Hanging transfer line on same wire as mainline

[mudr]

The title really says it all. Looking to install my first tubing system here soon. 3/4 mainline, single shot, about 100 taps, maybe 250 feet. The woods slope away from where I can access it, so I need to pump it back upslope. I have a Honda wx10 and plan to use 3/4 line back upslope, the same 250 feet plus another 150 into the field. Would it be ok to hang the 250 feet of transfer line in the woods on the same wire as the mainline? I'd wire tie the mainline first every +/foot, then tie the transfer next, under the mainline. I wouldn't need to tie as much or as tight, right?

[morningstarfarm]

I wouldn't suggest it..I would run a separate wire that slopes out of the woods to your collection point..even if you need to pump the sap up 20'..put a tee in the vertical line with a check valve reversed so it closes when the pump is on and it opens when off to let air into the line..do not put one at the pump so the short rise can drain..the sap past the tee will run down to the tank..if you run it sloped to your low point you will have major freezing problems all seasons...just my .02...

[mudr]

Thank you. One more question, I need to pick up some more cam locks for my pump. This sounds stupid, but can you mix and match cam lock brands? Are they pretty universal?

[maple maniac65]

Not always. I hate having to pry them apart.

[maple flats]

Some do, some don't fit. A few years ago, I started buying SS cam locks from Pro Flow www.proflowdynamics.com I use SS ones, but they also offer Aluminum or plastic. The SS are quite reasonably priced and they ship fast.

[morningstarfarm]

One more note on the check valve..you have to use the flapper type..the spring loaded ones won't work...put it in so that the sap pumping up closes the valve ..then when the pump shuts off it opens and lets air in so the sap can run down the line..good luck

[mudr]

Thanks again guys. Another question. I see some guys run 3/4 and 1 inch wireless. My pump out line will be 300 ft of 1 in. Can I go wireless in this scenario? I feel like it would be an easier install, scratching my head how to wire tie 1 inch line to high tensile strung up in the trees.

[WESTMAPLES]

i would hang it with wire no matter what size tubing, IME hanging any size tubing without wire , everytime it gets warm it will stretch and sag... i know you said it is a pump line ... but if sap or no sap goes throught it it will sag after everytime you fix it . for hanging it either use a ladder and a friend help you get the tubing up to the wire or get the high tensile the right length and lower it down to ground level , tie the tubing to it then hang it back up. ive done it both ways and they both have there pros and cons. set it up decent the first time, then all you will have to do is tweak it in the coming years .

[morningstarfarm]

Not only would I wire it..I would double wire it with 2 ratchets..to install first tie it and tension it at mid chest level..now stretch and tie pipe to the two wires...next raise the pipe assembly to the working height and tension it...much easier than trying to tie it on a ladder..after tensioning it I would put posts in about every 10-12'..I use whatever is handy to cut...check your slope and nail the Wire to the posts..then retighten the ratchets..you want it as tight as you can possibly get it..may seem like overkill, but this line is the backbone to your whole system...good luck

[morningstarfarm]

Oh and I wouldn't go any smaller than 1" for the pipe...

[mudr]

1 inch is for the pump. 3/4 is the main. Given the lay of the land, I can only get ~100-115 taps on that run, thus 3/4. The rest of the trees will need a separate main going across the slope.

I played with an excel file from the usda-nrcs. You can input pump and output elevations, pipe diameter, pipe length, and pump curve data, and it help you calculate gpm. Yeah, 3/4 would have been very limiting (like 6 gpm). 1 inch line was like 15 gpm. 1.25 would have been great (like 28) but there was a significant increase in pipe cost. Figure I will run the 1 inch now, and if (when) I add the second line, just reuse the 1 inch pump line and get 1.25 for the pump.

[Hop Kiln Road]

mudr - I have a similar situation. Couple suggestions. Put in a 3/16 system and don't even use a 3/4 mainline. Ultimately you'll want a 1.5" line and a 2" pump or bring lots of reading material. And, you'll need an adequate collection tank (3 gal per tap if you're using 3/16) and a 55 gal barrel to drain the pump line into every night, then pump the barrel first the next day.

[mudr]

Hop kiln- thank you for the input. I may use it later but think I'm good for this setup. I don't have slope for 3/16, so it is 100 on gravity. I will have a little over 100 gal of storage, not ideal in the event of a record day, but safe for most "pretty good days". The numbers I crunched says I will get about 12-14 gpm pumping with my wx10 on 1 inch. So that is like 8 mins, not bad. Also, with the elevated pump line, I will only have +/-4 gallons coming back to me. I will carry that out in a pail.

In the event I add on, that 1 inch line will come down and be used as an actual mainline, and I will get 1.25 or 1.5 for pumping.