Sugar sand post filter questions

[csk91]

Ok I collect the sap and run it through an RO bucket for 1 pass.

I boil it on a flat pan until the temp hits 219 and the bubbles start rising up in the pan. I either hit it with a sliver of butter or remove the pan from heat.

Next I draw the hot syrup from the pan through a wool cone filter lined with a paper filter into a Smokey lakes filter box.

I carry the filter box to the stove in the house and bring it back to a boil (never cools down)use my hydrometer to verify I have 32 brix. Once I have the hydrometer correct I bottle into mason jars.

I am getting 1/4 inch of sugar sand in all of my jars after cooling.

Any ideas? Do I need to filter again before bottling? Should I draw off directly into a finishing pan to get the brix correct and then filter it through the wool/ paper filters?


Any ideas?

Thanks

[tpathoulas]

I think bringing back to boil is my idea for your problem. I have had the same issue in the past. According to people I have spoken with, once you get to proper brix, if you heat to over 190 F sugar sand will begin form. I bottle in glass and was told I needed to bottle when syrup is above 190 F to ensure proper heat sterilization. After noticing my sand issue I began to do some research and discovered the 190 mark. I now bottle around 185. I also filter with only paper filter one more time prior too heating to 185. Might be overkill but I get a nice clear syrup.
Hope this helps.

[csk91]

Yeah you May be right. Maybe the solution is getting it closer to 32 brix on the main pan before I draw off.

[DrTimPerkins]

I think you probably mean 32 Baume. 32 Brix is far too thin. Actually, 32 Baume is only about 59 Brix. You should be aiming for at least 35.6 Baume (66 Brix).

You should pack syrup at 180-190 deg F. Anytime you go above that, you need to filter.

[csk91]

Thanks. I appreciate the reply. Yes I am using the wrong terminology. The short hydrometer I have from Bascom has me aiming for 32 at 211. So that’s what I boil to. Seems to be right to me. I just need to change my process a bit. Thanks.

[wnybassman]

Bringing back to a boil after filtering is definitely the issue.

[David Wayne]

I had the same problem untill I started filtering into a stainless pot suspended in a pot of boiling water to keep it hot while canning.

[Sugarmaker]

Good advice, Yes you don't want to reboil after filtering! Just bring it up to 180 for canning. The reboiling is causing the sugarsand.
Regards,
Chris

[Msboucha]

In our small operation, we filter multiple times throughout the boil...draw off, filter, continue boiling and then do a final filter just short of the right brix. Once we are at the right brix, we draw off into our mason jars/seal them. We set the jars aside and within a few days you will see the niter settle. For the syrup we use for ourselves, we simply pour off the top and then put the last bit with niter into another jar in the fridge - eventually we'll pour off of this jar of misfit pourings. For the syrup we give to family/friends, we pour off the top into a pot, being careful to not get niter (you will see it coming in the pour) and then reheat that to 180-200F and repack into nicer cans/jugs/jars - be careful to not let it micro boil on the bottom or you will get more niter - double boiler is best. Again, the bit that is left in the original jars goes into the fridge to resettle and eventually be poured off. Not a perfect system, but it makes for nice clear syrup to give away and works for us.

[maple flats]

You don't need to do all of the "resettling", but it does work if you choose to do it. Just get your syrup to the correct density, then filter it hot. Then only reheat it slowly to 185-190 max and bottle it then. Anytime you boil again you form more niter. That"s because syrup is saturated with minerals, if you boil away more water the excess minerals settle out. If you remove no additional water there is no new niter formed.

[Sugarmaker]

In our small operation, we filter multiple times throughout the boil...draw off, filter, continue boiling and then do a final filter just short of the right brix. Once we are at the right brix, we draw off into our mason jars/seal them. We set the jars aside and within a few days you will see the niter settle. For the syrup we use for ourselves, we simply pour off the top and then put the last bit with niter into another jar in the fridge - eventually we'll pour off of this jar of misfit pourings. For the syrup we give to family/friends, we pour off the top into a pot, being careful to not get niter (you will see it coming in the pour) and then reheat that to 180-200F and repack into nicer cans/jugs/jars - be careful to not let it micro boil on the bottom or you will get more niter - double boiler is best. Again, the bit that is left in the original jars goes into the fridge to resettle and eventually be poured off. Not a perfect system, but it makes for nice clear syrup to give away and works for us.

