early season off flavored syrup??

[tcross]

I was talking to a friend of mine who has a large operation by my standards...6-7k taps or so. he had a fellow producer, who's operation is 4-5 miles down the road, offer to bring some of his barrels to be dropped off at the packer for him. He said sure and went along for the ride. the guy had 64 or so barrels to drop off... they were all off flavored (ouch!). slightly, but nonetheless of flavored. my friend said it was very, very hard to detect but there was something there. this guy has produced syrup for years and has never made any off flavored syrup before the very end of the season and usually quits when he notices. the folks at the packer said that they have been seeing this from other producers throughout the region. I've seen the guys set up and two of his bushes. he has a huge operation... 15k-20k taps +... everything is cleaned after each boil... evaporator, tanks, ro's etc... what could be the cause of this? they said it had a slight woody aftertaste. some odd ph levels within the soils?, warm winter? a few longs stretches of warm weather with sap spoiling in the lines (with 10s of thousands of gallons a day I'd doubt it?)? I believe they sent samples for Dr Tim's group to check out. my friends was pretty nervous after that, but the folks at the packer told him he had the nicest fancy syrup they've seen so far this year, as they've noticed the syrup quality hasn't been as good as it has in years past. sorry for the long post, but I'm just curious as to what the causes could be. I'm sure there's lots of possibilities. from what I understand he's going to boils small amounts from each of his bushes and see if he can find the issue.

[Urban Sugarmaker]

I believe the "woody" flavor characteristic is attributed to an off-flavor known as metabolism. Maybe all the abnormally warm weather in February caused this? From what I understand, this is not necessarily limited to the late portion of the season.

[DrTimPerkins]

I believe the "woody" flavor characteristic is attributed to an off-flavor known as metabolism.

It does sounds like metabolism/woody off-flavor. Often happens in early-mid season, especially with otherwise very nice light-colored syrup. Not a lot you can do about it....but it does tend to go away once we have some good runs to flush it out. Caused by nitrogen-containing amino acids released by the tree and seemingly associated with warm spells, then a solid freeze. Some bushes are more prone to it and some years it is more widespread. Impossible to predict.

[tcross]

SO... to update this thread... I have found out what the culprit was with the off flavored syrup. nothing to do with the sap, boiling process, or the producer himself. it was CDL's taps. I'm unsure which ones. apparently they had a bunch of taps that got messed up and they have recognized the situation. they said they'd pay for the syrup and pay for tap replacement. that's some good customer service... however, I'm not sure what else they could do besides ignoring it. you can take one of their faulty taps, stick it in water and it has a slightly odd taste. heat up the tap and or water and it's undrinkable! I guess there's a larger producer in southern vt who had the same issue. kind of odd, but good on them to correct the situation!

[mainebackswoodssyrup]

You have everyone's attention now. CDL sells a lot of taps!

[Sugarmaker]

I would have guessed this was metabolism too! I have made some. Took about 50 years of making syrup to have a season where I tapped very late because the weather was good again, sap tasted a little flat, syrup was very light and was the worst tasting stuff you can imagine! Very interesting that this off flavor was traced to the CDL spouts! wow!
Regards,
Chris

[steam maker]

Which style spouts r we talking about?

[Galena]

Which style spouts r we talking about?

I don't know but can't help but wonder if plastic ones are to blame. I know for a fact that when I tried some plastic spouts a couple years back, they didn't impart any flavours that I could tell...but they just slid out of the trees as though greased! Good thing I still had (and continue to have) my ol' 7/16ths aluminum spouts. BTW anyone want 30 free plastic blue *health* spiles? Pay for shipping or come and get em!!!

[BSD]

i have to wonder what the impact of this will be on seasonal pricing of maple as it comes to the fore-front as the really big producers in CA get cranking this week

side note, very very glad i bought lapierre taps...

[DrTimPerkins]

I am unable to provide any details or answer questions at this point, however please be assured that: 1) this issue is being investigated and 2) only a very small number of producers are seemingly affected.

[tcross]

after posting this I'm not so sure I should have been a little more discrete as to which companies spout it was. from my understanding it only happened to a "batch" of spouts they produced. didn't mean to start a "fire" thread, but just figured I'd pass on what I understand to be the situation in the case it could help someone out! hopefully the issue gets resolved and I didn't cause too much panic.

[steam maker]

ah its all good , im running the max flo spouts and havent had a off flavor yet .. no one company is perfect all u can hope for is if something is wrong they stand behind there products..

[leaky bucket]

Iv been using CDL 5/16 health spiles for a few years now and havnt expierienced any issue .

[blissville maples]

I'll bet it's the white spouts from CDL....Last year sitting on couch making drops, sometimes I just lick the end of spout and press on tubing by hand since it's quicker, I noticed the white spouts leaving a weird aftertaste in my mouth compared to any other ones(clear, or black). To the point where I stopped doing it, it was a chemically type taste, never thought it would leach out, no more for me I have a hundred out of 2400 this year and 300 out of 2200 last year no issue I detected

[DrTimPerkins]

I'll bet it's the white spouts from CDL....

Best not to guess. When all the facts are available I'll let you know.

[Bruce L]

I'll bet it's the white spouts from CDL....Last year sitting on couch making drops, sometimes I just lick the end of spout and press on tubing by hand since it's quicker, I noticed the white spouts leaving a weird aftertaste in my mouth compared to any other ones(clear, or black). To the point where I stopped doing it, it was a chemically type taste, never thought it would leach out, no more for me I have a hundred out of 2400 this year and 300 out of 2200 last year no issue I detected

Wasn't going to jump into discussion until I read this post. A few years back I needed 5/16 connectors in a hurry,got them from CDL. Whenever I am doing repairs with the tubing tool,I usually have the fitting in my mouth while I am cutting the line or whatever. The connectors would leave a bad taste in my mouth,which I never experienced before with any fittings. I still use some CDL fittings from time to time,may have just been one bad production run

[blissville maples]

Oh I'm not guessing, the taste was awful.....Put one of the white spouts in your mouth....U try it and tell me if it's guessing, lol.....They are for sure the culprit.