lesson learned about [clean] taps

[Mike Van]

You'd think after 20+ years, you'd have this all figured out, but its still a learning thing. End of Feb, some of the trees i'd tapped first week of Jan had slowed, some stopped. The near 70 degree days didn't help - Anyway, I took some 2 dozed buckets off & pulled the taps, went to some trees farther out, harder to get to that I hadn't tapped & did so. 1st run was o.k., almost immediately though, they start to slow up, some stopped pretty quick. I took them all down Thursday, all were done except for the last one, this one i'd put a brand new unused tap in. The taps I reused were all coated with a slimy goo, the slots sealed right off. Probably cost me a few gallons of syrup in the end, maybe this will keep someone else from repeating my mistake though. Clean taps only! All done for the season, a little over 1400 gal of sap, 200 behind last year, but good none the less.

[Woodsrover]

Interesting and makes sense. I have my 30 taps soaking in hot water as I type. Wish there was a good way to remove, clean and re-use my 3/16" taps....

[BSD]

I'm using seasonal 5/16 for a cost of $.16 each I will replace them each year. UVM research shows huge declines in reused plastic taps.

[maple flats]

All of my taps are new every year. I started tapping Jan 8, finished the last on 2/20. I'm still going on 4/1. You will never get that on taps that were usaed before except maybe SS taps that were properly cleaned. At the price of taps you are being penny wise and pound foolish using taps more than 1 season.

[bstewar]

All of my taps are new every year. I started tapping Jan 8, finished the last on 2/20. I'm still going on 4/1. You will never get that on taps that were usaed before except maybe SS taps that were properly cleaned. At the price of taps you are being penny wise and pound foolish using taps more than 1 season.
Couldn't agree more!

[Mike Van]

Last batch of taps I bought were 1.50 ea. - I can't throw those out -

[tekwind]

I boil all my taps at the end of season and beginning of season. Tapped late in January. I have 40 buckets with 7/16 cast and they lasted over 1.5 months... there are 3 still running!
I have 10 5/16 plastic that i reused from last year and all are still going! Tapped at the same time! But sap is getting buddy now. Turned out to be a weird but ok season.

[Hkb82]

I will be buying all new taps to as the little I have read and look into everything points to that being the best idea however I can't figure out why if properly clean and sanitize a reuse plastic tap Could be less productive the following year something more I should look into I guess or maybe not as was said $.20 is pennies per tap.

[mspina14]

Has anyone had any success in cleaning and reusing stainless steel taps?

I used 5/16 plastic check valve spouts this year. I was going to boil them and re-use next year. But have seen from many on this forum that research shows reusing plastic taps even after cleaning reduces production.

Wondering if the same applies to stainless steel?

Mark

[DrTimPerkins]

... however I can't figure out why if properly clean and sanitize a reuse plastic tap Could be less productive the following year something more I should look into I guess or maybe not as was said $.20 is pennies per tap.

You answered your own question in a semi-oblique way. It is not so much that you can't get them cleaner and thus improve the yield from used spouts which have been cleaned. You can get cleaned spouts close to the performance (in terms of sap yield) of new spouts, however it depends on how you do it and the sanitizing approach used. People who use the "suck in solution through droplines" under vacuum, although it is relatively quick and easy, get poor results due to low contact residence time of the sanitizer. Those who do it by removing the spouts or spouts/drops use a lot of time and sanitizing solutions. Therefore doing it that way (remove and soak) is not cost effective if you have a lot of spouts, but might be "good enough" if you only have a few dozen or so. For most producers, it turns out the approach that produces the highest net profit is simple annual spout replacement combined with drop replacement every 3 yrs (or so) OR using CV spouts/adapters and not replacing drops

[Hkb82]

You answered your own question in a semi-oblique way. It is not so much that you can't get them cleaner and thus improve the yield from used spouts which have been cleaned. You can get cleaned spouts close to the performance (in terms of sap yield) of new spouts, however it depends on how you do it and the sanitizing approach used. People who use the "suck in solution through droplines" under vacuum, although it is relatively quick and easy, get poor results due to low contact residence time of the sanitizer. Those who do it by removing the spouts or spouts/drops use a lot of time and sanitizing solutions. Therefore doing it that way (remove and soak) is not cost effective if you have a lot of spouts, but might be "good enough" if you only have a few dozen or so. For most producers, it turns out the approach that produces the highest net profit is simple annual spout replacement combined with drop replacement every 3 yrs (or so) OR using CV spouts/adapters and not replacing drops enough said thanks for all your info on this site.

[Russell Lampron]

When I was using buckets I used the Leader 5/16" cast aluminum spouts. I washed them at the end of the sesson and boiled them just before I tapped each season. I would get decent production out of them for 6 weeks with only 1 or 2 drying up. One season I didn't boil them and it turned out to be a mistake. Most of them dryed up after only 3 weeks.

