Off-The-Shelf Reverse Osmosis System

[thebbqman]

I am wondering if any off-the-shelf R.O. systems, like these (see link below) would work for concentrating maple sap. Obviously I'd need to collect the waste line instead of the filtered-water line, but if this would work it would save me some time fabricating something.

Thanks!
Jay

https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_ss_c_1_10?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=reverse+osmosis+water+filtration+system&sprefix=reverse+os%2Caps%2C149&crid=3NHW7QPIPHRFC

[wobbletop]

Sure, plenty of folks doing that. Lot's of discussion on it here if you look around (search).

For example,
http://mapletrader.com/community/showthread.php?28349-hodorskib-s-Small-Scale-RO-Build

[Bricklayer]

Most of these systems have an active carbon filter and a remineralizer for drinking water. These would have to be removed. And just the RO membrane used

[halladaymaple]

Commercial RO’s work fine, the principal is the same except we keep the stuff they flush... I have a Nimbus CIV 4000. Simple procon pump with a recirc system. I can get 8% for 2.5 in one pass. It’s a great alternative to the expensive maple RO’s.

Good luck

[needmoremaples]

agreeing with what everyone else has said, Id like to add if you can find one of the used commercial ones and want to use it, it will work fine. you will just have a bulkier setup with un needed stuff on it. I think You would be better off getting all new and make a compact setup. If its available cheap and you dont mind the space/mess of it all go with the used.

[Mark B]

Might want to take a look at this site www.robucket.com

Apart from that there is great information here on the build your own diy RO setups. Building my own and using an aquatech pump rate 1200 gpd and 3 x 400 gpd membranes. On cold sap I'm hoping for 7% or better at 15 gph and on sap above 45f in excess of 20 gph. Also have a good dialogue going with the guy from robucket.

[wobbletop]

I presume you meant www.therobucket.com

Anyone know where you can get those multiturn plastic needle valves used in that setup?

[phil-t]

I presume you meant www.therobucket.com (http://www.therobucket.com)

Anyone know where you can get those multiturn plastic needle valves used in that setup?

I use this one. (https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00529BBK2/_encoding=UTF8?coliid=I2YTU5UCYD9X49&colid=IPKYXK9G9I3G&psc=0)

[wobbletop]

Thanks. I use one similar to that too. I just find that its less than 1/2 a turn from fully closed to too far open, so I'd like something with finer control.

[carls47807]

I'm the ro bucket guy. I sell the plastic valves for $10. Parts prices are listed on my website, or give me a call at 3155324003. Thanks!

[Mark B]

Found this one on eBay the other day. Stainless

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F15 2719175598

[needmoremaples]

16953

Menards (hardware store chain based out of wisconsin) or fleet farm (I forget) for 4ish dollars. 1/8th inch mpt by 1/4" tube.

Took 11 turns to fully close valve from open position.

[hodorskib]

Last year I started using a pressure by-pass valve much better control - a little pricey though
http://www.sprayerdepot.com/Shop-by-Category/Relief-Valves/AA11014300

[Mark B]

I saw that valve in one of your updates. Just couldn't justify the additional cost this year. However I will have my ro reassembled shortly and plumbed with 3/8s based on your design. I going to run 3x 400 gpd membranes in parallel. It will also feature a 1/4 recirc line thru a 300 ml. restrict. Thanks to all here for designs and thoughts. Mark

[Mark B]

Newly built Reverse Osmosis for sapping this year. Hoping to remove 2/3 to 3/4 of the water from my sap with this RO. Pump is an Aquatech 8852 with 3/8 outlets and is a 1200 gpd pump paired with 3 x 400 gpd ro membranes. The membranes are plumbed in parallel with a 300ml recirculation line. Hoping to process about 50 gallons of sap per hour at about 7-8%, (but hopeful for as much as 60). Revised.

I had this laid out once before, but I came across a dry sink cabinet for free. I've reorganized and plumbed it to fit the cabinet. Ill be building a cart base on the cabinet this week and hinging this to the open back.

I've got about $500 in this build.

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=1859761970710298&id=100000295385959

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[wobbletop]

How is that plumbed?
You have the concentrate going through a 300ml restrictor, back to the input of the pump?
Is that a needle valve or ball valve with the large black knob?

[Mark B]

The unit is plumbed in 3/8 to facilitate better incoming flow. The membranes (3) are 400 GPD and are plumbed in parallel. The concentrate line and the recirculation are plumbed in 1/4 and yes that is a stainless needle valve that I found on eBay for five bucks. The recirculation dumps back into the intake side of the pump. Where I may not be able to process some of my early season sap warmer than low to mid-thirties temperature we thought that it would be good to have a recirculation line.

