recommendations for growing?

[seandicare]

i've been going back and forth the past couple weeks on growing my maple syrup business. i was hoping for any input those that have gone through this can provide.

the lot i am tapping has between 3-400 trees and is about 2 miles from my house and evaporator. no slope for tubing nor electric for vacuum. right now i have a homemade evap made from a fuel oil tank and 5 steam table pans (not insulated or ramped yet) and i can get 5-6gal/hour evaporation with wood. i have 6 55 gal poly drums to use for storage and hauling.


option 1:
build a small pole barn (8x8) for a shelter about $400 and maybe convert evaporator to a gravity fed oil burner (found some ideas on youtube on that) and finish insulating and ramping evaporator. i figure that could give me upwards of 10/hr evap and producing around 15-20gal of syrup/season sold local retail.

option 2:
take option 1 and include a 45 gal/hr r/o (found one for $1500) this could up totals to around 75gals of syrup/season. but would have to buy a 55gal food barrel and sell some bulk as well as local retail.

option 3:
talk to the bank and finance about $10K and go balls to the wall.
i found a used D&G 18x63 fuel oil evaporator for $2800, then the r/o, filter press and other stuff (including a bigger shack).....i could get upwards of 150 gallons/season, but then would be oweing the bank for the next 5-10 years.

[BreezyHill]

The first thing you need to do is the market plan end of the business plan.

Where else can you sell retail or wholesale and last option is bulk. If you don't have a good handle on where you are going to sell it; do not make it.

After you have that figured out then this will likely tell you which option is the best one. Personally, don't go into debit unless you are willing to go from hobby to business operation.

Business does not have to mean no more fun, but it will mean a little more planning and possibly commitment in time to pay off the debit.

Good Luck!

[Maple Man 85]

Look at the scale of economy and see where the optimum return on investment is. My plan was to go all out, even though I am taking on more debt the return is quicker. Two good seasons=breakeven, five average seasons=breakeven. Not to mention everything after that is profit minus operation expense. The real question is how crazy are you about maple?!:mrgreen:

Maple Man 85

[Cody]

If there is a producer near by you could tap the woods, invest in vacuum,then sell your sap to them.You could keep some cook it off and market that.Save your money and see were it leads to.

[mainebackswoodssyrup]

Take the advice given and write a business plan or at least do some calculating to see what you are comfortable with. $10k isn't the end of the world, I've spent more on other hobbies. But plan it out and be smart about it. We work for a guy who has 150k invested and figures at least 25k was spent doing things the wrong way. Not pennies and it can add up quick.

[seandicare]

thanks for the tips guys.....i can say i am pretty well hooked....went and saw a guy i went to school with......he is actually tapping 3,500 trees on the backside of where i am tapping (adjacent properties) he has a "HUGE" set up, and i had helped him boil a couple hours one day, and really wanted to get set up like his, but NO WAY IN HECK would i be able to afford that any time soon. lol

Maple Man 85, that is about where my option 2 came in......i have an investment maturing this summer and figured i could take some of that for the r/o, which would probably give me my biggest jump in production at the lowest cost.

[seandicare]

Take the advice given and write a business plan or at least do some calculating to see what you are comfortable with. $10k isn't the end of the world, I've spent more on other hobbies. But plan it out and be smart about it. We work for a guy who has 150k invested and figures at least 25k was spent doing things the wrong way. Not pennies and it can add up quick.

the calculating is how i came up with these plans......may not be a full business plan as of yet, but if i do go option 3 i'm going to have to get everything down for the bank anyways.

this isn't the first hobby i tried turning into a business. i started trapping about 15 years ago thinking i might be able to make something at it. though it did get a return it was no where near what i invested. i am thinking that syrup might get me closer to an actual break even return at least (if done right.) that is why i love this site. i would be able to see where other's had made the mistakes and learn from them, as well as share my own for others to learn from.

[Cedar Eater]

I didn't see anybody suggest the first thing that I would look into, the cost of compliance with state regulations. I'm not familiar with your state's laws, but I don't think an 8X8 sugar house could contain enough to comply with my state's regulations. You also have to worry about your local permitting authority.

[seandicare]

I didn't see anybody suggest the first thing that I would look into, the cost of compliance with state regulations. I'm not familiar with your state's laws, but I don't think an 8X8 sugar house could contain enough to comply with my state's regulations. You also have to worry about your local permitting authority.

for the most part from what i have been finding, NY is pretty lax so far.........even the shack, as long as not permantly built, can get around building permit (probably look into get one anyways.)

[MapleMark753]

What are your sales? Do current sales support your expanding? If so, go for it, and more! If not, don't do it now, maybe later.
Are future sales reasonable expectations? Will you be able to sell all your hard won syrup?
IF you're looking at it as a business (not just a cool, fun, addicting hobby) sales and reasonably predictable expanded sales should drive your expansion for the next and subsequent years.
The steam pan deal works, but is wholly inadequate for a maple business in my experience. I'd get a maple evaporator quick.
These are just my quick thoughts, good luck!
take care, Mark

[Bucket Head]

All good advice above. Quite a bit to consider between hobby and business.

I've gone from hobby to a small profit making business and have not regretted it. I wish it could be more profitable, but I also wish I had back the thousands I've spent in the past on "hobbies" that were fun, but didn't earn a dime. Ten grand isn't much to finance and you could probably sell the equipment you purchase and make much of it back should you decide later to not produce syrup.

Maple syrup is the first "hobby" I've played with that made money. Go spend ten grand on a boat or snowmobile and in ten years see where you are with that. I've had a lot of neat toys over the years but the maple equipment is pretty practical in my eyes now.

Good luck with the expansion.

Steve

[seandicare]

Well after running things over and talking to the boss of the house, I have decided to go with option one this year.

After a rough couple years financially we are going to wait until things are a little better for big investments.

I will put up small shack, but will stay with wood. The designs for oil just weren't working for me right now.

I am considering converting from the steam pans to a 2x5 or 3x5 continuous flow flat pan


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