Got inspected today

[Haynes Forest Products]

I get inspected every so often and this year we have a new inspector that came out. I was told that this year would be tough with the new laws and what not. I got advice from a few others in my area. They all run RO's so the word was out to play dumb and don't mention that you use your RO water to rinse the unit. I found the inspectors to be very nice, professional and very knowledgeable about sanitation. I felt that sanitation is the big hang up. They kept wanting to know how I sanitize everything and once I explained that aster washing and sanitizing that I would RINCE everything with clean water from my inspected well that passed a water test and that is when they told me that rinsing off the sanitizer was not recommended. They said that my sanitizer would not be a problem coming in contact with the sap.

I have 5 sinks in my two rooms, the evap room has a sink and then 4 sinks in the kitchen. They kept getting hung up on what sink I used for washing my hands and that I needed to designate just one sink for washing sinks. I explained that when I'm running the RO, evaporator, finish pan, filter press and filling drums I wash my hands in the closest sink. They kept coming back to having just one designated sink. :confused: Now are they suggesting I have 3 sinks always with 3 different spigots all running so I can wash my hands then go to the next sink and rinse them and then dunk my hands in Sanitizer and go back to picking my nose..............OOOOOPS deleate that and go get the transfer house out of the mud.

I get it but I'm trying to get things done. Now I'm better off not washing my hands if I cant do it right. When we were wrapping up and chatting I asked if it was required to wash your hands after loading wood into the firebox if the sink was in a different building. I think I saw the one inspectors head explode.

[billyinvt]

Exploding heads are an automatic inspection failure.

[Scm]

..........

[ecolbeck]

Another government harassing the little guy story. As long as you don’t say your against this abuse, your ok to stay on the forums.

;) ;)

Another poster who hears one side of the story and accepts it as truth. If I keep reading I'll eventually believe him.

[Haynes Forest Products]

Nope not going there. I really didn't mind the inspection it's part of the process and it needs to be done. I do think it's to much of a general all inclusive inspection and not geared towards maple syrup productio. I would be more concerned if the just cashed myy check and didn't look inside my operation.

[S.S.S]

Is this a state inspection or fda inspection.

[jmayerl]

Must have been inspection day. She was at my place bright and early at 8am...I was of course there at 6 to tidy up the place. Had a leaking water line so thought I would tighten up the clamp.....oops, line blew and running to menards for parts. Needed to replace all the way to the water heater,knock knock it's 8 AM time for inspection. parts pieces all over the floor. Lots of talking, and two hours later she left and wouldn't sign off until I send her a video of hot water running out the sink.
Caught two more trips for plumbing parts and it's all brand new, video sent, 3 PM time to start up for the night. Worst part is that was only state FDA is coming next week.

[Haynes Forest Products]

Yea mine was the state inspection. When they drove in I noticed they were in a rusted out car a was thinking they were lost so when they were leaving I asked if the state couldn't afford better cars..................OOOOOOPs it was her car :emb:

[Haynes Forest Products]

I didn't know having hot water was a requirement for sanitation. They kept saying that unless I could show that I had constant water temps above the sanitation level that I had to use sanitizer.

[Michael Greer]

Yikes! You guys need to get out of Wisconsin.

[GeneralStark]

Why are you being inspected by the FDA? DO you sell more than 50% bulk or is Wisconsin just clueless?

[jmayerl]

Why are you being inspected by the FDA? DO you sell more than 50% bulk or is Wisconsin just clueless?
Not sure how I got on the list be be inspected. I have been registered with the FDA for 5 years. 100% of sales are direct to grocery stores, about 600 gallons.

[Louie]

What type of sanitizer are they wanting people to use?

[prairietapper]

Nope not going there. I really didn't mind the inspection it's part of the process and it needs to be done. I do think it's to much of a general all inclusive inspection and not geared towards maple syrup productio. I would be more concerned if the just cashed myy check and didn't look inside my operation.

I hear you! although when I first talked to our county health dept about making syrup. they said I had to have a triple sink large enough to completely submerge the evaporator pan....

[Haynes Forest Products]

My impression is the tripple was sinks is more about washing hands first and equipment second. When asked I explained that if the equipment woukld fit in the sink I would clean it in the sink. If it was a stand alone piece of equipment it would be cleaned in place. Floor drains then became their next concern and that is that the water drained to the floor drain and any standing water was swept into the drain. They inspect micro brewery's and don't expect the Mastun to be removed from the floor and put in a sink.

I felt that once your face to face with the person doing the inspecting then they realize the realizations of their request isn't one size fits all. Milk trucks get washed and sanitized every day but not in sinks.

[Galena]

Strictly fwiw in basically every restaurant kitchen I've ever been in and/or worked in, there is the triple-sink setup whose purpose is for washing equipment only, with dishes getting rinsed off and then loaded into an industrial dishwasher. A smaller, separate sink is for use as a handwashing sink and is usually clearly marked for that purpose.

