MainLine Ends

[NJG]

I'm planning on upgrading some tubing this year and putting up a 3/4" mainline on wire. Although I have used 5/16" tubing for quite some time, I have never put up a mainline before. For the wire I'm going to use a gripple on the upstream end and a wire ratchet on the downstream end, with lags for anchors. On the upstream end of the mainline itself, my plan is to use a tubing tensioner wired to the same lag as the wire.

The problem I'm having is visualizing the downstream end of the mainline. Is is as simple as pulling the 3% expansion out of the mainline, then wiring the tensioner to the lag anchor? For whatever reason I'm imagining the wire ratchet being in the way and not having enough room to tie the mainline off. Any information or pictures of you mainline ends would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks

[maple flats]

I like to use a Chinese finger type tension grip on the tubing. I use one at each end of the tubing. From the downhill end I lag the grip to a tree and I extend enough out thru that grip to get to the tank, (at least that was how I did it before everything was on vacuum). Then to get additional tension I used several side ties along the way between the high end and the bottom. With support wire, you then want about 14 ga. side tie wire, so if a tree falls on the line, the side tie breaks and just forces the support wire remains good.

[VT_K9]

We use a combination of materials and the best so far for the mainline WIRE is to use the high tension insulated lags for anchor points. We would loop the wire around the plastic insulator and make multiple wraps onto itself. We are now using a gripple with a gripple tool to tension the wire. This is fast and easy. We used to use a come-a-long with wire puller and turnbuckle. This took a lot of time. We have also shortened our distance between trees so we don't rely on side tying. We used to run 200' or so between points. Now it is about 50-75.

For the main line we use a strap on the top end and a wire puller (the metal wire "cage" with loop to pull wire or pipe) to hook to the pipe. We also secure this with a pipe clamp for backup. We layout the pipe and put it under tension with a come-a-long secured to a tree at the bottom end. We generally let this sit for a day or two so it can settle, you'll get a couple more cranks on the come-a-long at that time. Once it is tight, we start wire tying every 8-12". I use a hook I made on a drill to do this. I have tried the manual twists and auto-pull units. I like the drill. I do use ties spaced about every three-four inches at the beginning and end of the run. Some times I leave the wire puller on and sometimes I replace the come-a-long with a ratchet strap to help keep tension.

We also side tie to get the final tension and maintain good slope. The change to the gripple for the wire has helped make the process more simple. We ran a 1 1/2" vac and 1 1/2" pump line high in the woods last year. I had to run around with a 10" step later where I could and used the forks and a pallet on the tractor where I had to for tying the lines. I have researched using a line tool which is used by the power company or phone company. They are expensive. I may try a short run this year by using wire on a reel to wrap around the pipe as I walk along (not using the fancy tool, but hopefully having the same result) to see how it works. It may save a lot of time with the wire tying and may work nearly as well.

Mike

[JoeJ]

I use the same type tension grips on both ends of the mainline and leave both grips on the line permanently with a wire strainer at the end tree. If you properly tighten the pipe as needed, you can easily wire tie every 18-24" (maybe even further spacing) with no problems. This past fall I replaced a 12 year old 3/4" pipe that had snaked on me, with a new 1" pipe, put the tension grips on, loosely wire tied every 20', tightened the pipe, then measured the sag between the 20' wire ties. The 1" pipe sag 1/2" between the 20' ties. Of course there was no sap in the pipe but there wasn't much sagging. I would suggest not wasting your time wire tying too close together.

Also, you don't mention how many taps you are going to have or if you are going to be using vacuum now or in the future. All of the mainline I put up 12-13 years ago was 3/4 and I would never do that again. I would pay the slightly higher price and use all 1" pipe with or without vacuum.

[maple flats]

I agree, when I started I used 3/4" but have not bought any 3/4" in about 6 years, all 1" (or larger). While I still have some 3/4" up, as it gets changed I go to 1". Better flow and lots better vacuum transfer.

