besides the smell

[davey]

Other than that fishy smell while boiling, and seeing popping buds on the trees, is anyone aware of a way to tell if syrup has gone buddy? Most of my woods trees are too tall to tell if the buds are opening and I'd rather not haul bad sap home if I don't need to. On the other hand though, I could really use every drop of sap I could get this year. Lots of new (used) equipment, not a lot of syrup this season.

[Dave Y]

davey,
you will see the buds trust me. buddy sap is snoty. the reds will bud first they will swell as big as crabapples. the sugars a several weeks behind them.

[3% Solution]

Davey,
Taste the sap you will notice the difference, it will be bitter.
Just remember, if you sap you get it, if you don't, well you know.

Dave

[maple flats]

On my Sugars I have a couple in protected areas that have a slight bit of green showing on some of the buds. There is very little enlargement of these buds. At what point are they considered open, seeing this slight green or when the leaf bud actually breaks and opens up?

[Sugarmaker]

I haven't made buddy syrup for a lot of years. You will know when you taste the syrup or sure It will have very strong after taste in your mouth after the initial sweetness.


My neighbor just took his buckets down right before what I would expect to be a very good run when it warms again next week. Go figure??

Also I looked at the trees and the hard maples are still holding (buds not showing) very well. You don't have to get close up to see this either. Best comparison is a soft maple right next to a hard maple.

The soft will have red buds starting to show sometimes when we first tap in Feb. at this time the reds have a small ball of red fuzz at each bud.

Good luck to all sugar makers if they are hanging on for this next (last???) run!

Regards,
Sugarmaker

[davey]

thanks. My yard trees are a mix of silvers and sugars and I can see the buds real easy on the silvers but almost no movement on the sugars. Hopefully the woods, which is I believe all sugars, should give me another run this week.

[3% Solution]

Good evening all,
My sugars are not showing yet, but the reds sure are.
I haven't seen much in the line of Grackles or Starlings yet and for me that's a sure sign the end is near.
Sap was running today, maybe tomorrow, too.
I am at 23.5 gallons, so if I could make another 4 gallons it'll be an average year for me. No doubt going to do it by the looks of the forcast.
Happy boiling!!

Dave

[220 maple]

Davey,
I brought this up in the past. The sugarwater has changed chemically when it's makeing bud sap. Let say for example you have a couple thousand taps that gush off of a late season freeze. The water looks good. You have an oil fired rig. You fire it up and waste oil until you discover the sap is buddy. How neat it would be if we had something to check the sap before we wasted one gallon of fuel oil. Why hasn't someone at the University of Vermont worked on that?????? I've asked before? I guess when fuel oil goes to 5 dollars a gallon someone will care? The wood fired folks don't care as much, because the only expense they have in the wasted wood is their time. The price of commercial syrup can be justified with a wood fired evaporator.
Mark 220 Maple
There is only two seasons, Maple Season and getting ready for Maple Season

[markcasper]

I have noticed in former years that you do not need to see the buds popping for the syrup to be buddy. I remember back to 1992 very well. I believe that was the last year I was able to use the pill and we had a huge run the middle of April. It had been a fairly warm spring prior to this, but not nearly as bad as this year.

The syrup was light to medium, but man it was buddy! Everyone was baffled as to why the syrup was so buddy and yet the trees looked dead. Right now, the box elders have just exploded in the last week. You can drive down the lane and just smell them. This cold shock will no doubt do some damage to things that have started their growth already.

[Johnny Cuervo]

All my buds are tight and taste has been bitter for one week. I thought buckets might be the cause: they have been up for 4+ weeks. Two days ago I pulled all taps; I washed 30 buckets and taps. Reinstalled. I collected about 5 Gallons yesterday boiled, and it's still bitter. I think this change comes from the hours of daylight we get. It seems to happen every year around March 28-30 regardless of weather. My garlic is 4 inches tall every April 1 even with snow.

[maple maniac65]

How close is that garlic to the maple trees????

[Johnny Cuervo]

About 80 feet, but gets closer every year!!