[prairietapper]

on the flip side. When I see what so many post in public about what they collect in, want to collect in. etc.
it is no wonder the powers that be feel they must get more proactive.

[Road's End]

Strictly fwiw in basically every restaurant kitchen I've ever been in and/or worked in, there is the triple-sink setup whose purpose is for washing equipment only, with dishes getting rinsed off and then loaded into an industrial dishwasher. A smaller, separate sink is for use as a handwashing sink and is usually clearly marked for that purpose.

Same here. I work at a small ski hill in the winter and we had to add a small hand washing sink next to the triple wash sink a few years back because it didn't meet the code. It has a nice big sign over it "hand wash only"

[S.S.S]

I just found out couple days ago that a local big producer is using a buddy of mines stainless milk semi trailer that he now uses for fertilizer to store over flow sap into!

[paulslund]

I just found out couple days ago that a local big producer is using a buddy of mines stainless milk semi trailer that he now uses for fertilizer to store over flow sap into!

That sounds pretty crappy!

[argohauler]

Neighbour hauls manure in his dump truck and then corn or beans Washes it out, but still. I've heard of guys hauling garbage and then grains....Nice eh?

[Bucket Head]

I just scratched corn and beans off my grocery list.

Going back to the sinks, it is a regulation- at least here in NY, that your 3-bay sink has to be big enough to submerge your biggest pot or pan in. Otherwise you fail your health inspection. However, having a sink large enough to submerge one's syrup pan is unrealistic at best.

But in a related story, I once sold an average size three bay sink to a guy who makes kettle corn. Obviously his equipment wasn't going to fit in it and I asked him about it. He said he asked the inspector about that too and they said, "Just get the three bay sink installed and we will go from there". What that meant was that he'd have the correct sink in place for 98% of his equipment and the huge kettle and paddle would not be an issue. He's still in business so I guess there is some leeway or compromise in there somewhere. So be polite and smile a lot when your inspector visits. It will help.

Steve

[mellondome]

He would have to have a CIP (clean in place) procedure for his kettle. Same as you would for a RO, evaporator, drawoff tank, water jacket canner, head tank, milk tank or transport tank.

[Bucket Head]

I'm not doubting you- I just don't know what procedure or arrangement allowed him to use the "small" sink. I'm just saying there must be ways to work around certain types of equipment. A polite conversation with an inspector should shed light on the subject.

And do not comment on their rusty car....lol!

[Haynes Forest Products]

I doubt that they make a micro brew stick their fermenters in sinks or a brewery takes their copper kettle that's bolted to the floor and stick it in a sink. I would ask them as they walk out the door how to wash a dish washer. They didn't ask how I clean my filter press. I believe they know there are a lot of grey areas and don't even ask because they don't know the answer. I open up my press and punch out the cake and back in they go spray down with super hot water and install papers and get back to filtering. I guarantee after I change over to filtering and circulate into the finish pan my press it sterile.

I understand that were selling to the public but I don't sterilize my pots and pans at home.

[johnallin]

I'm all for keeping my equipment clean - but, to be honest, mostly for taste and grade.
Since the last thing touching our syrup are the 185-190 degree walls of the bottler, which sterilizes it, I don't fully understand the need for special sinks etc.
The product is boiled, filtered and then re-heated to canning temperature before it reaches the consumer. There are far greater opportunities for contamination in a street vendor's food cart...where do they keep their sinks??

[heus]

Yep this is why I'm probably getting out of the bulk syrup business. The federal government can stay off my property!

[jmayerl]

Why are you being inspected by the FDA? DO you sell more than 50% bulk or is Wisconsin just clueless?

Federal inspection went great. Was even better and easier going than the state was.

[Haynes Forest Products]

Jay tell us more about it and what were they looking for?? That's my next step to ruling the world.

[DaveB]

Federal inspection went great. Was even better and easier going than the state was.


Jay tell us more about it and what were they looking for?? That's my next step to ruling the world.

Yeah, I'd like to know more about that as well. I'm in the process of equiping my commercial kitchen space and I'm torn between what kind of sinks to get. I know I need a hand wash sink but for the main sink to wash everything I'm wondering if I should get a 1, 2 or 3 bay sink. We don't health department inspections but if I'm packing someone else's syrup I know the FDA can inspect the facility and I don't know what they require. I've looked at some nice large one bay models that would be great for washing pans I use for canning or making sugar. I could do the same with a 2 bay model but I know there might be a requirement for the three bay model as well. I just want to get what I need and not have to replace it a year down the line!

[Super Sapper]

What I was told when looking was a 3 basin sink, wash, rinse and sanitize. Then a separate hand wash sink with a hands free faucet.