[NJG]

Thanks for the tips I appreciate it! I am looking at a run of about 350' and somewhere near 75 taps. This will be gravity during the week and hooked up to a Shurflo on the weekends. Do you think 1'' is better for 75 taps? I will be putting this up in temps of around 30 (I hope). Is the 3% expansion I read about fairly standard or does this differ with the tubing manufacturer?

Thanks

[Thompson's Tree Farm]

I've read about that 3% expansion too. Not sure where the figure comes from but I have many runs of well over 1000 feet. If it expanded 3%, that would be 30 feet. It may happen for some people but it never happened for me. I have seen tubing erected in June at 75 degrees (about 1500 ft) pulled apart at a y about 2 feet when it was 30 below. That is a shrinkage of just over .1% with a temperature fluctuation of about 100 degrees. If you erect your tubing now, there will be little difference when sap is running. Just tighten the lines as others have suggested. Does the tubing expand and contract? heck yes but far less than the suggested 3%. I wonder if the correct figure would be .3%?

[ennismaple]

I've read about that 3% expansion too. Not sure where the figure comes from but I have many runs of well over 1000 feet. If it expanded 3%, that would be 30 feet. It may happen for some people but it never happened for me. I have seen tubing erected in June at 75 degrees (about 1500 ft) pulled apart at a y about 2 feet when it was 30 below. That is a shrinkage of just over .1% with a temperature fluctuation of about 100 degrees. If you erect your tubing now, there will be little difference when sap is running. Just tighten the lines as others have suggested. Does the tubing expand and contract? heck yes but far less than the suggested 3%. I wonder if the correct figure would be .3%?

The CDL Rapitube is designed to stretch 3% before you start to side tie it. Regular mainline will not likely stretch that much without a lot of effort.

[NJG]

Thanks for all the replies. I spent some time talking with the dealer in our area and they were fantastically helpful. I am still waiting for the logging to finish in some areas but was able to mark out the lines with a laser level. Will end up with the tank and p[ump in the middle of the run, 250' feet of mainline to the south at exactly 1.5% and 250' to the north at exactly 2% slope.

Interestingly enough the tubing dealer said not to worry about the 3% expansion. He told me to keep the tubing tight on be aware that I may have to tighten it up this summer but not too much.

Thanks again.

Nick

[Burnt sap]

15360 We don't put anchors into any tree we use heavy gauge wire inside plastic tubing around the tree to protect our trees. Then we use wire tensioners for the mainline support wire and the above picture if it loaded? pulls tension on the mainline tubing along with another wire tensioner for that. At the Dead end you do the same so no harm is done to any tree. Hope that helped? Sure you can find pictures.

[rhwells2003]

15360 We don't put anchors into any tree we use heavy gauge wire inside plastic tubing around the tree to protect our trees.

I've actually been switching away from this and installing anchors. I was told that wrapping the trees like this and putting that much pressure around 3/4 of the tree can actually act the same as girdling the tree, and can hurt the tree more then one 5/16" anchor hole that is healed up after one year.

[wiam]

I've actually been switching away from this and installing anchors. I was told that wrapping the trees like this and putting that much pressure around 3/4 of the tree can actually act the same as girdling the tree, and can hurt the tree more then one 5/16" anchor hole that is healed up after one year.

I am switching also. Another big thing is letting tension off and moving loop around tree up or down every few years so it does not grow into the tree, that I don't get to....

[ennismaple]

We are going back to installing end hooks in the tree as well. For the last decade we've been adding 2x4 blocking around the tree to wrap the wire around it in a long loop. As the tree grows and the 2x4's rot the wire eventually starts to girdle the tree. We also don't like how the wood beneath the blocking weathers - it more or less starts to rot.

My father used to install end hooks by driving them into the tree with a 16lb sledge - resulting in a split 2 feet long above and below the hook. We've recently installed a few by drilling a 5/16" hole to get the hook started and then screwing it in the rest of the way. The hooks will hold as much tension as we can put on the wire with a come-along.

When you think about it - installing one drive hook properly causes no more damage than a single taphole.