.5x 12’ evaporator to get only 35 gph at as hot as I could possibly fire it is pretty bad.
I’d have to replace the whole front to make it airtight and the stack is all rotted out. We had to cut off 3’ of it this year to be able to get by.
So Frankenstein is dead in my books.

35 gph?! That's not Frankenstein, that's the Mummy! Makes sense now. Good luck with the shopping for a new rig.

[heus]

In my opinion you can't really go wrong with any of the common evaporator manufacturers.

[johnallin]

I’d say they’re all good companies but an active local dealer would be more important to me and a trip to the open houses this April should be paramount.

When I purchased our 2x6, we planned a weekend trip to Vermont to visit the open houses.
It was well worth the time, we got to see a part of the country we’d not been to and the savings on the equipment due to spring sales more than covered the cost of the trip. Another 2+2=6 deal win-win.
It was very cool to compare rigs, and even better to meet some of the folks at Leader and the craftsmen who fabricate this “stuff”.

We get an honest 35-45 gph on the Leader 2x6…I can’t imagine feeding a 4x12 for the same return. Not sure Frankenstein is what I’d call it…maybe more like Baby Huie (sp) !!

[TapTapTap]

I suggest planning out about 12 years and base your decision on how you want to operate during that time. Specifically, about what operation mode you'll be in. I'm turning 62 this year and I'm at a point where being more efficient with my lifestyle will allow me to get the most satisfaction from my effort. Previously I did hard work to be satisfied with the accomplishment. Looking forward I don't see that as sustainable.

Applying this philosophy to an evaporator purchase would drive me to the best one that allows for efficiency and reduced physical effort. And I too would want to stick wood fuel. I just don't see myself preparing 6 to 7 full cord of wood every year for just the evaporator.

Is the Force 5 your best option? Maybe it is.

Ken

[ecp]

I have a CDL dealer fairly close as well as a Lapierre dealer.
D & G I have never dealt with other than buying bottles off them one year. But I dealt with them directly and not through a dealer.

If you have not talked to CDL about a master you should if you want efficiently and ease of use. Make sure to bring your cardiologist with you for the heart attack when they give you the quote though. Based on what you are getting for an evaporation rate now I don't think any of the options are bad. To be honest if I were looking to go wood, I really wouldn't worry about the "closest dealer" because not much is going to go wrong once startup is done (so you have a blower go bad okay just change it out). Hope this helps. Have you thought about the used market at all or are you set on brand new?

[Bucket Head]

I could not agree more with what Ken said. "Work smarter not harder" and "Nobody is getting any younger" are two phrases I have been repeating to myself over and over for a number of years now. I realized things had to "change" in regards to sugarmaking.

All the improvements, modifications/fabrication and equipment additions I have done in the last three years did not garner me an extra drop of syrup. Everything was done to make syrup making easier on my father and I. And basically, most of those improvements were to make it easier for me, so I could do the operation(s) by myself. My father just isn't able to do it anymore and he won't be around forever. If I'm going to continue to make syrup, it has to be easier and as efficient as I can possibly make it. I'm 53, not 23. Sugarmaking used to be waay easier years ago..., lol.

My advice to anyone on equipment and set ups would be to think long and hard about where you want to be and how you are going to get there. A lot of forethought today will pay huge dividends in the future, believe me. And your back will thank you later.

Steve

[Bruce L]

Bricklayer,are you up for a road trip? Thinking of going down and back on the Saturday if you want to carpool? Depending on how my back is feeling,have been dealing with a slipped disc,pinched nerve since last November,sugar making was a tough chore this year

[Bricklayer]

What weekend is that Bruce ? Are you referring to the Leader open house ?

[Sunday Rock Maple]

Another option that would make a quick impact for not a lot of money would be to find a used bulk milk tank with a working compressor. Then run your 8% concentrate back through the RO and keep it cool until you have enough to boil. You'll cut your boiling time in half, use less wood, make lighter syrup and boil when you want to not when you have to.

[Bruce L]

What weekend is that Bruce ? Are you referring to the Leader open house ? Yes ,Leaders open house,Dominion and Grimm,Lapierre,last year CDL didn’t see fit to be open on the Saturday for some reason

[Bricklayer]

Made my decision on the CDL Venturi.
Went with a 30” x 10’ it wasn’t much more $$ then the 30” x 8’.
Got the extension as well so the blower will be outside. Heard they were pretty loud.

[DrTimPerkins]

Got the extension as well so the blower will be outside. Heard they were pretty loud.

Good move there. Lots of noise in the sugarhouse. Might not seem bad for a few minutes during testing/evaluation, but after several hours of boiling it kind of wears you down. Amazing relief when things get shut off at the end of the day.

