Tapping Huge Maples

[Greenrugger]

Looking for advice....I was given access to an old homestead that has 50 of the largest maples I have ever seen. The smallest is easily 30” dia and the largest is pushing over +48” planted in 3 neat rows all by themselves on about an acre and a half. In the middle of a flat field. With no other trees around so each has a huge canopy.

My question is how many gravity taps can I put on each tree? Landowner indicated he is likely to remove the trees in the next 3-5yrs so there is no long term tree health concerns. Does the 3 tap rule still apply? Will sap flow increase by adding more taps per tree or just max out? Curious before I set up a gravity line. I was thinking 5-6 taps per tree....on a single 5/16 going to a mainline, even then they would spaced out at 2-3’ around the trunk. I’ve never used vacuum before but would the investment in a 12v system pay for itself if I only have a few years to tap?

[Mead Maple]

Green I would stick to the 3 rule just in case his plans change. You would not want to be the one responsible for jeopardizing a stash of old growth beauties. Put the vacuum to them and watch it flow!


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[canaanmaple]

Looking for advice....I was given access to an old homestead that has 50 of the largest maples I have ever seen. The smallest is easily 30” dia and the largest is pushing over +48” planted in 3 neat rows all by themselves on about an acre and a half. In the middle of a flat field. With no other trees around so each has a huge canopy.

My question is how many gravity taps can I put on each tree? Landowner indicated he is likely to remove the trees in the next 3-5yrs so there is no long term tree health concerns. Does the 3 tap rule still apply? Will sap flow increase by adding more taps per tree or just max out? Curious before I set up a gravity line. I was thinking 5-6 taps per tree....on a single 5/16 going to a mainline, even then they would spaced out at 2-3’ around the trunk. I’ve never used vacuum before but would the investment in a 12v system pay for itself if I only have a few years to tap?

I know a few people that would do that, and have done that on trees that big. With buckets though since they are in flat fields. They are gushers with high sugar content! I am no expert myself nor have studied the affects of amounts of taps per tree. Just know what people do :)

[Pdiamond]

I am lucky enough to have between 12 and 15 of those trees on my property. I can't imagine how old they are, but I'll bet they could tell us some history back in the 1800's. I only put 2 taps in these trees. I want them around for a long time.

[Bucket Head]

Those are the best kind of tree's! Sounds like they were planted with sugaring in mind. I'd plead with the owner to save them. You'll wish you had them back after collecting the high sugar content from those gems.

And I second the above comments. Only do two taps. Much better for them. I cringe when I see large trees with buckets going around the whole thing! Senseless. And if they are saved, you will not have sped up their demise any. Enjoy them!

[jdircksen]

Is the tap count different for gravity vs vacuum? For example would you put 3 taps if using buckets, vs 2 taps if on vacuum?

[Bucket Head]

Yes, I believe so. Most all vacuum systems I've seen had one tap per tree- even big ones. With vacuum, your basically pulling sap from throughout the tree. So one tap provides a lot of sap. With gravity taps (buckets and non natural vacuum tubing) your only getting sap from above the tap hole- when and if it runs that day. So multiple taps will get you a little more. But the amount of sap doesn't keep multiplying with additional gravity taps. And over tapping is over tapping, regardless of spout type. Hold the taps to two even on those big ones.
good luck this season.

Steve

[Sugarmaker]

Well I would probably have 4 equally spaced taps per large tree and 3 per smaller. Yes he really needs to think about this removal thing! It took 150 years or more to grow those. See how they run not all trees are created equal. I like to tap with buckets if possible then you can reall see how each tree does! Make sure you give him syrup! I wished I had a couple sugarbushes like that. Build your slop into the system, start low finish higher away from the container. Start with a low collection container. You moght need a bluk tank atg the bottom end. What a nice problem to have!:
Good luck! Keep boiling!
Regards,
Chris

[fisheatingbagel]

Well I would probably have 4 equally spaced taps per large tree and 3 per smaller. Yes he really needs to think about this removal thing! It took 150 years or more to grow those. See how they run not all trees are created equal. I like to tap with buckets if possible then you can reall see how each tree does! Make sure you give him syrup! I wished I had a couple sugarbushes like that. Build your slop into the system, start low finish higher away from the container. Start with a low collection container. You moght need a bluk tank atg the bottom end. What a nice problem to have!:
Good luck! Keep boiling!
Regards,
ChrisA few years ago I tapped some huge maples on a farm about 20 miles from my house. The owner told me they had been tapped during the depression.