Yes like Dave said your going through a lot of unnecessary work with the settling process. You didn't say what type of filtering your using?
This method should work for you and maybe save you some steps:
Boil syrup to the correct density, filter hot through a felt cone and a prefilter. (niter should be in the filter). After that, bring the syrup back to 180 F and bottle. Should be done and should be clear.
Good luck!
Regards,
Chris

[Msboucha]

Yes like Dave said your going through a lot of unnecessary work with the settling process. You didn't say what type of filtering your using?
This method should work for you and maybe save you some steps:
Boil syrup to the correct density, filter hot through a felt cone and a prefilter. (niter should be in the filter). After that, bring the syrup back to 180 F and bottle. Should be done and should be clear.
Good luck!
Regards,
Chris

No, I understand the preferred method, but I find even then, sometimes the cone filter doesn't get all the niter and you will eventually have a small amount settle out. I was just outlining how we do it for the OP which can be helpful if you want to be sure you have no niter when packing in glass. I probably wasn't that clear in my description. We aren't doing it that much different than you described - cone filter and then reheat and pack, we jsut dont do it all the same day. We are working off grid in the cold and generally don't have time to wait for all the syrup to pass through the cone filter/it begins to cool too quickly/runs through even slower. So in an effort to save time, we pack it all as fast as we can without a final filtering (hence the reason we run through a filter short of it being to brix), this way it does not cool at all before hitting the jars. Since we only re-pack the little bit we give away and it is generally into fancy glass containers, it really isn't much more work to only reheat a few gallons/repack and be 100% sure we won't have any niter.

[Sugarmaker]

No, I understand the preferred method, but I find even then, sometimes the cone filter doesn't get all the niter and you will eventually have a small amount settle out. I was just outlining how we do it for the OP which can be helpful if you want to be sure you have no niter when packing in glass. I probably wasn't that clear in my description. We aren't doing it that much different than you described - cone filter and then reheat and pack, we jsut dont do it all the same day. We are working off grid in the cold and generally don't have time to wait for all the syrup to pass through the cone filter/it begins to cool too quickly/runs through even slower. So in an effort to save time, we pack it all as fast as we can without a final filtering (hence the reason we run through a filter short of it being to brix), this way it does not cool at all before hitting the jars. Since we only re-pack the little bit we give away and it is generally into fancy glass containers, it really isn't much more work to only reheat a few gallons/repack and be 100% sure we won't have any niter.
Msboucha,
Yes your fine in how your filtering! Thanks for the description of your process. Yes it will help others.
Regards,
Chris

[maple flats]

Try mixing some filter aid (DE) into the hot syrup before pouring it into the flat or cone filter, it will help filter the fines out.

[Nickkateclark]

I didn’t know you could use DE with a cone type filter. Do others have experience with this?

-nick

[csk91]

Thank you for your feedback. I filtered 1 more time after getting the correct density and everything was perfect. Thanks!

[fisheatingbagel]

Nick,
I've used DE with cone filters, and it definitely helps especially for really fine sand and extra heavy sand.

[Msboucha]

I've used DE with cone filters, and it definitely helps especially for really fine sand and extra heavy sand.

Fisheatingbagel - what did you use for a DE to syrup ratio? 0.5 cup/gallon? Honestly have no idea having never tried this, but interested... Thanks!

[fisheatingbagel]

Msboucha,
Very little DE, at least I think compared to filter presses. Start with 0.25 per gallon, and go from there. Also, make sure you mix the DE well with the syrup before going into the filter.

[Msboucha]

Great, thank you!