Input on design of 3/16 and 5/6 lines

[tgormley358]

This is my 4th year sugaring, just my 2nd year using tubing, all gravity. I'm up to around 90 taps across my lot and several neighbors. Last year was fun learning to run tubing with input from a couple of local friends. Sap ran pretty well here, but i had variable results across eight lines, so i'm planning to change the design and looking for input. I have no main lines, only laterals last year some 5/16 and some 3/16 into my tanks, each 150-200' long. I've tried to pick up lessons from reading here and elsewhere from others on the best design of lines for maximizing gravity flow. Based on that input i'm planning to re-design and interested in what others think about it. I created some visuals in PPT of these lines, and attach here if you want to look. These are a few of the design principles i've picked up that i plan to follow:

1. Use 3/16 only if you have enough slope, at least 25' and you want good slope especially at the end of the line. Otherwise use 5/16. Last year i did well with 3/16 on two lines with 25' slope. But i also experimented with one 3/16 line on a slope of around 10-15', and got a similar sap output vs. a parallel 5/16 line on the same slope. Another 5/16 line on that same slope didn't run well, but I'm sure that was due to a clog that i couldn't find, rather than anything about tubing size.

2. On 5/16 lines, have between 5 and 10 taps, no more. I think i got this right. That's pretty close to what i had as you can see in my visuals.

3. On 3/16 lines, have at least 10 taps but more is better up to something like 25? Last year I didn't do this, so it's one of the things i'm planning to change -- combining two or more lines into one on 3/16. Last year i had two 3/16 lines on 25' slope, each with 7-8 taps, so i plan to combine them.

4. Zig-zagging of lines is OK in order to increase the # of taps per line on 3/16. To combine the two lines above, i'll have quite a bit of zig-zagging and therefore more flat areas and a couple short up-slopes in the one combined line. I've heard this is OK and will be fine for flow as long as i get some decent vacuum from gravity. On this one slope i have 15' drop the last 40', which i've heard is what you want. (pages 5-7 in attachment show the trees, the 2018 design, and the 2019 plan)

On the less steep slope of 10-15' (pages 1-4 in attachment), last year i had 3 lines nearest the road of 5-8 taps each, one on 5/16 that ran well, one that didn't, and one 3/16 that seemed to run as well as the 5/16. I'm thinking of combining these into a single line of 3/16 with ~20 taps, with a fair amount of zig zagging, more flat and a tiny bit of uphill. The last 50' only has maybe 5' of drop. Is this a bad idea with so little slope?

There's another 20 taps in the same general area further uphill (same pages 1-4 in attach), that i'm thinking combining also into one line, with similar total slope. Last year I had used 5/16 on this with Y's tying 3 different lines together to get some large 3' diameter trees. That didn't seem to work so well. Volume in the lines from the big trees was minimal to dry. So i'm hoping replacing the Y's with a single line will be a good thing.

People have told me not to bother with main lines on this small bush, but i included one picture on page 4 of half-dozen laterals all running to the road into a main line. It would be around 40 taps total. Bad idea, waste of time?

So in total i'm thinking of going from 8 lines to 3 and these would all be 3/16. Thanks for any thoughts.

Tom
19404

[Hop Kiln Road]

Tom -

Agree with all that. However, I think more important in gravity systems - buckets to 3/16 - is one, quality of tap placement in the tree and two, quality of the tree and three, simply the weather.

Bruce

[SeanD]

With all of your lines going to the same spot, this is an ideal opportunity for vacuum. You don't have to put it in this year, but if you set it up for it, it will always be an option. Your 4 principals are pretty much right, with the one add on being that 5 is the ideal max for mechanical vacuum on 5/16". Of course adding a sixth doesn't ruin the whole set up, but when you have a choice between one lat with 7 to 8 taps, it's generally better to do 4 and 4 or 5 and 3.

Definitely get rid of the Ys. Give each branch of the Y a dedicated run to the tank. Combining those three flatter lines into one 3/16" doesn't sound right, but maybe I'm not picturing it.

I've found mainline to be the most helpful in situations where there are flat areas especially the run to the tank. Maybe that's what you have here.

Don't use last year for too much of a gauge. That was a weird year for weather/runs around here. As Bruce said, there are a lot of other factors in judging the success of a se

Will this be coming down every year? That plays a part in my decision making.

[tgormley358]

With all of your lines going to the same spot, this is an ideal opportunity for vacuum. You don't have to put it in this year, but if you set it up for it, it will always be an option. Your 4 principals are pretty much right, with the one add on being that 5 is the ideal max for mechanical vacuum on 5/16". Of course adding a sixth doesn't ruin the whole set up, but when you have a choice between one lat with 7 to 8 taps, it's generally better to do 4 and 4 or 5 and 3.

Definitely get rid of the Ys. Give each branch of the Y a dedicated run to the tank. Combining those three flatter lines into one 3/16" doesn't sound right, but maybe I'm not picturing it.

I've found mainline to be the most helpful in situations where there are flat areas especially the run to the tank. Maybe that's what you have here.

Don't use last year for too much of a gauge. That was a weird year for weather/runs around here. As Bruce said, there are a lot of other factors in judging the success of a se

Will this be coming down every year? That plays a part in my decision making.

Woodville, i will be able to keep this tubing mostly up all year. A portion i probably will need to remove for neighbor's easy access and use of his lot. I think you're suggesting going with the option with more laterals on 5/16 into a mainline along the road, then into my tank. I'm new to mainlines, and to adding vacuum. I assume adding vacuum requires electricity which is a little complicated since it's my neighbor's property and his electric bill.

As far as tapping quality and sanitation goes, I plan to replace all taps and drops this year.

Tom

[Sugarmaker]

Down hill and tight for gravity systems! I have 25 taps on 5/16. Seem to do ok on created slope of 3 to 5%. I have not tried 3/16 since I dont have the slope. Maybe 3/16 will draw some up hill a little ways But I would try to have some slope to allow drainage.
Regards,
Chris

[tgormley358]

Here’s what I’ve decided. Given that I’m a small backyard producer and don’t need to absolute max out production or profit, I’m ok with getting fairly low vacuum on the 40 ish taps in the relatively less steep (10%) grade, so I’m going with replacing the six 5/16 lines with two lines of 3/16. I’ve heard my 12’ of drop will provide 8-10” of vacuum, and I’ll take that. The cost of adding vacuum equipment for 40 taps probably isn’t worth it where I have no electric available. I’m happy with this and will see how it goes. I plan to use new 5/16 drops but re use tees from last year after boiling.