They were good sap producers, but it was tricky finding clear sap wood; lots of thick gnarly bark.

I've heard that without vacuum a tree will only flow so much sap, no matter how many taps.

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[DrTimPerkins]

Is the tap count different for gravity vs vacuum? For example would you put 3 taps if using buckets, vs 2 taps if on vacuum?

As already mentioned, gravity flow and vacuum flow are different.

Under gravity flow, most all sap flowing from a taphole is from the zone above the level of that tap, and mostly in a zone on the side of the tree above the taphole. There is some lateral movement of sap due to vessel-vessel interconnections, but the amount of lateral movement of sap is modest. This means that when you put in a second tap (on an appropriate-sized tree), you will get nearly double the amount of sap. On really large trees, you might get triple from a third bucket. With too many buckets though, your sap yield will eventually not increase by that much. The issue with large trees is that the growth rates are so low (the total volume of wood grown each year might be the same, but due to tree geometry the ring width gets smaller as trees get larger) that it can become hard to find sound wood (not stained) that produces lots of sap. Anytime you hit stained wood, you will get less sap (in proportion to the amount of stain you hit). Sap does NOT flow in stained wood.

For vacuum the situation is different. The zone from which sap comes from in the tree is much larger, and extends both above and below the taphole, and considerably more laterally in the stem. So when you add a second tap, you typically will get less than twice the sap volume because the two tapholes are competing (to some extent) for the same volume of sap. For a 16" tree you get around 50% more with a second tap (spread across the two taps). In a 19" tree, perhaps 65% more. That is for sugar maple. In red maple, early research results indicate it is considerably lower than that...perhaps half of what you might get with sugar maple (so 25% more with a 2nd tap in a 16" tree). We need to get a few more years of research before we can say with confidence what the results will be, but you surely will NOT get double the sap with a 2nd tap in a sugar or red maple unless it is very large. If you do use 2 taps in larger trees under vacuum, spread them out as far as you can vertically (tap very high and very low--below the lateral) and on opposite sides of the stem.

Tapping guidelines do not adequately address this yet.

[Michael Greer]

The main trouble with drilling four or five holes in a tree, no matter how big, is that after a couple years you begin to run out of places to drill. I have trees that held four taps for a few years, but I now only hang two buckets. It takes a good deal of study to find two places that are far enough from old tap holes. Don't be greedy. Two taps will give plenty of sap. Those 30 inch trees might live another 100 years if you don't kill them.

[jdircksen]

As already mentioned, gravity flow and vacuum flow are different.

Under gravity flow, most all sap flowing from a taphole is from the zone above the level of that tap, and mostly in a zone on the side of the tree above the taphole. There is some lateral movement of sap due to vessel-vessel interconnections, but the amount of lateral movement of sap is modest. This means that when you put in a second tap (on an appropriate-sized tree), you will get nearly double the amount of sap. On really large trees, you might get triple from a third bucket. With too many buckets though, your sap yield will eventually not increase by that much. The issue with large trees is that the growth rates are so low (the total volume of wood grown each year might be the same, but due to tree geometry the ring width gets smaller as trees get larger) that it can become hard to find sound wood (not stained) that produces lots of sap. Anytime you hit stained wood, you will get less sap (in proportion to the amount of stain you hit). Sap does NOT flow in stained wood.

For vacuum the situation is different. The zone from which sap comes from in the tree is much larger, and extends both above and below the taphole, and considerably more laterally in the stem. So when you add a second tap, you typically will get less than twice the sap volume because the two tapholes are competing (to some extent) for the same volume of sap. For a 16" tree you get around 50% more with a second tap (spread across the two taps). In a 19" tree, perhaps 65% more. That is for sugar maple. In red maple, early research results indicate it is considerably lower than that...perhaps half of what you might get with sugar maple (so 25% more with a 2nd tap in a 16" tree). We need to get a few more years of research before we can say with confidence what the results will be, but you surely will NOT get double the sap with a 2nd tap in a sugar or red maple unless it is very large. If you do use 2 taps in larger trees under vacuum, spread them out as far as you can vertically (tap very high and very low--below the lateral) and on opposite sides of the stem.

Tapping guidelines do not adequately address this yet.

Thank you for the info. I'll have to keep an eye out this year for "stained" wood when I tap. Given that I hope to be tapping my backyard trees for the next 40 years, I like the thought of using vacuum and drilling fewer holes. I fear that it will be hard to a spot to tap if I continue putting 3 holes in the 30" trees. But vacuum takes all the fun out of carrying buckets through the mud :)

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