Multistage Build

[MT Pockets Producer]

After a couple of seasons of research and reading RO posts this is what we ended up with. Thank you to Woodbutcher for sharing his parts list from his build. We sourced many our plumbing parts from the same places. Also for his photos as we had envisioned the similar design and it was helpful to see it in advance. Thanks to Wishlist for sharing his knowledge and experience with his multistage setup. And to all of the others that have posted their builds and experiences. We gave it a quick test run yesterday and have a couple of leaks to take care of but are otherwise pleased. It runs 9gpm total at about 200 psi with the recirc closed. We are at about $1600 but already had the low pressure pump and stainless panel. The controls are set up so the low pressure pump must be started and up to pressure before the high pressure pump can be turned on. Everything will shut down if it goes to low pressure, high pressure or high temp. Still need to adjust the low pressure switch though because when the high pressure pump starts it creates a quick drop of pressure on the low side and the low pressure switch shuts things down. Worked fine when we bypassed the switch. The major parts consist of a Grundfos JP5 pump, Goulds 7GB10 multistage pump and MES 4x40 membrane and vessel. We are running it on 240 volts. Sorry about quality of photos, apparently having issues with my camera.

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[Urban Sugarmaker]

Nice build. This might be the year I need to start learning to do some basic welding.

Is the Goulds pump model number correct? I couldn't find it.

[MT Pockets Producer]

Sorry about the typo, it is the 7GB10, 16 stage. I edited my original post. Thanks.

[Urban Sugarmaker]

I'm curious how you decided on that pump. I have been thinking about rebuilding mine and using something other than a ProCon. No problems with the ProCon but I may want to do something a little different with recirculation. The Goulds pump you have and another model they make that is the one on the MES Dolly are the two I was looking at.

[MT Pockets Producer]

Our plan was to build so we could expand to two membranes in the future if we wanted and compared the 7GB10 with the 10GB15. We thought the larger pump would be at or over the max flow of one 4x40. We considered ways of throttling flow back but final decision was made when I found the 7GB10 new in the box on eBay for $375 plus shipping. When looking at the performance curve charts and doing the math on GPMs we should be at about same GPMs per membrane with 2 4x40s if we expand as others are with a 3 membrane setup using the larger pump. Probably would have gone with the larger pump out of the gate if we had two membranes.

[Luisc]

Our plan was to build so we could expand to two membranes in the future if we wanted and compared the 7GB10 with the 10GB15. We thought the larger pump would be at or over the max flow of one 4x40. We considered ways of throttling flow back but final decision was made when I found the 7GB10 new in the box on eBay for $375 plus shipping. When looking at the performance curve charts and doing the math on GPMs we should be at about same GPMs per membrane with 2 4x40s if we expand as others are with a 3 membrane setup using the larger pump. Probably would have gone with the larger pump out of the gate if we had two membranes.

What does the multi stage do? Is your pump Stainless Steel or Cast Iron? I am buying the same Goulds pump to replace my ProCon pump.

[Luisc]

I'm curious how you decided on that pump. I have been thinking about rebuilding mine and using something other than a ProCon. No problems with the ProCon but I may want to do something a little different with recirculation. The Goulds pump you have and another model they make that is the one on the MES Dolly are the two I was looking at.

Ohh man i just picked up this pump and WOW it is no joke compared to the Procon...

[gmc8757]

Ohh man i just picked up this pump and WOW it is no joke compared to the Procon...

In what way? Overall RO performance? Can you share some before and after rates? What size membrane and how many?


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[MT Pockets Producer]

What does the multi stage do? Is your pump Stainless Steel or Cast Iron? I am buying the same Goulds pump to replace my ProCon pump.

