FINALLY have ro running

[cjf12]

Plumbed most of the day and finally got to turn the pumps on. Things seem to be running good but then I have never seen one run.
My question is how do you test the membrane without sap? My membrane was left to dry out with the exception of the bottom 12 inches in fermented sap. Its a used unit and I got what I got.
Anyone put sugar or even maple syrup in water to test one. Curious for thoughts on how to know that I know it works before sap is chin deep.
Is it worth to keep a spare membrane on hand?
Just letting it run with spring water for now. Plan on adding soap tonight or tommorow when it shows up.

[Bricklayer]

If you have a source of soft water from a well you could test with that.
I did that last year while I was building mine. You'll need a TDS meter though.
What I did was test the water going in. Mine was usually around 250-275 ppm.
After running it at 200-250 psi at normal sap pressures I periododically checked the tds of the permeate. If it's working properly it will read 0
Trying it with distilled water won't really tell you anything about what it is passing if it is.
Check your flows also.
It's hard to say what flows should be. Every RO is different. If I just have my feed pump on and not the hp pump on I can get 9-10 gpm across my membranes with needle valve wide open and recirc open.

If you can flush the membrane with a boat load of soft well water and make some permeate then you can wash and flush it properly.

[cjf12]

Right now im running it at 200psi. Slowly adding hot water to get it up to around 110. Psi is dropping slowly as well. I keep it up at 200 when it goes down. No good reason, just doing it. The flow meter of permeate says around 3.75 gal a minute.

[cjf12]

Up to 105 degrees and 4.25 gal of permeate. Sound right? Pressure drops with temp increase.

[cjf12]

guess I should add i am recycling it through a barrel designed for a wash cycle. All being dumped back in it. Assuming that would change flow considerably also. Clean water is going to go through easily.

[Bricklayer]

As the water heats up the flow usually increases. I don't understand why the psi would drop as the water heats up
You should rinse that membrane out with as much water as you can to get all the crud out. Right now your just recycling it back through clogging your prefilter.
Does your RO have a recirc needle valve and flowmeter?

[cjf12]

water hydrant froze up on me limiting fresh water at the moment. My thought was i can switch out prefilter if needed. Was more concerned that membrane was worth time cleaning with soap.
Do you think i would be better off putting fresh water through it for an hour or so. Then wash it with soap?
Prefilter psi is about 24.
I only have that and psi gauge at needle valve.

[Bricklayer]

If you are going to soap wash it you will need a good supply of clean water to rinse it out.
You can use good clean well water or city water if you let it sit for a couple days. Chlorine is not good for membranes. Chlorine will disapate over a couple days but is risky. Gotta make sure it's totally free before putting it through RO.

Like I mentioned before. I would
Run RO for at least half an hour with clean water at low pressure. ( needle valve wide open ) and don't recirculate it. Just dump the concentrate down the drain. This will flush out any loose crap in the membrane.
You can keep the permeate from this cycle. There may not be much but there will be some

Once a good rinse is done you can start making permeate if you want.
Run your RO at 200 or higher if you want. And just keep the permeate. Once you get 150 gallons or more then you are ready to wash.

You could skip this process if you choose and just use the small amount of permeate you made while rinsing for your wash mix.
Then flush the membrane with well water at lowest pressure possible and highest flow.

Either way you need a boat load of access to fresh clean water.
That's why it's always key to keep as much permeate around during the season for rinsing and cleaning. I had 2 x 275 gallon totes filled to the rim with permeate before the start of last season. I just had enough for final rinsing and cleaning at the end.
I would rinse RO with 50 gallons before I ran it with sap. Then I would rinse with 250 gallons after a run. No matter how much sap I ran through it. Sometimes on small runs I only made 50 gallons of permeate.

Worse case scenario you could take your membrane to get cleaned at either CDL , lapierre , or MES. Kinda late now to do it but you never know.

[cjf12]

Are you running 2 membranes on yours? If so would half the permeate for rinsing work on mine since i only have 1? I set up one tank for it and with some jimmy rigging maybe able to get another 275 gallon tote nearby. Probably wont gravity feed as well but would add some gallons. I think in my reasearch earlier I thought 275 was plenty for a cleaning cycle. Didn't think of the small runs not producing as much permeate.

[cjf12]

In reality I have enough room now for about 325 gallon. My wash sink is a 55 gallon barrel. I think you mentioned using a laundry tub plumbed in. I did that and promptly blew a hole in it by dropping a wrench while plumbing. I cut the top off a barrel and plumbed it in. I think I like it more. I was concerned my brother would come over and spit in the sink. Now its obvious it NOT a sink. Also can use the top to make a lid on hinges when i get a chance.17403

[Bricklayer]

I only have 1 membrane. Might add a second membrane this year if I have time.
Usually the rule of thumb is if your unit is a 100 then 100 gallons to rinse it. If it's a 250 then 250 gallons
I just go overboard and rinse with a lot. Doesn't hurt anything. The more the better.
With 1 membrane it's about 100-125 gph. Or even lower. But go with 125gallons to be safe for rinsing.