Homemade cement block and fire brick arch

[John Lazelle]

Hi Everyone,

I just finished my 12x16 sugarhouse and am getting ready to start building my arch. I'm going to make a custom cement block fire brick lined arch and am looking advice and suggestions. Any comments appreciated! Thanks, John.

[Bricklayer]

I'm a bricklayer and thought for years how I was going to do the same. Decided not to.

Reason 1
Even if you used 4" block with fire brick your walls would be almost 6" thick. And you don't want your pan sitting on just the fire brick so let's say it sits 1/2" on 4" block. Means you lose 4" on both sides of pan. So some kind of rail of steel would have to be added to eliminate this to be able to use a conventional pan with float boxes and pan connections

Reason 2
Door needs to be steel as well as ash door

Reason 3.
Masonry chimneys aren't able to withstand the temps that we run our evaporators at. So chimney would need to be steel

Reason 4
If you plan to get bigger which we all do then your going to have a big project on your hands

I have a friend down the road from me that is a concrete form worker. He decided 5 years ago to pour a 3x12 evap arch to fit his 20 year old pans. Well 3 years in the pans needed to be replaced and instead of just being able to buy proper pans with floats and a draw off he was stuck paying extra to get custom pans built just to fit his concrete arch.

So I decided to teach myself to weld and built myself a steel arch. Ordered a pan and it fit perfectly
I can move the arch if I want, and can sell it if need be if I want to get a bigger one. I'm gonna build a brick base for it to sit on maybe this spring.

I'm sure it can be done and has been done but I just found it easier to build a steel one. Maybe someone with a masonry arch will chime. I researched it a lot and never saw any pictures of one here.

[barnbc76]

I see from a previous post use have been using a 275 gal fuel tank as your arch with a 2x3 leader pan did you like that setup? 45 taps back in 2013 how many this year? I did a cinderblock arch the past 2 years, its functional but I wouldn't go back to it unless I had no money to invest. I have seen a couple brick/block arches mine was block only, they looked good i think i remember seeing they welded an angle iron frame to set on the bricks and support the pan, seems like that would work. But as for a door i dont know what you would do. Perhaps a barrel stove kit w/angle iron welded together that also is welded to the top frame and touches the floor? I dont kniw how well that would hold up though. Just throwing out ideas. Drilling through it wouldnt be fun.

[Dale Sparrow]

Build with steel for all the reasons Bricklayer listed. Plus if you ever decide to move your arch, you won't be able to if its built out of cinder block.

[John Lazelle]

Thank you everyone for the advice so far. Money is definitely my main reason for using cinder blocks and fire brick. I really appreciate the advice / comments so far!

[pyro]

Have you had any type of arch in the past, or is this your first go? How many taps are you expecting? What size pans?

If its your first and your small scale, I would look into the barrel stove. I started with cinder block with no firebricks, and its a bit of a pain if you don't mortar the block. Looking back, I now wish I went with the barrel stove kit and put some firebricks inside to protect the metal. I think this is the cheapest and best way to get started.

[Bricklayer]

If you are absolutely going to use block for your arch this year I would build it in way that it can be dismanteled easy. Lots of outdoor dry laid block arches that people have made here on this site. Never seen one indoors but it's possible. Your door is the biggest hurdle you will cross. And feeding air to the arch. And somehow getting a blower to feed air into the fire ( if needed). All things I tried to incorporate into mine before I gave up. I'm going to put mine on a brick base instead and maybe brick the front of the sugar house.

[toquin]

Rebuilt my grandfathers block arch a few years ago. It is firebricked all the way to masonary chimney,with blanket under half the syrup pan and all the flu pan. Front is 1/2" steel bolted to blocks with a door from old paper mill incinerator. I like the shelf on both sides the blocks create,there covered with 16 gage galvanized. When its rolling we get 40-45 gpm.

[barnbc76]

I thought I'd mention that a cement pad will not withstand the heat if you plan on boiling directly on it. As far as i have read people say thier concrete pads explode when they get too hot.

[Wizbi]

1500315004I had boiled using a dry-stack cinderblock design with a pan framework that sits on top and a end-plate door design for several years. Had been considering making a permanent fire pit getting tired of building and tearing down the unit each season. I made a permanent outdoor fire-pit out of mortared cinder block construction this year. The key was the use of "5:1 Perlite Mixture " as an 6"-8" insulating barier between fire bricks (lining fire pit) and the block sidewalls and 8" deep concrete slab.

It took me some time to conclude where I wanted to construct it - considering access, water, electricity, etc. Most of the perlite info can be found on outdoor oven forums. Perlite is a superheated volcanic material that has superior insultating properties. Shop around. You can find it for as little as $12.00/2 cu yd (suburb of Chicago). I found it a little more pricey at a company in Crawfordsville, IN. One benefit of the Perlite, is reduced firewood usage since heat stays in firepit. This design method lets you customize your arch to maximize heat to the pan bottoms and less out the flue.

[John Lazelle]

Thank you!

[John Lazelle]

Hi all,

I decided to go ahead and try a cement block arch for this years sugaring season. I started with laying down 1/2" cement board, then dry laying cement blocks. I also found a used wood stove that I cut down so I am using the front and the firebox. I then filled the cement blocks with cement and have installed the flue. I have started putting 1/2" cement board on the inside of the cement blocks and will be lining with firebricks. I have attached a few pictures.15455154561545715458

[barnbc76]

How big are your pans? It seems to be quite large.

[John Lazelle]

I'm combining a 3x4 and 2x3 so it's going to be a unique 3x6. I'll post pics when it's up and going. Last year I had about 65 taps, looking to add about another 50 this year. I hope this new set up will cut my boiler time down alot! Last year we made 12 gallons with our 65 taps.

[John Lazelle]

A few more pictures!1549015491154921549315494

[John Lazelle]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170226/a46ae54469aa187b0c7f65c9d11fe572.jpg


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[John Lazelle]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170226/58863a9047060ab14159345a0c143277.jpg


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[Sugarmaker]

You have put a lot of work into that arch. Put some pans on the top and it will make syrup like crazy. my neighbor built one about 5-6 years ago 30 inch x 7 foot. very similar. He has has some issue with frost heaving and cracking it. He said he will not build another brick one. He is 85!
Regards,
Chris

[Brian Kloepfer]

That thing looks bad as$.

[John Lazelle]

Got a later start than I was hoping this year! Had some problems with my back pan and had to have it repaired. Finished tapping last night! Finished with 145, can't wait for our first boil! John, Wilmington, VT.

[John Lazelle]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170311/30ea7504ded2fae61899716676cdd86a.jpg

Making some yummy 😋 syrup!


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