[mcmp]

About 80 feet, but gets closer every year!!

I have wanted to grow Garlic in my garden. Do you start it from seeds ? Does it spread ? Can you get a harvest the first year ?

Thanks
Paul

[royalmaple]

Davey-

If you got the time and the fuel, just boil it all. When it tastes like crap sell it in bulk. Bulk buyers will buy every drop and unless you are beat from the season already or out of fuel keep hammering.

Granted your not going to make the retail money but can help buy a new tank or pump or something. Rig is already thrashed and snotty so pound some more sap through it.

Personally I'm gonna keep pounding on till the "bitter" end.

[davey]

Haven't had a chance to pull the taps yet anyways so if I get a run into the evaporator it goes. thanks to everyone for the input. I suppose a test kit would require determining what chemical change there is in the sap and in a simple world, we could dip a test strip in the sap to detect it.

[royalmaple]

Davey-

I think I do have a research paper on the subject and if I am not mistaken there is a chemical test you can do to tell if the sap is buddy. Or it might be after the fact for syrup only. I can't remember.

But probably would take more time and resources than just boiling and tasting it.

[Johnny Cuervo]

Hi Paul, you just plant a nice clove (point up) 3-4 inches down 8 inches apart
The secret is the moon (The moon is the boss: from an old timer) plant near full moon in October, harvest full moon in July. If your garlic starts to grow a curling seedpod snip it off after 1 curl. This will make the bulb larger.
Each clove will produce one bulb.

Any questions feel free to ask
John

[markcasper]

Matt, Should I boil a few hundred snotty gallons of sap? I see you have some experience in this.

[Russell Lampron]

Mark,

It all depends on what you will get for it as commercial syrup. The prices are good enough for me here in NH to keep boiling. I should get enough money out of it to pay for my supplies for next year. With the RO I don't use much wood and it doesn't take much time to get it through the evaporator. I know I'm not Matt the "RO Pirate" but that is my $.02 worth.

Russ

[royalmaple]

Personally I'd boil it all especially if you already got it. Like russ said worst you'll make is commercial and they'll buy every drop from you. So If you have the wood and the time your stilll going to be getting roughly 20 bucks a gallon, no matter what comes out the draw off.

There were a couple of guys ahead of me and russ in line at bascoms last year and they had a jug of b, jug of c and two jugs that were very watery looking. Turns out they brought there pan drainings with them. Guy didn't taste it since he knew what it was, down graded it to commercial price, and then paid based on weight. So even the stuff most people just flush out on the ground has value to it. Now I don't think it would be worth the time to drive over with just pan drainings but if you are already going, they'll buy it.

It is kinda like kevin says all these small runs at the beginning of the season can bump up your production by the end of the season, just like boiling all the sap can still add some $$ in your pocket. Your gonna buy more crap anyway. But to each his own. I know someone that won't make anything past dark. Once the first draw off comes out that is dark, "pull the plug", done, ka put, finished.

The way I look at it also is I guarentee you won't make a drop of syrup in July. So make hay while the sunshines. It is almost over so keep on pounding.

[mcmp]

Hi Paul, you just plant a nice clove (point up) 3-4 inches down 8 inches apart
The secret is the moon (The moon is the boss: from an old timer) plant near full moon in October, harvest full moon in July. If your garlic starts to grow a curling seedpod snip it off after 1 curl. This will make the bulb larger.
Each clove will produce one bulb.

Any questions feel free to ask
John

Thanks John, I sent you a PM
Paul

[markcasper]

Yeh, but Matt............there was 30 gallons in one tank yesterday that I dumped, it was pink,stringy, ropy, cow cleanings look superior to this! I don't have to get any more descriptive. One time not too many years ago, I made 10 gallons at the end that was in the evaporator for too many days, it got ropy, jelly-like and the buyer would noy buy it.............it could have had the worst taste in the world, but if its ropy??????

[Breezy Lane Sugarworks]

If it's cloudy/little slimy/some discoloration, etc...I BOIL it no matter what! BUT if it's ROPY, it gets dumped.