As of this season I no longer tap any buckets. I started using the cv adapters when they first came out and switched over to the cv2's replacing them every year. The cost for replacing 700 of them is less than 6 gallons of syrup retail. A small price to pay for the much better sap flows and length of time that the holes stay open. I got a full 8 weeks out of them this season with no decrease in sap flow right up until I called it a season yesterday. Before I started using seasonal spouts the holes would dry up about 4 weeks into the season. Before check valves but using a new adapters every year I could get about 6 weeks out of a season and with cv2's I haven't had a season long enough to find out when they will dry up yet.

[mainebackswoodssyrup]

Has anyone had any success in cleaning and reusing stainless steel taps?

I used 5/16 plastic check valve spouts this year. I was going to boil them and re-use next year. But have seen from many on this forum that research shows reusing plastic taps even after cleaning reduces production.

Wondering if the same applies to stainless steel?

Mark

We pulled 5300 stainless taps out of a bush 2 years ago that had been used for too many years. We won't go back due to the size of the operation......it Is not economicalto try and clean them all. However, for a small producer, if you could buy 2 sets and alternate annually, cleaning them good by soaking and scrubbing they may be a good option. With that said, those old stainless taps are still sitting in a box which is where I suspect they will stay.

[sugarsand]

Every year I think of trying something different. Up to this point, I have cut off the spouts, boiled, cleaned with special pipe cleaners, boiled again and then left soaking in a closed container with Hypochlor most of the winter. I would change them out every other year with new ones, but it is a big pain in the butt since we keep expanding. Am torn between cleaning the spouts and lines and leaving them on, or replacing all spouts every year. Just seems a waste to throw all those spouts away. Has anyone tried a rotation of spouts where you soak them in sanitizer for 2 years, then use them again every third year? I'm thinking any microbes would be eliminated after soaking that long.

[DrTimPerkins]

Brushing them in sanitizer, then a one-hour soak in the proper strength solution (preferably with some occasional agitation) is enough, followed by a thorough rinse, then a good drying. Store them in a dry, non-humid, preferably cold location (freezer?). This will get them close to new, but is really only cost effective if you don't include your time spent doing it.

[sugarsand]

Dr. Tim
If I considered my sugarin time and labor as valuable, I probably would have sold all my equipement 40 yeasrs ago.:lol::lol:

[wmick]

Hi Guys - Newbie here....
Is there a way to identify this potential problem in the spring, prior to re-using the taps, visually.???
At this point, replacing them, wouldn't be a huge investment,... but I am trying to be conservative.
I ran a clorox solution through my 3/16" spouts using vacuum, as I pulled them... and my bucket spiles, I agitated in clorox solution and rinsed....

They look pretty clean to me, but what am I looking for in the spring as a potential production inhibitor??

Thanks

[eustis22]

Don't reuse them. You won't be able to get them clean enough and you will impact your tapping next year.

[DrTimPerkins]

Is there a way to identify this potential problem in the spring, prior to re-using the taps, visually.???

No, there is no way to know whether a spout/dropline is clean by looking at it.


At this point, replacing them, wouldn't be a huge investment,... but I am trying to be conservative.
I ran a clorox solution through my 3/16" spouts using vacuum, as I pulled them... and my bucket spiles, I agitated in clorox solution and rinsed....
They look pretty clean to me, but what am I looking for in the spring as a potential production inhibitor??

A chlorine solution is one of the better sanitizers since it kills both the vegetative and spore forms of microbes (unlike some others, including IPA, which does not kill spores and is illegal in the U.S. anyhow). Unfortunately it also attracts squirrels -- with bad results for your tubing. Pulling it in through the spout under vacuum however does not provide adequate contact time to achieve effective microbial kill. You want at least 15 seconds to 5 min (depending upon your dilution) to fully sanitize the spouts. Moreover, with chlorine you are supposed to either allow the first run of sap to run on the ground to wash out the residual chlorine salts, or rinse the tubing with water. Both of those represent losses of sap, and thus loses of potential revenue. Most producers find it far more cost effective, especially if your time has any value, to simply replace spouts annually and drops every 3rd year OR to use CV spouts/adapters.

[wmick]

Excellent feedback folks...
"Learn something new every day"
Thanks a lot...

[berkshires]

My wife works in a bio lab. She has access to an autoclave. Has anyone ever tried to use an autoclave to sterilize plastic spiles? I'm sure it'll work in terms of killing spores and such, but it may or may not turn the spiles into a puddle of hot plastic! I can't find anywhere the type of plastic/resin that my taps are made of. I don't know why the manufacturers don't tell you - it would be nice to know.

I have two types - this: http://www.mapleguys.com/product/TU051-000005J4.html
and this: http://www.mapleguys.com/product/TU059-000005J7.html

Anybody ever try this? Or do you know what kind of plastic they are?

Thanks!

Gabe

[DrTimPerkins]

Or do you know what kind of plastic they are?

The first are most likely made of food-grade nylon, typically Nylon 66. The second is probably a polycarbonate of some formulation.

I know people who've autoclaved SS spouts, but not plastic.

[berkshires]

Thanks Dr Tim! I guess I might try bleaching the blue ones (they're like $1.50 a pop) but I definitely won't try to autoclave them. I might try a couple of the black ones just for the hell of it. They're cheap - if they melt it's not a big deal.

Cheers!

Gabe