[VTnewguy]

We have a 30*8 Venturi. It's nice to have the blower outside. We are only about 8' from the stack.

[ennismaple]

You'll need to confirm with the manufacturers when they can deliver if you order now. I understand the backlog is quite long so that may affect your decision making, given two equal options.

[Bricklayer]

CDL confirmed delivery for end of August early September. So I’m happy with that.

[BigJon]

We are upgrading this year from a 2x6 to a 30x8 Smoky Lake Silverplate with their preheater and concentric exhaust system. I like that there will only be one hole in the roof, it’s American made, and they are willing to put their prices online for everyone to see. Very helpful staff and free shipping as well. Was able to order the new roof jack and stack cover at Bascoms open house this past weekend. Cant wait to install it this fall.

[Bricklayer]

I did look at the smoky lake evaporators. I’ve heard good things about them and seen them in action. But I feel confident going with CDL due to the fact that they have multiple locations within an hour drive of me and the Sales Rep always answers his phone.
Didn’t get the preheater and hoods. Our ceiling is low in our shack amd I have to pour a slab for the new evaporator. So wanted to get it in and installed first so I can measure the clearance. Also our cupola is offset from the evaporator. So the stacks for the hood will have to go higher than the cupola on the outside. Don’t think of setting the steam stack into the cupola is good to do. Never seen it anyways.

[maple flats]

I had 2 steam stacks of 15" each terminate in the cupola, it worked very well. My rig had a hood over everything, setting on the flues pan and up about 14-16" over the syrup pan. No issues.
I had my hoods setup so they were raised using a winch, lifting the hoods (as a single unit) by cranking the winch. The stacks telescoped upper into the lower. The bottom s were both 15", then in the cupola I had 2 stacks suspended extending into the lower and they were 13". It worked very well.

[Pdiamond]

Did you get the same side reverse draw off or stay with the standard draw off set up. Another question, did you get the auto draw system with the evaporator. When I got mine the same side reverse draw off was not available yet, but I did get the basic auto draw off system, which has worked flawlessly. This year was my ninth year with my corsair arch and raised flue pans.

[Sunday Rock Maple]

We also vent the steam stacks into the cupola with no issues.

[BigJon]

I got the SSR syrup pan and the Simplicity auto drawoff along with analog stack temp gauge. Like the idea of not having to pull the front end of the evaporator apart to reverse it. Also my old evaporator steam stack terminated in my cupola, and I had issues with condensation in the cupola and water dripping back down. Nobody else has that concentric exhaust system and I think it’s an excellent idea.

[Bricklayer]

We also vent the steam stacks into the cupola with no issues.

My cupola isn’t directly over my evaporator. It’s 3’ offset to the centre. So if I came off the hood I would have to offset the steam stacks into the cupola 3’. So would be a nightmare trying to raise the hood.

[Pdiamond]

BigJon,
From everything I have seen and reviews I have read about the concentric exhaust everyone really likes it once it has been installed. I have been debating about getting the stack temperature gage. It is pretty expensive and I don't know if it would make that much of a difference. I am getting a draw off tank for next year from SL.I am also going to lower the depth in the syrup pan to an inch and 1/4 to see if that changes anything. Let us know how things go for you when you get your new system. I like the simplicity auto draw off system. I set mine by the Saptapapp temp for the day and go one degree higher. That way I can adjust the density in the house without having to re-boil it.

[Super Sapper]

I have the concentric exhaust currently and really like it. I am going to sell my home built 2x6 with the Smoky Lake drop flue pans and have ordered a 2x6 raised flue silverplate. The silverplate uses a 10 inch exhaust and my old one was an 8 inch so I will need to sell the 8-12 concentric with my old evaporator and need to increase the hole for the 10-14 on the new one. If you are going to do an "new" install I would recommend the concentric exhaust.

[Bricklayer]

CDL confirmed delivery this Wednesday. So perfect timing. Gives me time to brick it and maybe even play around with it and maybe get a handle on operating it before its syrup time.
We had planned on putting new wet location lights in the sugar house this year but didn’t get around to it. They are still in my garage at home. So will have to be installed after the evaporator is put in. Makes it a bit of a challenge but not impossible.

[maple flats]

When you install the lights, I suggest it all be designed for wet locations, while not mandatory, it's sure better.

[Bricklayer]

CDL confirmed delivery this Wednesday. So perfect timing. Gives me time to brick it and maybe even play around with it and maybe get a handle on operating it before its syrup time.
We had planned on putting new wet location lights in the sugar house this year but didn’t get around to it. They are still in my garage at home. So will have to be installed after the evaporator is put in. Makes it a bit of a challenge but not impossible.


Exactly what I said I bought in my post. Just Havnt put them in yet.