I'm not sure of all the technical terms used but basically the multistage pump increases the output pressure based on the number of stages the pump has. Look at Goulds performance curve charts for the pump you are considering and it will give you a good idea of what to expect for flow rates at the pressures you would like to run. They are on their website and their tech support is very helpful answering questions. The charts are at zero feed pressure so you will need to know what type of pressure your feed pump will provide for an accurate calculation. Our pump is the cast version but the only cast parts are the pump housing that bolts onto the motor and the very end where the discharge fitting threads in. The long cylinder that houses the multiple stages is stainless. We were concerned about rust with the cast pump but I spoke with other producers and it was not an issue for them so we went with it.

[wishlist]

Nice job Mt pockets , glad I could help . One thing that concerns me is your Goulds pump is mounted vertical . I'm not positive but I believe they recommend horizontal only ? Could be wrong tho , maybe give Goulds a call and verify ?

I run a slightly larger size Goulds with 3 xle 4040 membranes in series . Using a pump with higher flows really helps with fouling. I just stop at 12 % but could do more if I wanted to , gotta boil for a few hours ! 😀

[MT Pockets Producer]

In what way? Overall RO performance? Can you share some before and after rates? What size membrane and how many?


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We have had no experience with a Procon as this is our first RO so I can't compare performance between the different pumps. I can however state that the multistage is much heavier weighing fifty pounds. We did our final boil Last evening and are very happy with our build. We experimented with a few different methods before we figured out what worked best for us. We would recirculate into the tank at high flow at about 180-200 PSI removing about 3/4 - 1 GPM of permeate until half the volume is gone. We would then process into the head tank pinching concentrate down even with the permeate at about 3/4 GPM, sometimes 1/2 GPM on the concentrate side at 220 -230 PSI and we could process at the same rate as the evaporator. We we were cooking 6-7 percent sap most days. Probably could have gone a little higher if we removed more water before switching to head tank but this basically turned rig into a 90-100 GPH operation when running simultaneously. Made for much shorter days. This pump will warm your sap as others have said so beware of that. We run a temp sensor to keep track. We had no issues with fouling while running with the recirculating valve open.

[MT Pockets Producer]

Nice job Mt pockets , glad I could help . One thing that concerns me is your Goulds pump is mounted vertical . I'm not positive but I believe they recommend horizontal only ? Could be wrong tho , maybe give Goulds a call and verify ?

I run a slightly larger size Goulds with 3 xle 4040 membranes in series . Using a pump with higher flows really helps with fouling. I just stop at 12 % but could do more if I wanted to , gotta boil for a few hours ! 😀

Thanks. I did not verify the verticle mounting with Goulds but maybe should have. I have seen a couple of commercial units that use the same pumps with them mounted this way so I guess I just assumed it was acceptable. One is at a local car wash. Probably should have checked but no issues yet.

[Luisc]

I'm not sure of all the technical terms used but basically the multistage pump increases the output pressure based on the number of stages the pump has. Look at Goulds performance curve charts for the pump you are considering and it will give you a good idea of what to expect for flow rates at the pressures you would like to run. They are on their website and their tech support is very helpful answering questions. The charts are at zero feed pressure so you will need to know what type of pressure your feed pump will provide for an accurate calculation. Our pump is the cast version but the only cast parts are the pump housing that bolts onto the motor and the very end where the discharge fitting threads in. The long cylinder that houses the multiple stages is stainless. We were concerned about rust with the cast pump but I spoke with other producers and it was not an issue for them so we went with it.


I just picked up the 7GBC1014RO from a friend that had one in his garage Brand New in box. I brought it home and removed my ProCon and used this thing and i feel like it is overkill for me.. haha.

[mkoehler79]

I use a procon to build the higher pressure and a Dayton 5NXZ1 to recirculate. The Dayton has a Max case pressure rating of 300 psi. The concentrate outlet from membrane is plumbed to Dayton inlet and Dayton outlet to membrane sap inlet. This combination gets me right around 13-14 GPM of combined procon (4 GPM) and multistage Dayton (9.6 GPM) flow through the membrane at all times and greatly reduces fouling and flushing in the middle of large sap runs.16344