2019 Tubing Adventure

[Maple Man 85]

We’re tubing up another 40acres and have decided to play with the idea of something other than Leader tubing. For the record I’m very pleased with the performance of my current system just shopping around. Everyone is offering discounts on equipment let’s hear what works... This is not intended to be a slam the manufacturer thread this is an open discussion between sugar makers. You’ve all been warned 👍👍

[GeneralStark]

Are you just wondering about mainline, tubing and fittings or a full install?

If I were going to be tubing a woods, I would use all CDL and would use spin seals instead of saddles. Might even go with the pre wire-lashed mainline. Max flow hooked connectors T's and dead end T's.

[unc23win]

Lapierre is having a huge sale this week only, they are calling it cash and carry! 1” is .28 a foot 5/16 $34-$44 a roll. After that the summer discounts are until June 20.

[BAP]

Make sure you know what you are getting for product. High density versus low density mainline. The plastic reacts differently to temperature changes. High density will expand and contract more potentially causing fittings to come apart over time. Research what you are buying to make sure the cheapest isn’t the most hateful to use over time. I have used some in the past that seemed like a great deal up front but became a nightmare in the woods.

[n8hutch]

Make sure you know what you are getting for product. High density versus low density mainline. The plastic reacts differently to temperature changes. High density will expand and contract more potentially causing fittings to come apart over time. Research what you are buying to make sure the cheapest isn’t the most hateful to use over time. I have used some in the past that seemed like a great deal up front but became a nightmare in the woods.

That's interesting Bap, Maybe we should start a thread on what kind of tubing is easier to work with. I always figured that the HD stuff would last longer maybe that's not the case? As far as I'm concerned they all suck to work with when they are cold.

I like the look of the DSD saddles. I haven't tried them but I will this Fall when I run some more mainline.

[Russell Lampron]

I've used Leader, US Maple, IPL and CDL tubing over the years and like the CDL the best. The IPL tubing that I have in my woods was what they used to call Pink Stripe. I can't think of what CDL calls it now but it's the same tubing that the IPL was without the pink stripe. It's softer than the semi rigid tubing and is easy to see through. It's all that I use now for repairs and new installs.

[Delta Glen]

We have used leader, D&G and H20. Last season we switched to medium density d&g and h20. H20 has a little thicker side wall and didn't compress as much when installing saddles. HD tubing was only used for the long stretch to woods, 2000ft, where only a few fittings were used. I would not want to use HD in areas where alot of fittings are going to be used. Imo the tubing is less concern vs the installation. We only use 9ga wire, wire splices (no ratchets) and side tie alot. Maybe overkill but it's nice to see deer bounce off it vs breaking wire or splitting ratchet apart. In full disclosure we are a h20 dealer.

[mol1jb]

If your current brand works well I would stick with that since you know what to expect. I second the dsd saddles.

[motowbrowne]

In my limited experience, h2o tubing has 30p beat by a long shot.

[maplwrks]

I haven't ever used any tubing other than Leader 30p. It stays cleaner than any other brand. It comes with a caveat though. You need to use Leader fittings with it. You can't achieve max vacuum by using different and cheaper brands. I am still looking for a softer tubing that I like. This could be a very interesting thread to watch.

DSD saddles are king! I think spin seals may be good, but I would like to see what happens 5 years out when the sun has worked on them.

[Maple Man 85]

It is nice to watch the deer bounce off the mainline, watched it happen last year when I kicked a few up. 2 of the 3 made it through gracefully the last one not so much!:lol:

[Maple Man 85]

DSD saddles are king! I think spin seals may be good, but I would like to see what happens 5 years out when the sun has worked on them.[/QUOTE]

I am also curious to see what time and weather does to spin seal fittings.

[Maple Man 85]

So I’m formulating a plan for the tubing system... it’s going to be a bit of a Frankenstein job but experimenting is what pushes the industry... thinking D&G mainline with DSD Saddles with D&G 5/16 laterals with Leader Max Flow 3/16 drops and leader stubby spouts (seasonal Y1 Y2 check valve spouts).

This also allows me to compare 3/16 to 5/16 as one of my properties is all 3/16. Decision is being based on a blend of cost savings on the tubing versus longevity versus material workability. When all is said and done I know not every manufacturer makes the best everything so bringing a combination of supplies together should be very interesting.

Keep the thread going I may continue to change parts of this formula as more people post...

[Kh7722]

Without a doubt I prefer h2o equipment, by far the easiest and best quality in my opinion. There tubing is easy to work with and seals like you wouldn’t believe, and the customer support is great. Just my 2cents. Not a dealer

[n8hutch]

What is the thought behind using a 3/16 drop on a 5/16 lateral, sap travels back up a 3/16 line up to 4x as far or 12' or more when the trees freeze up at night. I think/thought that most people including me are running 5/16 drops on 3/16 laterals. I certainly understand that you intend to use check valves in year 2 but even still are they as effective on a 3/16 line? I'm not sure.

[Maple Man 85]

What is the thought behind using a 3/16 drop on a 5/16 lateral, sap travels back up a 3/16 line up to 4x as far or 12' or more when the trees freeze up at night. I think/thought that most people including me are running 5/16 drops on 3/16 laterals. I certainly understand that you intend to use check valves in year 2 but even still are they as effective on a 3/16 line? I'm not sure.

I'm not really concerned with sap traveling backwards, once we start the pumps for the year they stay on unless there is an extended freeze. I have 3/16 material left over from my last install and DSD has a 5/16 to 3/16 T fitting. To be perfectly honest I don't know if I'd gain/lose or remain the same in terms of sap per tap.

[n8hutch]

I guess it may not be much of an issue maybe 1 tap isn't enough to fill the drop anyway.

[Maplewalnut]

I like cdl tubing for drops and fittings, D&G stiff for laterals and DSD saddles.

[GeneralStark]

When 3/16" tubing became a thing for suppliers to manufacture, I was looking through fittings at CDL in St Albans. They had a bunch of t's for 5/16 laterals and 3/16 drops. I inquired as to what the idea was there and they said the thinking was that the 3/16" would generate vac. over the length of the drop... oh really I thought... seemed questionable as there is certainly not enough sap to fill the drop in most situations. I see they still have the fittings there but I don't think they have sold very many.

Having experimented with 3/16 on vac for several seasons now, I think one of the major challenges is the fittings clogging up. I do use 5/16 drops and CV2 spouts and change the drop out every other year. This year I used CV2 spouts on some new drops and those seemed to run the longest. As Nate mentioned, backflow in 3/16 is substantial, even on vac, so whatever can be done to minimize blockages and backflow to the taphole seems key with 3/16. The blockage issue is why I would be concerned about the longevity of a fitting for a 3/16 drop on 5/16. I just can't see how 3/16 drops would provide an advantage for sap yields.

And as far as concerns about spin seals lasting... is it the material (same as the mainline) holding up that's the concern, or the weld holding up?

[Maple Man 85]

And as far as concerns about spin seals lasting... is it the material (same as the mainline) holding up that's the concern, or the weld holding up?[/QUOTE]

I was more concerned about the weld, heating plastic generally makes it more brittle. Maybe with having the proper heat setting they would be just as durable as the mainline itself if the plastic isn't being overheated...