[Mark B]

Per other conversations it's become apparent that my expectations of this unit maybe a little high due to my misunderstanding of Brett's original post and his statement of how much he could process. You can see the conversation in the small-scale RO thread. No matter what the capacity I will still be happy to boil concentrated sap from this build.

[Mark B]

Had to do a little moving around of components on the board to make it all fit better, but here it is mounted and in the dry sink cabinet. The back opens for better access. The whole unit is on wheels for ease of movement.1704617047 I plan to put a 40 to 55 gallon drum on its side on top with a spout to gravity feed to the pump.

[Kippster]

Nice job on your setup Mark!! I have been reading everything I can about small scale homebuilt RO machines. I plan to build one over the coming summer to expand my operation next season. For now, I'll be satisfied with 115 buckets and my old 2x6. Thanks to everyone for sharing their knowledge and experiences.

I'm now confident that I can build something that would work, with guidance from you guys.
My goal is to be able to process 30-50 gallons of raw sap per hour and be able to remove 50% of the water in a single pass. Any suggestions on how to achieve this rate would be greatly appreciated. Thanks !!

[HannahL]

Carl,

I have been using your RO Bucket for several weeks now and put 430 gallons through it. I let mine run through the night and while I am at work if need be. I have been turning 2% into 5%-6% sap on a regular basis. This little unit has really improved the season in many ways, I was able to install more taps, boil less hours, gather split and burn less wood and most importantly stay in good standings with my wife because I am not out there EVERY single night boiling! The only thing I notice is the auto shut-off does not always shut off but I can live with that.

[carls47807]

Glad to hear! It can take up to 5 minutes for the system to shut down. Other people have said the same thing. If you go past 50/50 sometimes residual pressure will keep the switch close. I am doing some r and d on a switch that trips at a higher pressure. Thanks for the feedback and glad you like it!

The switch works best if you put it directly before the needle valve (between the last membrane and needle valve).

Carl

[Derekm]

I am just curios im going to run a smokey lake 2x8 this up coming season i dont have the money to buy a big expensive RO anybody have any tips on which way i should go i have 1000 taps need somthing to do atleast 3-400gpd

[mol1jb]

For 1000 taps and a 2x8 you would have to have a good sized RO to not drown in sap. I would recommend to buy as big RO as you can for your money. Deer Run Maple have good economical hobby RO's for the price.

Another option would be to only process as much sap as you can and sell the rest to save up for a proper sized RO next season.

[mol1jb]

Also keep an eye out for used RO's on this site and Bascoms.

[n8hutch]

R.O. size will effect your finished syrup too, a small R.O. is going to require many passes and is going to tend to make darker syrup. A 2x8 is going to do 60 gph maybe 70 if you really get it going good, are your 1000 taps on vac? If so I would plan on 1500 Gallons a day. So if you buy a hobby R.O. that doubles sugar content your still boiling 10-11 hrs of you have 700 gallons of 4%, or maybe 5-6 hrs at 8%.

To get an R.O. to get you to 8% is going to cost some dough no doubt but it will be worth every penny.

Personally with that many taps I would want something that would get me to 16 or even 20% on 2 passes. But I work full time and can only boil at night, if you can sugar full time then maybe you have time to boil that much more.

[spiceman]

Hey Derek!

I make and sell a small scale homemade RO system. It will do 120-150 gallons per hour (depends on temperature) and takes my 2.4% water to around 4.0% sugar concentration. It runs off of 115v motor and is super simple to operate. I charge $2200 and have sold quite a few in my area.

[therealtreehugger]

R.O. size will effect your finished syrup too, a small R.O. is going to require many passes and is going to tend to make darker syrup.

Really? I just got an RO bucket 15 kit. So when you run the concentrate line back into your sap tank, to go through the RO again and again, you will get darker syrup? Why?
Thanks!

[carls47807]

There are a lot of variables in regards to syrup darkness. I have been batch processing sap to over 10% with RO buckets and still make the same syrup as everyone else (light early season, darker towards the end). Get a boil on your concentrate as soon as possible and do everything you can to reduce invert sugars and you won’t notice a difference.


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[tpathoulas]

Looking for some RO help. I am starting to look at RO and am leaning towards the RO Bucket15. My shack is 3/4 mile from power so I need to use batteries to power my RO. I could use a generator but I have no desire to babysit my evaporator to the hum of a generator. Any ideas regarding if I am on the right path or should I consider something else. I have about 150 taps, about 60 0f those on 3/16 tubing. Last year I made about 21 gallons but would love to cut down my cooking time.
Thanks!