Clear sap but smell to syrup

[mff]

I’m having an issue with a musty smell as I boil. I have all new tubing, and am boiling all the sap the same evening of the day it runs. I boil in batches on a flat pan. Last night I boiled a new batch of just new sap in a clean pan, and still have the smell. From what I read here, I suspect bacteria. I do have an 800 foot run of tubing to get to my collection barrel, and the barrel is in the afternoon sun.

Am I thinking in the right direction that I need to shorten the run by moving the barrel further up the hill, and to try to get it out of the sun?

[Sugarmaker]

Could be bacteria, also could be metabolic sap. My guess based on what you have mentioned its metabolic. Might be buddy sap too?
Regards,
Chris

[mff]

Thank for the ideas - It feels early for buddy. Usually I see the Reds changing on my 40 mile commute down (lower) and south of here before we get buddy here. Is there anyone else in So VT or SW NH that has buddy flavor yet?

Metabolic worries me because I’m not sure there is a good response. I have tried taking some syrup to 238 degrees and then diluting back, but while it makes it edible, I’m hardy proud of it. I should note we’ve made some very nice flavored and light colored syrup this year.

I’m about to throw in the towel (I boiled and then dumped 30 gal of sap the other day), but I am looking to expand to a few hundred taps in the next few years and need to get a handle on this.

[Sugarmaker]

Good to know that you made good syrup this season. If your buds are holding I would bet its metabolic. Can you taste a cardboard or objectionable flavor? It can happen almost any time in the season. I made some very bad I think I had a mild case during my early part of the season. I would not let this stop you from tapping more trees next year. When you get a handle on mother nature let us know. :) Dr. Tim may come along and have some ideas.
Regards,
Chris

[mff]

Good to know that you made good syrup this season. If your buds are holding I would bet its metabolic. Can you taste a cardboard or objectionable flavor?

Starting with raw sap there is no smell when first boiling. Then it creeps in. I’ve got 20g of sap worth on a pot on the stove in the house, and the smell is obvious. I think of the smell as musty, like an old pair of dirty socks. The taste is more of an immediate aftertaste. Maybe cardboard. Not horrid, but definitely not right.

Chuckling about Mother Nature comment. Gene Logsdon writes of her as old Btch Nature, and at times that’s quite apt. I checked your location on the map, and the closet I’ve been is Warriors Mark. Dr Tim had a colleague who passed recently who was raised on a dairy farm a little to your south (Bob Parsons, a good friend gone too soon).

[maple flats]

If it smells like dirty socks it is likely buddy syrup, that is a telltail sign and description of boiling buddy sap. Someplace in your system you might have a tree or a few that are maybe in a southern exposure bowl where some have budded.

[Haynes Forest Products]

Are you sure its not the wallpaper paste your smelling if your finishing in the kitchen?? SORRY couldn't resist.:cry:

[GeneralStark]

Dirty sock odor when boiling is how I describe the first signs that trees are starting to bud... But yes, getting your barrel in the shade would certainly be a good thing. Has the sap been been clear or cloudy?

[bowtie]

Definitely sounds like metabolic to me, I have had this happen and you can't tell from the sap but once you start boiling it becomes evident. I would dump the affected sap or syrup and go on, it can take a couple of days to a couple weeks for this to "clear" up. As others would tell you, to check sap later just bring in a little to the stove and boil it down, if it is good there will be no off smell, if not you will not have wasted time or resources boil a big batch down. It just one of those curveballs Mother Nature throws at us.

[mff]

Are you sure its not the wallpaper paste your smelling if your finishing in the kitchen?? SORRY couldn't resist.:cry:

Don’t you have some leaks to go fix? (Smile)

[mff]

Dirty sock odor when boiling is how I describe the first signs that trees are starting to bud... But yes, getting your barrel in the shade would certainly be a good thing. Has the sap been been clear or cloudy?

The sap has looked clear, smells and tastes good. Too busy at work this week to shift the barrel. Sigh.

[mff]

—snip— Someplace in your system you might have a tree or a few that are maybe in a southern exposure bowl where some have budded.

All my trees have a southwestern exposure that can get baked by the afternoon sun. I’m worried you are right, but it just doesn’t “feel” like the end yet. I’m more used to buckets, seeing a few cloudy buckets, picking out moths, etc before the end comes.

[mff]

Definitely sounds like metabolic to me, I have had this happen and you can't tell from the sap but once you start boiling it becomes evident. I would dump the affected sap or syrup and go on, it can take a couple of days to a couple weeks for this to "clear" up. As others would tell you, to check sap later just bring in a little to the stove and boil it down, if it is good there will be no off smell, if not you will not have wasted time or resources boil a big batch down. It just one of those curveballs Mother Nature throws at us.

I hope you are right. I should note we had a batch earlier this way, and then a great batch, and then an off batch. None of the sap was aged/abused other than the long tubing run and sunny barrel.

In the name of curiosity, I’ll keep trying. I like the idea of trying a pan on the stove (wallpaper needs to come down anyway). I expect there is sap in the barrel tonight, and since I got home after dark I was going to pretend it wasn’t out there, but now I’m hopeful (desperately so?)

Thanks, all, for the thoughts.

[mff]

Brought home half a barrel of clear sap. Tests at 2.2, which is the best I’ve seen this year. Boiling a pot inside...

[mff]

Monday night’s sap was bad. Got busy at work the rest of the week, but decided to try some more fresh sap that ran this morning. This has crossed the border from bad to awful. It didn’t smell like what I was smelling earlier, but the near-syrup flavor makes you want to spit and rinse.

Again, as the closing waltz plays, thanks for the comments.

[maple flats]

Before I had an insulated bulk tank in a shaded location, I used a plastic 550 gal water tank and I covered it with a piece of 90% shade cloth to keep it cooler. That might help, if heating the sap is the issue.

[mff]

I am fairly sure I wasn’t recognizing the early buddy flavor as such. Today’s sap came after a cold night with fresh snow on the ground, and not a lot of sun this morning (meaning I’m pretty sure the sap didn’t get too warm in the barrel), so I’m sure today’s flavor is the trees rather than my poor handling.

Next year these 3/16 lines will tie into the upper end of my original 50-tap layout, and the storage for that is under some pines, so it should stay much cooler.

I’ve seen others in this area folding their tents this week, too. It is a bummer, because now we have days in the 40’s and freezing nights forecast for the next week. Time to wash up and then start checking fences.