insurance Coverage for a Small Producer in NY

[Ghs57]

My homeowners insurance company (New York Central Mutual) just dropped me because of my on-site maple syrup operation. The contention is the added risk of fire, home based retail, and the product liability is unacceptable to them. I do my processing in a detached building, am using modern equipment, and follow the procedures to the best of my knowledge, and produce less than 100 gallons of syrup.

So the question is: What do similar producers do for instance coverage? **Don't think that not telling them is the answer, because they say that any claim I would have filed that was traceable to the maple syrup operation would have been denied (this is why they investigate fires, etc.).**

I'm sure there are many home based operations faced with the same situation. Any advice would be appreciated.

[bill m]

We use Farm and Family Insurance Co.

[Pdiamond]

Coming from an Insurance background, I can tell this much. Each state has its own regulations. You would be best off contacting someone from the state insurance bureau to assist with your issue. They should be able to direct you to a company that will insure the business portion and that will free up the homeowners portion. It may also be a matter of your location. I hope this helps.

[tcross]

i'm in vermont and my home owners insurance was fine with me having an operating sugarhouse detached and 150 yards away from my house. regardless of that, my insurance agent advised me to get what they call a "hobby" farm insurance. it gave me a LOT more coverage than my previous insurance did. with that, my sugarhouse got a blanket coverage that included all of my "out" buildings. it also gave me around $80k worth of coverage for things such as tools, equipment etc. if NY allows that, it's something worth looking in to. i make around 160-200 gallons of syrup a year.

[DrTimPerkins]

We use Farm and Family Insurance Co.

Farm Family Insurance Co. is now known as American National. Good company.

[Ghs57]

All very good info. Thanks.

My agent is looking for coverage, but I don't have any details yet.

My equipment is in the far end of a building (roughly 12'x51' not counting the 10' shed roofs running down one side) just 21 feet from the house. The nearest end is a 12x16 woodshed housing the firewood for the main house. That is joined to a 12x35 section where the maple equipment is located. The evap is against the farthest wall. My lot is 2.5 acres in a very rural wooded area.

This is a western NY based insurance company, and I assume they have plenty of data supporting this decision. Despite my very long term history with them, and my broker's negotiations, they were unwilling to reconsider.

[TapTapTap]

I can understand why the insurance company bailed. 21 feet is way too close to your house. You're obviously way beyond their risk tolerance which should signal to you that a better location further from the house is needed.

There might be other considerations too, such as do you have a fire hydrant within 300 feet? If not, then it might be nearly impossible to put out a barn fire on tanker trucks alone. Once the barn is fully engulfed the the house would be hard to protect.

Ken

[Ghs57]

I can understand why the insurance company bailed. 21 feet is way too close to your house. You're obviously way beyond their risk tolerance which should signal to you that a better location further from the house is needed.

There might be other considerations too, such as do you have a fire hydrant within 300 feet? If not, then it might be nearly impossible to put out a barn fire on tanker trucks alone. Once the barn is fully engulfed the the house would be hard to protect.

Ken

At the time they bailed, they did not know the location or distance. They did not ask. This is more of a policy than a case by case decision. The evap is on the far end of the building, about 75 feet away from the house, but still in part of the same building. There are no fire hydrants within a usable distance in this rural area (about 1/2 mile away), but they didn't ask about that either.

Too late to move the location now without a huge financial expenditure. That's not in the cards. Due to the shape of my lot, the best I could have done was 100-125 feet. Another option may be to process off-site, at my remote sap collection point. But I don't own that land, and just about the same conditions apply there. In fact the neighbors would probably object for the same reasons; too close to their properties.

Still no word on insurance options from my agent. This may put me out of business for this season.

[Andy VT]

That stinks. But I wonder if you could still sell raw sap or even concentrated (R.O.'d) sap if it comes to that.

[Ghs57]

My agent still has not found replacement coverage from the companies they represent. I have a few weeks until cancellation, but I may have to check with other agents. My agent does not offer American National, but there are agents in my area.

[buckeye gold]

Insurance companies can be a pain in the butt for sure. They are all promises when they want your business and all denial when you have a loss. It almost seems like you need to change every few years to keep them in line. When they think they got you they raise rates. Sometimes I think they look for a reason to cancel you after you been a long term customer. The actuaries figure your due for a big claim and if they dump you all those premiums are secured profit with no out pay. Oh well, I digress. I would simply shop around and see who will do what. In our area a lot of homes have outdoor wood furnaces right close to a home, they surely aren't any safer than an evaporator that will only run select days for 6-8 weeks. Maybe an appeal with a detailed description would help. Your agent should be doing this for you. You being on a residential lot may be a big problem. I have asked my agent and he says I am covered under my umbrella for the farm.

I am curious, has anyone here had a Maple related claim? How did your insurance treat it? I know I am just a small hobby guy and if I suffered 100% loss on my shack and equipment I could just bear it and be Ok. I'd hate it but it wouldn't ruin me. Everything is paid for and I'd probably just quit. So I don't worry about it. It is no danger to my house as it is a quarter mile from my house. It is closer to my rental house, but still a safe distance.

[collinsmapleman2012]

i sent you a message, i might be able to help you out.

[Spanielslovesappin]

Farm Family is great! The basic coverage (SPF10) is great for small maple producer but more importantly they are great to deal with in a claim; that's really what matters. Well worth leaving your agent who doesn't sell what you need or sells it at a ridiculous price.

[Z/MAN]

I went with Farm Family to insure my small hobby operation, at the time I switched all my insurance over with them. This was a few years ago. Last year my wife had a freak accident with her car running away in the driveway and down the hill and ending up in my neighbor's yard. The car ended up totaled! Farm Family went above and beyond to make things right. Beyond fair, quick, careing, great communication, all A#1 service! I cannot say enough good things about Farm Family. I highly recommend them.

[Ghs57]

I met with an American National agent on Friday at my house. He was very thorough reviewing the property, equipment and buildings, including pictures. No quote yet though.