Poor mans forced air Angle Iron Grates

[Sugarmaker]

I posted these in the Jan 2008 post but thought some might miss them. Nothing special but maybe someone can get an idea.
Yea they have warped but they also made about 600 gallons of syrup so I guess they paid for themselves on the 3 x 10.

Chris

Pic 001 is the way they set in the arch.
Pic 002 is the underside front showing the angle iron extension for the brick to set on.
Pic 003 is the bottom view
Pic 004 is the side view showing some sag from the heat.
Pic 005 is looking into the fire box at the 5 grates. You can see the bricks across the front near the door.

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

Chris,

Just curious how you got the holes in them, I assume some other way than drilling??

[RileySugarbush]

I have similar angles for a grate in my 2x6 with forced air. No holes, just 3/8" gaps between the angles. And I put them in point down so they fill with ash which insulates them. The forced air cools them and I have no warping after two years use. Much less productive years than Chris, however.

[MR Electrician]

I have similar angles for a grate in my 2x6 with forced air. No holes, just 3/8" gaps between the angles. And I put them in point down so they fill with ash which insulates them. The forced air cools them and I have no warping after two years use. Much less productive years than Chris, however.

we used old man hole covers
we got them from the scrap yard they weigh 200 lbs and last forever
no warping and you have a nice 1" spacing for ash and air to get through.

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

Chris,

That is what I was wondering about too because the regular "V" Grimm and Leader Grates you installl them like this VVVVV and the ash insulates the grates on top and the air insulates the bottom. Might want to try them that way if you get a new set. When I converted my arch to an inferno type arch, there were no airtight grates available for a 2' arch and I am still using the stanard "VV" Leader grates and I have don't have any warpage.

[802maple]

I use firebrick in alot of the arch"s that I have built. I put three 3/4" holes in each one. I build a steel platform that will hold the bricks and they last for years without having to replace them. Some of the setups that I have out there are 10 plus years old and still no broken bricks. I believe if you go to Breezy Lanes site you can see a picture of it.

[Brent]

one other small consideration on which way UP the V's go with angle iron grates is that with th V UP the ash falls down into a wedge. Un-burned lumbs get jammed other ash piles on top and is insulated and the grate soon becomes somewhat plugged. V-s pointing down is the way to go

[SeanD]

Can the steel side rails from an old bed frame withstand the heat? These things are junk in the corner of my garage and it would be nice if I could cut them up and put them to better use.

[danno]

OK, here's a stupid question. When placing angle iron with the V down - VVVVV, with a space between the V's, how do you keep the angle standing on it's point without simply falling over and making an L. LLLLLLL

[RileySugarbush]

On mine I welded another similar angle on each end of the series of ^^^^s. The vertical legs welded to the ^s and the horizontal legs sticking out to support the grate on some fire bricks or ledges.

[Sugarmaker]

I had a feeling this would generate some good suggestions! \/ pointing down seems to be they way I should have gone first. I was trying to copy the cast forced air grates which I believe have the /\ point up. But they are cast and I think have a base across them too?

Did I mention that I liked to fab and weld things? In my first life ( late 1700's) I was a blacksmith:) In this life I worked in structural steel fab shop as a designer and also worked on the "low" steel in the shop, punching, grinding welding torching, drilling, layout and fabricating.

I thought the point up would shed the ash easier than filling the grate. But as mentioned the ash may have actually insulated the steel? By the way I really dont get much ash. I just get nails:) I almost considered turning the grates over for this year and see if they came back?
Danno , since I added the front portion to the grate ( for the brick) I could actually turn them over and they are stable enough to hold the brick and a fire. I might just try it. I dont think fire is that smart to really know whether the V is up or down:)

Oh Yea some one asked about the holes. I was prepared to drill all of those, about 250, but I asked my local fab shop about punching them and he let me run his "iron worker" and I had them all punched in less than 1/2 hour. :)

SeanD, Not sure how long the bed frame angles would work? Let us know.

Brent, Ash will fall down into the same wedge shaped area between two grates when they are Up or down. VV or /\/\ My thought was it has a chance to self clean when pointed up but has to fill the grate when pointed down. As i say that i realize the most of the old cast grates ( which I still have also) have shallow v point down shapes.

I might try putting the old std grates in for a while? Brandon That sounds like what you are using?


Thanks for the comments.
Chris

[Brent]

Chris

I tried it point up and point down. If I recall it was simply not following Leader's instructions when I put the V point up.

In any case it simply worked better and the ash fell through better with the V-down, so the air flow was better and it burned hotter

I never thought about the ash sitting in the V insulating it and preventing warping when it got too hot, but that makes a lot of sense

[Russell Lampron]

I was told that the Leader/Grimm/King grates are supposed to be installed with the V facing up and that the V is supposed to be filled with refractory cement to insulate the grate and prevent warpage.

Russ

[oneoldsap]

If you would push your angle iron tight together and weld them to each other They won't warp near as much. I know a guy that did that and I think this will be the fifth season on them and they still look pretty good. Of course you'll need a torch to take them out one day, one cut no big deal

[ibby458]

I made a set of grates for a 2-1/2 x 5 flat pan evaporator out of 3x3x 1/2" angle iron. I blew them full of 3/4" holes (Using a whole tank of oxygen), them placed them points up with a 3/4" gap between them. I put a very small forced draft blower into the ash pit, and it worked very well.

I only used it one year before I sold the rig, but at the end of the first season they still looked like new.

[Sugarmaker]

All these points are great. Couple of items to add.
This arch with forced draft burns hot and like nothing I ever boiled with before the thin pallets I am using burn fast and hot. Since I don't get a lot of ash I may not get much insulating . I did go out last night and turn them upside down (point down) and I may try that for the first boils of 08 if I decide to make syrup this year.
Thanks for the ideas. Filling them with refractory cement is interesting:)

Chris

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

Chris,

What has come up to make you think you may not make syrup???

[RileySugarbush]

Chris,

I think the upside down angles will fill up with ash OK. Mine do and I have almost no ash in the pit. Once the ash gets below the opening between the angles there is little combustion air. If the angles are full of holes it will be another story.

John

[Sugarmaker]

Brandon,
Just testing you guys:) Like I was telling Theron I just made some additional investment in maple equipment, to hopefully reduce labor/stress in the sugarhouse, so I will need to work that off:) Why does it always seem to cost so much though. Dont try to answer that.
Just trying to help the economy!
I have been making syrup a long time and I guess I will keep going. Thanks for the support!

Chris

[parsissn]

I'm making some angle iron grates for my 2x6. I'm using 1.5"x1.5" angle which means the width across the top of the V is about 2". What spacing do you have between your grates? I'm thinking 1.5" between them but wanted to see what others have. As a side note, I don't use a blower so these are for just regular draft.

Mark

[maple flats]

My factory grates have about 3/8" between them. With the V down the air is less likely to get restricted (by ash) and more uniform air dispersion occures.